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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
A little background:

I've been riding a 2010 Mojo SL for a little less than a year. I'm from Nor Cal and I've taken the Mojo all over California and Ashland. I've ridden Ashland, Downieville, SLO, Tahoe, Annadel, Santa Cruz, JMP in Oakland, etc, etc. I had it built up for more aggresive trail riding as I do a bit of climbing, but I like to rip downhill the best :D

The Mojo SL was a good mule for the time being, but honestly its really just a long travel, lightweight XC machine, quite versatile but has many shortcomings as you start pushing the envelope riding downhill. Its awesome as an all-arounder and still is a great bike, but if you favor going down more than up, the HD is where its at.




(both pics taken at Toads in Tahoe)

Ever since the release of the HD, I've been drooling big time to get one and finally I got the call from Wade over at Spokesman Cycles in Santacruz, saying that he just received a white Mojo HD in size XL!. Wade is who I got my original SL from and like Ibis, has always done me well.

Now originally I was holding out for the Matte Black, as it looks so sleek and sexy and I was tired of owning a white mountain bike. However I just couldn't pass up the chance at getting my hands on this HD frame and it turns out the white and black is pretty bad ass.

When I first heard about the Mojo HD I thought that idea was interesting, but what was the point of buying a whole other frame and have the same exact travel? That was until I looked into it some more. By going with the HD140 I am using all my same parts including my 150mm Fox 32 Float. Not only that but I have a way stiffer frame, that's longer and is slacker but without much weight penalty and even more important it still has a low center of gravity due to not needing extra bottom bracket height (ground clearance) from the added travel of160mm (which is what normal Mojo HD's have) So now I'm sitting on a 28.5 ilb corner carving, singe track eating machine.



"By simply changing out the upper shock mounts (we're calling them Limbo Chips) and substituting a shock from the Mojo or Mojo SL (7.875" x 2" travel vs 8.5" x 2.5" for the HD), travel is reduced to 140mm"

Since my old Mojo SL shock had already been custom tuned by PUSH industries, I used that shock on the new Mojo HD frame, and kept the longer travel RP23 that came on the Mojo HD for later use if I want to step up the travel on the bike. Smart eh? :p And really most of the riding I do "could warrant" the extra 20mm of travel of the normal HD but really its not necessary.

Downhill:

Damn this thing is stiff, makes the old Mojo feel like a noodle, no wonder everyone says the Mojo is so flexy, after riding a beefy HD its pretty obvious. It is much more stable as well, like Dan said "this bike is like a missle" Thanks to the longer wheelbase, slacker head tube and seat tube angle, no longer do you have to feel like you're riding on the edge, pushing the limits when downhilling. The old Mojo was so squirrely with such a short wheelbase that it felt like the thing had a mind of its own on fast descents. The HD is point and shoot and instills more confidence and less "oh shyt" moments. Jumps and lips are easier too. On the old Mojo, with its XC geometry I always felt like I had to really pump the front and drop my ass back when hitting lips or jumping, on the HD I need less drastic body english and the bike just sucks it up. Landings are much more predictable as well, as the bike does not flex and go wherever it wants off-line. I found my major complaint with the old SL was that it didn't hold a line well, and changing directions while picking new lines never felt inspiring, as I never felt connected with the bike. The HD has completely solved these issues.

Cornering

is ever so sweet on this thing too; Slack(er), low, light, and stable. Even though the Head Tube angle only slackens 1 degree to 68, from the old Mojo's 69HA. But it definitely makes a difference, you can load up the frontend by putting more weight on it, without the fear of tucking the front, this was HUGE for me, I can't wait to get an angleset and get this bad boy down to a 67HA. Rear wheel Cutty slides are easier since the rear is so much more stout from the beefier links, stronger swingarm, and 12mm Through Axle. It whips out more predictably and with less effort, on demand. Out of all things improved, this by far put the biggest smile on my face, flying through turns on rails, comfortably.

