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Squalor
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey Jones h-bars users:

Are all of you guys just buying a stem that is 10-20mm longer to adjust for the bars?

I was thinking that a setback seatpost (moving from thomson straight to Moots setback...about 20mm setback) might be just as effective, and allow my weight to get a litte further over the back wheel, thereby allowing for better traction while climbing.

I just am not sure that I am ready to move to a 130mm stem. (I use a 110x15 right now)

Somebody set me straight if my logic is not right.

LP

PS - This is really just an excuse to justify buying another Moots setback post :D
 

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Recovering couch patato
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There's more room for adjustment in the seat alone than between the two seatposts. You could most probably get the Moots, slap the seat 20mm forward on it, and maintain the same seating position.

I came from 11º bars, and for the 34º increased backsweep, 20mm of extra Thomson (120>140mm) did the trick. Prepare to maybe want a spacer under the stem with the H. I used to want my 5º stem flipped for racing, with the H-bar I suffice with the normal +5º.
 

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Squalor
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I guess the root of my question is if 20mm setback at the seatpost end has the same overall affect as a 20mm extension at the stem end.

And if not, what are the differences? Steering implications, knee position over spindle maybe?

Maybe I should just buy a longer stem and forget it..(it would definately be cheaper)

LP
 

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Recovering couch patato
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I sometrimes dicide it's better for me to sit further back. But then, there's probably a reason I'm not.

Yes, sitting back will give you traction, easy wheelies, low-rpm power. But also lighter (less stable?) front, more forced standing climbs (suggesting gears), and increased muscle fatigue.
My best bet is that 20mm back means 10mm of knee-spindle. But then, I don't care for (or manage to understand) that rule of thumb.

You could also, before you mount the H-bar, throw on a random 90mm stem, slap back the saddle and see what happens.
 

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I just went through this after switching to an H bar. Short answer: you will need at least 10mm more stem length, possibly more than that, because you end up riding on the back of the bars most of the time.

As has been stated on this forum; adjust your seat in relation to your pedals, after that you can adjust cockpit size with different length stems.

I went from a 105mm x 25 to a 110mm x 15. I started with the flat portion fo the bars a bit lower than the seat, which is how I usually run a flat bar. Didn't feel too good. Front end was lifting on steep climbs.

Went to a longer stem,120mm x 15, & raised the stem up so that the flat part of the bars was level with the seat. Much better.

Jeff Jones suggested that I set the pitch of the bars at a steeper angle. This made all the difference. They are now at about the same angle as the stem when viewed from the side.

good luck!
 

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lanpope said:
Hey Jones h-bars users:

Are all of you guys just buying a stem that is 10-20mm longer to adjust for the bars?

I was thinking that a setback seatpost (moving from thomson straight to Moots setback...about 20mm setback) might be just as effective, and allow my weight to get a litte further over the back wheel, thereby allowing for better traction while climbing.

I just am not sure that I am ready to move to a 130mm stem. (I use a 110x15 right now)

Somebody set me straight if my logic is not right.

LP

PS - This is really just an excuse to justify buying another Moots setback post :D
I went longer by 20mm, but also higher rise by 10 degrees to make up for the loss of my previous riser bar.

This table might help, if you don't already have it:
 

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Premium Member
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lanpope said:
I guess the root of my question is if 20mm setback at the seatpost end has the same overall affect as a 20mm extension at the stem end.

LP
No. The lay back post will totally change your weight balance over the bike.
 

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Squalor
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
the_eleven said:
I just went through this after switching to an H bar. Short answer: you will need at least 10mm more stem length, possibly more than that, because you end up riding on the back of the bars most of the time.

As has been stated on this forum; adjust your seat in relation to your pedals, after that you can adjust cockpit size with different length stems.

I went from a 105mm x 25 to a 110mm x 15. I started with the flat portion fo the bars a bit lower than the seat, which is how I usually run a flat bar. Didn't feel too good. Front end was lifting on steep climbs.

Went to a longer stem,120mm x 15, & raised the stem up so that the flat part of the bars was level with the seat. Much better.

Jeff Jones suggested that I set the pitch of the bars at a steeper angle. This made all the difference. They are now at about the same angle as the stem when viewed from the side.

good luck!
Thanks - That is the info I was looking for. I am using a bar with a 1" rise right now, so it sounds like I am going to need a longer and steeper stem

LP
 

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Squalor
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Nat said:
I went longer by 20mm, but also higher rise by 10 degrees to make up for the loss of my previous riser bar.

This table might help, if you don't already have it:
Whoa...great chart. I have always used bike cad to mess with this stuff, but this chart will be super useful. Thanks again.