Climbing:

Just swapping frames, I went from 27.95 ilbs to 28.5ilbs (remember this is a XL). Everything stayed the same except for the headset and cables. The first thing I noticed about the HD140 is that it feels as if there is much more antisquat built into the rear suspension. On the old Mojo SL I ran 166-170 PSI with me weighing in at roughly 180ilbs. To achieve %30 sag on the HD I'm running a hair below 150psi! I'm wondering if this has to do with the shorter shock putting the frame more into the progressiveness of the travel OR if it just has more antisquat built in. Either way the rear feels noticably more firm, less bob but also less small bump compliancy. The stiffer platform makes for better out of the saddle climbing, however I do feel as if it takes away some of the small bump characteristics that the original Mojo was so famous for. My feeling is that this is better for high speed descending as you don't blow through the travel and bottom out as easy. The compromise is that you feel a bit more from the rearend at slower speeds.

Right now my Push'd rear Fox RP23 is tuned for plush, using a .1400 compression shim stack, Push told me back when I had it tuned that I could have it retuned even more plush by going with a .1200 shim stack. I believe this is the right direction, with the increased anti squat it would make sense that you would need even less compression valving. I might just send this shock back to Push in the near future to see the difference.

I'm not sure if its the increase 1/2 pound of weight from the frame swap, or the reduction in plushness but the bike does seem a little more "dead" when pedaling. Almost feels like when you swap to a heavier set of tires and the bike feels a bit more bogged down. I'm thinking its from the added weight and I'm not too concerned about it but I did feel like I was not keeping the same momentum on climbs with the equal amount of output on my usual climbs. Not a huge concern for me, but it is an observation. Its not a significant difference and I'm not entering into XC races with this bike so I'm not very concerned. If I cared about that I'd take off the nearly 1000 gram front tire I'm running ;)

Some other things I noticed while assembling the bike was the improved cable routing, it makes so much more sense now and is more inconspicous and functional. The added downtube cable protector is a nice touch as well. The suspension links seem much, much more robust as well as just about every piece of the frame. I'm diggin the dimples in the rear chainstay to increase tire clearance and avoid tire rub there, which I used to get on the old frame all the time.

And if you're wondering how I have Haven's on this bike since this frame uses a 12mm TA, its because my rear hub is convertible between standard QR and 12mm TA, all the new Haven's and Havocs will have this feature, which is totally awesome and works flawlessly in both configurations







Since the slacker head tube angle felt so good, in the near future I"m going to purchase a Cane Creek Anglest so I can slacken it out one more degree to be on par with the Mojo HD160. That should really be the icing on the cake, I'll definitely update when I do.
 

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Yody said:
Damn this thing is stiff, makes the old Mojo feel like a noodle, no wonder everyone says the Mojo is so flexy, after riding a beefy HD its pretty obvious.
completely agreed. It's night and day.

good review, enjoy the bike!

perfect tire setup too, run the same on mine and its rips!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)
redmr2_man said:
completely agreed. It's night and day.

good review, enjoy the bike!

perfect tire setup too, run the same on mine and its rips!
Please,please,please don't let this turn into another mojo flexy thread, for the love of god :p

The mojo sl has an amount of flexiness that is fine for its intended uses, considering how lightweight the frame is. This HD is on a whole nother level though, huge improvement if you don't mind the added weight.

Only complaint I have on these tires, is that the 50a durameter rubber doesn't last at all, this is my 2nd mutano 2.2 and the knobs keep getting to the point where they look like they're gonna tear off. Sliding the rear doesnt' help but I just don't think these things are any good for hardpack or rocks. The 2.3 WW isn't as bad but you can see signs of deterioration on the outer knobs too, just not as bad.

Oh and thanks, my thoughts are a little scatter brain but I don't have all night to compose a masterpiece :)
 

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www.derbyrims.com
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Nice bike!

Great review too.

I take that you were not able to gain bottom travel as easily as the SL?

That much lower psi with the same 140mm travel, shock, and build has me thinking it is both stiffer vertically and less rising, more linear rate in shallow to mid travel than the SL and C.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
derby said:
Nice bike!

Great review too.

I take that you were not able to gain bottom travel as easily as the SL?

That much lower psi with the same 140mm travel, shock, and build has me thinking it is both stiffer vertically and less rising, more linear rate in shallow to mid travel than the SL and C.
I've bottomed it out just as often as the SL, however it feels as if there is way more midstroke support, so it bottoms out with way more resistance. Feels much more controlled, like its just barely using full travel where the SL you could FEEL it bottoming. I suppose you could say that is the same as not bottoming as easily.
 

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How's the BB height? Are you striking pedals often? I'm curious how much (if at all) an Angleset will further drop the BB.

Just realized the Angleset requires a straight 1 1/8" steerer, I was planning on using a tapered. Hmmm, what to do.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
NoahColorado said:
How's the BB height? Are you striking pedals often? I'm curious how much (if at all) an Angleset will further drop the BB.

Just realized the Angleset requires a straight 1 1/8" steerer, I was planning on using a tapered. Hmmm, what to do.
Yeah I'm getting pedal strikes on rocky terrain, I used to get them on the SL also, just a small compromise in my book like anything else.

Yup angleset requires the 1 1/8" which is exactly what I have :D I dont' think that it will lower the BB much at all, possibly a tiny bit, but I was wondering about that as well. If anything that will be a good thing, just gotta watch those pedals more often.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Also just got off the phone with PUSH, they're going to be testing a Mojo HD soon enough, so I'll get some solid feedback on what diretion to go with the shock. One thing they did mention is that so far they've found the Mojo HD to be perfect for a coil shock, in fact they said it almost seems MADE for a coil.
 

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Yody said:
One thing they did mention is that so far they've found the Mojo HD to be perfect for a coil shock, in fact they said it almost seems MADE for a coil.
That's great news! The Vivid they are selling looks to be the route I'll be going.
Did they mention when they think they'll be able to put together a kit for it?
 

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Village Idiot
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Yody said:
Also just got off the phone with PUSH, they're going to be testing a Mojo HD soon enough, so I'll get some solid feedback on what diretion to go with the shock. One thing they did mention is that so far they've found the Mojo HD to be perfect for a coil shock, in fact they said it almost seems MADE for a coil.
Coil shock for the 140 would be awesome
 

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Yody said:
A little background:

I've been riding a 2010 Mojo SL for a little less than a year. I'm from Nor Cal and I've taken the Mojo all over California and Ashland. I've ridden Ashland, Downieville, SLO, Tahoe, Annadel, Santa Cruz, JMP in Oakland, etc, etc. I had it built up for more aggresive trail riding as I do a bit of climbing, but I like to rip downhill the best :D

The Mojo SL was a good mule for the time being, but honestly its really just a long travel, lightweight XC machine, quite versatile but has many shortcomings as you start pushing the envelope riding downhill. Its awesome as an all-arounder and still is a great bike, but if you favor going down more than up, the HD is where its at.




(both pics taken at Toads in Tahoe)

Ever since the release of the HD, I've been drooling big time to get one and finally I got the call from Wade over at Spokesman Cycles in Santacruz, saying that he just received a white Mojo HD in size XL!. Wade is who I got my original SL from and like Ibis, has always done me well.

Now originally I was holding out for the Matte Black, as it looks so sleek and sexy and I was tired of owning a white mountain bike. However I just couldn't pass up the chance at getting my hands on this HD frame and it turns out the white and black is pretty bad ass.

When I first heard about the Mojo HD I thought that idea was interesting, but what was the point of buying a whole other frame and have the same exact travel? That was until I looked into it some more. By going with the HD140 I am using all my same parts including my 150mm Fox 32 Float. Not only that but I have a way stiffer frame, that's longer and is slacker but without much weight penalty and even more important it still has a low center of gravity due to not needing extra bottom bracket height (ground clearance) from the added travel of160mm (which is what normal Mojo HD's have) So now I'm sitting on a 28.5 ilb corner carving, singe track eating machine.