LP
 

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Squalor
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
shiggy said:
No. The lay back post will totally change your weight balance over the bike.
Understood, but won't the longer stem do the same thing? I guess not if the effective grip position stays the same with the new h-bar.

The reason I ask, is because on another one of my bikes (with a slightly shorter TT than the monkey - 23.8 vs. 24.3) I just never felt right, regardless of what stem I used. I put the Moots layback post on it from a Thomson, and went with a medium length (of what I had been trying) 120mm stem, and the bike all of a sudden felt perfect.

All of this "feeling" stuff is not too scientific is it?

My monkey has always felt right, but I thought...you never know unless you try...

LP

PS - I took the monkey out today for the first time in a while, and man does that bike ride nice w/ the exi up front! Good times!
 

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Steamroller
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I went 20mm longer and 10 degrees up

That seems to be a pretty common adjustment. It can be accomplished in other ways though, my new bike was designed around using an H-bar with a 110x15 thomson stem, meaning if I ever ditched it I would run probablya 90x5 stem. This was very deliberate putting me in what I personally feel is the ideal stem length range either way.
 

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Cold. Blue. Steel.
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1,709 Posts
What about...

standing up??
that is one of the main reasons you need the longer stem with rise.
your saddle position isn't going to do you much good when you aren't sitting on it. you need more room in your cockpit for standing and holding the rear of the bars.
as shiggy said, don't mess with your saddle to adjust your bars. that is what your stem is for. plus, your saddle-to-pedal relationship is very, very important for efficiency, comfort and the health of you knees and legs.

if you spent "2 hun" on the bars, go all the way and get a proper stem, too. ;)
 

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Squalor
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1,573 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
OneGearGuy said:
(what about) standing up??

if you spent "2 hun" on the bars, go all the way and get a proper stem, too. ;)
Good point about standing up. I always climb out of the saddle, had not thought of the impact there.

I think I will actually come out cheaper buying the proper stem vs the Moots layback...Hey, I can tell my wife that I saved money - shes played that gave before...

Thanks guys

LP
 

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Cold. Blue. Steel.
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lanpope said:
Good point about standing up. I always climb out of the saddle, had not thought of the impact there.

I think I will actually come out cheaper buying the proper stem vs the Moots layback...Hey, I can tell my wife that I saved money - shes played that gave before...

Thanks guys

LP
Saved money $$ !!
now you are thinking. i gotta go call the girlfriend and explain how my 160 clam H-bar actually isn't that expensive, hahahaha. i love these forums- we get to share our genius 24/7! :cool:
don't forget to shoot some pics so we can see how your ride is looking (you know, that cheap bike of yours :p ).
OGG
 

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Cold. Blue. Steel.
Joined
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1,709 Posts
lanpope said:
Good point about standing up. I always climb out of the saddle, had not thought of the impact there.

I think I will actually come out cheaper buying the proper stem vs the Moots layback...Hey, I can tell my wife that I saved money - shes played that gave before...

Thanks guys

LP
Saved money $$ !!
now you are thinking. i gotta go call the girlfrien and explain how my 160 clam H-bar actually isn't that expensive, hahahaha. i love these forums- we get to share our genius 24/7! :cool:
don't forget to shoot some pics so we can see how your ride is looking (you know, that cheap bike of yours :p ).
OGG
 

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Registered
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I'm running a 105 mm 5 deg rise. I had the bike built with the h bar in mind. I put it on my fisher and only needed an extra 10 mm. If anything you'll need some extra height, stack, angle, whatever.

e
 

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Premium Member
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lanpope said:
Understood, but won't the longer stem do the same thing? I guess not if the effective grip position stays the same with the new h-bar.
If your hands are in the same position it does not matter how they got there.

The reason I ask, is because on another one of my bikes (with a slightly shorter TT than the monkey - 23.8 vs. 24.3) I just never felt right, regardless of what stem I used. I put the Moots layback post on it from a Thomson, and went with a medium length (of what I had been trying) 120mm stem, and the bike all of a sudden felt perfect.

All of this "feeling" stuff is not too scientific is it?

My monkey has always felt right, but I thought...you never know unless you try...
Different geometry, different fit, different weight distribution.

Since your KM feels right you want/need to keep the same position on/over the bike.
 

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Squalor
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1,573 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 ·
OneGearGuy said:
Saved money $$ !!
now you are thinking. i gotta go call the girlfrien and explain how my 160 clam H-bar actually isn't that expensive, hahahaha. i love these forums- we get to share our genius 24/7! :cool:
don't forget to shoot some pics so we can see how your ride is looking (you know, that cheap bike of yours :p ).
OGG
We'll do. The IF is actually about to have some work done, so I think the bars will be on the SS monkey for a while. I ride that bike more anyway!

LP
 
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