"By simply changing out the upper shock mounts (we're calling them Limbo Chips) and substituting a shock from the Mojo or Mojo SL (7.875" x 2" travel vs 8.5" x 2.5" for the HD), travel is reduced to 140mm"

Since my old Mojo SL shock had already been custom tuned by PUSH industries, I used that shock on the new Mojo HD frame, and kept the longer travel RP23 that came on the Mojo HD for later use if I want to step up the travel on the bike. Smart eh? :p And really most of the riding I do "could warrant" the extra 20mm of travel of the normal HD but really its not necessary.

Downhill:

Damn this thing is stiff, makes the old Mojo feel like a noodle, no wonder everyone says the Mojo is so flexy, after riding a beefy HD its pretty obvious. It is much more stable as well, like Dan said "this bike is like a missle" Thanks to the longer wheelbase, slacker head tube and seat tube angle, no longer do you have to feel like you're riding on the edge, pushing the limits when downhilling. The old Mojo was so squirrely with such a short wheelbase that it felt like the thing had a mind of its own on fast descents. The HD is point and shoot and instills more confidence and less "oh shyt" moments. Jumps and lips are easier too. On the old Mojo, with its XC geometry I always felt like I had to really pump the front and drop my ass back when hitting lips or jumping, on the HD I need less drastic body english and the bike just sucks it up. Landings are much more predictable as well, as the bike does not flex and go wherever it wants off-line. I found my major complaint with the old SL was that it didn't hold a line well, and changing directions while picking new lines never felt inspiring, as I never felt connected with the bike. The HD has completely solved these issues.

Cornering

is ever so sweet on this thing too; Slack(er), low, light, and stable. Even though the Head Tube angle only slackens 1 degree to 68, from the old Mojo's 69HA. But it definitely makes a difference, you can load up the frontend by putting more weight on it, without the fear of tucking the front, this was HUGE for me, I can't wait to get an angleset and get this bad boy down to a 67HA. Rear wheel Cutty slides are easier since the rear is so much more stout from the beefier links, stronger swingarm, and 12mm Through Axle. It whips out more predictably and with less effort, on demand. Out of all things improved, this by far put the biggest smile on my face, flying through turns on rails, comfortably.

Climbing:

Just swapping frames, I went from 27.95 ilbs to 28.5ilbs (remember this is a XL). Everything stayed the same except for the headset and cables. The first thing I noticed about the HD140 is that it feels as if there is much more antisquat built into the rear suspension. On the old Mojo SL I ran 166-170 PSI with me weighing in at roughly 180ilbs. To achieve %30 sag on the HD I'm running a hair below 150psi! I'm wondering if this has to do with the shorter shock putting the frame more into the progressiveness of the travel OR if it just has more antisquat built in. Either way the rear feels noticably more firm, less bob but also less small bump compliancy. The stiffer platform makes for better out of the saddle climbing, however I do feel as if it takes away some of the small bump characteristics that the original Mojo was so famous for. My feeling is that this is better for high speed descending as you don't blow through the travel and bottom out as easy. The compromise is that you feel a bit more from the rearend at slower speeds.

Right now my Push'd rear Fox RP23 is tuned for plush, using a .1400 compression shim stack, Push told me back when I had it tuned that I could have it retuned even more plush by going with a .1200 shim stack. I believe this is the right direction, with the increased anti squat it would make sense that you would need even less compression valving. I might just send this shock back to Push in the near future to see the difference.

I'm not sure if its the increase 1/2 pound of weight from the frame swap, or the reduction in plushness but the bike does seem a little more "dead" when pedaling. Almost feels like when you swap to a heavier set of tires and the bike feels a bit more bogged down. I'm thinking its from the added weight and I'm not too concerned about it but I did feel like I was not keeping the same momentum on climbs with the equal amount of output on my usual climbs. Not a huge concern for me, but it is an observation. Its not a significant difference and I'm not entering into XC races with this bike so I'm not very concerned. If I cared about that I'd take off the nearly 1000 gram front tire I'm running ;)

Some other things I noticed while assembling the bike was the improved cable routing, it makes so much more sense now and is more inconspicous and functional. The added downtube cable protector is a nice touch as well. The suspension links seem much, much more robust as well as just about every piece of the frame. I'm diggin the dimples in the rear chainstay to increase tire clearance and avoid tire rub there, which I used to get on the old frame all the time.

And if you're wondering how I have Haven's on this bike since this frame uses a 12mm TA, its because my rear hub is convertible between standard QR and 12mm TA, all the new Haven's and Havocs will have this feature, which is totally awesome and works flawlessly in both configurations







Since the slacker head tube angle felt so good, in the near future I"m going to purchase a Cane Creek Anglest so I can slacken it out one more degree to be on par with the Mojo HD160. That should really be the icing on the cake, I'll definitely update when I do.
Yody - nice write up..:thumbsup: how tall are you - it will help me with my frame size selection I like the geo of the XL. thanks
 

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gnuH
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dbuilt said:
Yody - nice write up..:thumbsup: how tall are you - it will help me with my frame size selection I like the geo of the XL. thanks
You could have said that without repeating the entire original post. Just saying...
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
dbuilt said:
Yody - nice write up..:thumbsup: how tall are you - it will help me with my frame size selection I like the geo of the XL. thanks
I'm 6'2"", even if I was 6" I'd buy an XL. I'm currently running a 70mm stem and feel like its the shortest I can go.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
biclas said:
Hi Yody
Nice bike.
I have an Mojo SL and I'm thinking on the HD 140.
One question: I have the Easton Haven wheels and the rear one is QR. How did you convert them to 12mm?
Its a newer style hub, I believe 2011 hubs should start coming with it. Not %100 sure on that but I know the 2010 wheels don't have that option.
 

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Yody - thanks for excellent mini comparison review indeed. Have been longing for someone to made & report the comparison, as I've been slowly saving up to go for the SL. The new HD140 option is a nice problem to have, and your review help to nail the decision.

How much of climbing efficiency loss would you have estimated in your typical trail? You mention not significant but appreciate some rough figure if possible. I'm pretty bad with climbing uphill among my buddies, though thoroughly enjoying the downhill :)..

Would the HD140 take the Fox RPL or DT Swiss shock with lockout as in SL? or just the standard RP23 only?
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
dolp2898 said:
Yody - thanks for excellent mini comparison review indeed. Have been longing for someone to made & report the comparison, as I've been slowly saving up to go for the SL. The new HD140 option is a nice problem to have, and your review help to nail the decision.

How much of climbing efficiency loss would you have estimated in your typical trail? You mention not significant but appreciate some rough figure if possible. I'm pretty bad with climbing uphill among my buddies, though thoroughly enjoying the downhill :)..

Would the HD140 take the Fox RPL or DT Swiss shock with lockout as in SL? or just the standard RP23 only?
Not too bad, but with the slacker geometry your positioned farther over the back wheel and I think this has something to do with the feeling of less efficiency. If you do a lot of standing out of the saddle, I think this bike could actually be better considering it bobs less.

I'm running a heavier set of tires, not the worst but Im sure with a lighter set it would feel faster for sure, I could easily drop nearly a pound of weight if I went with a set of 600 gram tires like a WTB mutano 2.4 non tcs. Plus climbing is all about the person pedaling, all of these bikes pedal awesome. Again if you're more of a climber the SL is an awesome bike that descends really well, but if you want the next level downhilling the Mojo HD is where its at.

Not sure on the shocks, but you don't need a lockout or a propedal on these bikes, that won't do anything for you.
 
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