[ManbIKE]

And I wanted to add my 2 cents. I really would prefer if this didnt' start another round of ripping on Ellsworth or any other company or person... In fact I'd rather people viewed this post and didn't reply. But whatever.

When I read posts like these, where at least 5 people I recognize from mtbr (pinkbike, hcor, ridemonkey, and others) piss and moan to no end about a company's problems, I feel sick. I don't get on the forum too often because of this, and primarily limit myself to reading the passion forum, lets talk shocks and occasionally one or two others.

Here is why I feel sick. It makes a newcomer think there is no hope in cycling. That all mountain bikers are like these guys. But, these are people who would rather complain than ride. These are people who buy all the latest, greatest parts for their niche and then nitpick them to death. They are the people who spend hours on the forums rather than hours pushing themselves to ride better, those who would rather be a loud-mouthed curmudgeon with an unfounded sense of self-worth than a seasoned cyclist who is strong, smart, and flows like you and I wish we could. Guys who would rather park at the trailhead and define which category of riding they fit into best rather than go out and see how good they can be at all types of riding.

These people are not cyclists. They are not my friends. They are not of any consequence.

For those still reading, I am about to give some advice. If you are fuming mad about what I had to say about your posts, please stop reading.





Advice: Get out and ride. Every epic ride is a lifetime of learning. Every 30 minute ride on the way home from work through an paved wasteland is an adventure even if you never set a wheel on dirt (case in point: I learned bunnyhop kickflips, bunnyhop nose bonks, and fakie wallrides last summer just because I spend an extra 15 minutes on the way to work every day. Guess what...I don't need a street bike to do it! I can do it on everyone of my mountain bikes)! You don't need to say you are a freerider or an XC weenie or a roadie convert or a trials rider. You can be all of these. You are still reading...you have hope, you have potential. Get out and prove it to yourself. Get aggro. Get strong. Go where you never have.

Don't listen to these folks...they will never be what you can.

 

[Fett]

While I agree with much of what you wrote, many of the people here who are spending long hours on the forum instead of riding, do so under the constraint of gainful employment. I do not get on the forums very often except when I have downtime at work. I think alot of other people are the same way. It is not a choice between riding and being on the forum. I have to be at my desk and computer in order to have a job to support my family and the sport that I love. MTBR is a way to give me a fix during the weekdays until I can get out on my bike after work or on the weekends.

And I wanted to add my 2 cents. I really would prefer if this didnt' start another round of ripping on Ellsworth or any other company or person... In fact I'd rather people viewed this post and didn't reply. But whatever.

When I read posts like these, where at least 5 people I recognize from mtbr (pinkbike, hcor, ridemonkey, and others) piss and moan to no end about a company's problems, I feel sick. I don't get on the forum too often because of this, and primarily limit myself to reading the passion forum, lets talk shocks and occasionally one or two others.

Here is why I feel sick. It makes a newcomer think there is no hope in cycling. That all mountain bikers are like these guys. But, these are people who would rather complain than ride. These are people who buy all the latest, greatest parts for their niche and then nitpick them to death. They are the people who spend hours on the forums rather than hours pushing themselves to ride better, those who would rather be a loud-mouthed curmudgeon with an unfounded sense of self-worth than a seasoned cyclist who is strong, smart, and flows like you and I wish we could. Guys who would rather park at the trailhead and define which category of riding they fit into best rather than go out and see how good they can be at all types of riding.

These people are not cyclists. They are not my friends. They are not of any consequence.

For those still reading, I am about to give some advice. If you are fuming mad about what I had to say about your posts, please stop reading.





Advice: Get out and ride. Every epic ride is a lifetime of learning. Every 30 minute ride on the way home from work through an paved wasteland is an adventure even if you never set a wheel on dirt (case in point: I learned bunnyhop kickflips, bunnyhop nose bonks, and fakie wallrides last summer just because I spend an extra 15 minutes on the way to work every day. Guess what...I don't need a street bike to do it! I can do it on everyone of my mountain bikes)! You don't need to say you are a freerider or an XC weenie or a roadie convert or a trials rider. You can be all of these. You are still reading...you have hope, you have potential. Get out and prove it to yourself. Get aggro. Get strong. Go where you never have.

Don't listen to these folks...they will never be what you can.

 

[Pete]

And I wanted to add my 2 cents. I really would prefer if this didnt' start another round of ripping on Ellsworth or any other company or person... In fact I'd rather people viewed this post and didn't reply. But whatever.

When I read posts like these, where at least 5 people I recognize from mtbr (pinkbike, hcor, ridemonkey, and others) piss and moan to no end about a company's problems, I feel sick. I don't get on the forum too often because of this, and primarily limit myself to reading the passion forum, lets talk shocks and occasionally one or two others.

Here is why I feel sick. It makes a newcomer think there is no hope in cycling. That all mountain bikers are like these guys. But, these are people who would rather complain than ride. These are people who buy all the latest, greatest parts for their niche and then nitpick them to death. They are the people who spend hours on the forums rather than hours pushing themselves to ride better, those who would rather be a loud-mouthed curmudgeon with an unfounded sense of self-worth than a seasoned cyclist who is strong, smart, and flows like you and I wish we could. Guys who would rather park at the trailhead and define which category of riding they fit into best rather than go out and see how good they can be at all types of riding.

These people are not cyclists. They are not my friends. They are not of any consequence.

For those still reading, I am about to give some advice. If you are fuming mad about what I had to say about your posts, please stop reading.





Advice: Get out and ride. Every epic ride is a lifetime of learning. Every 30 minute ride on the way home from work through an paved wasteland is an adventure even if you never set a wheel on dirt (case in point: I learned bunnyhop kickflips, bunnyhop nose bonks, and fakie wallrides last summer just because I spend an extra 15 minutes on the way to work every day. Guess what...I don't need a street bike to do it! I can do it on everyone of my mountain bikes)! You don't need to say you are a freerider or an XC weenie or a roadie convert or a trials rider. You can be all of these. You are still reading...you have hope, you have potential. Get out and prove it to yourself. Get aggro. Get strong. Go where you never have.

Don't listen to these folks...they will never be what you can.

That is hilarious!

The old "I don't like that you shared your Ellsworth experiences so you must not ride" idiocy.

Ah, I LOVE the smell of idiocy in the morning!

p.s. "I really would prefer if this didnt' start another round of ripping on Ellsworth or any other company or person..." How.........ironic.

 

[Hecubus]

While I didn't care much about the ellsworth thread I find your post to be the pointless one. What the heck does this have to do with anything? If someone feels the need to complain let them. For the most part I think there were a lot of valid arguments in there. They should be riding instead of complaining? What does that have to do with anything. I doubt most of those people are sitting here 24 hours a day, I'm sure they get to ride enough as well. Heck, or maybe, they're not riding because their bike is broken

 

[GEEI'MGROSS]

That is hilarious!

The old "I don't like that you shared your Ellsworth experiences so you must not ride" idiocy.

Ah, I LOVE the smell of idiocy in the morning!

p.s. "I really would prefer if this didnt' start another round of ripping on Ellsworth or any other company or person..." How.........ironic.

I think you missed the point. while manbike may have gone on about "get on your bike and ride" a bit much what i think he meant was, alot the threads that get alot of visibility are hotbeads of negativity, ("Ah, I LOVE the smell of idiocy in the morning!") and that repels would be newcomers to the sport. The more there are people riding trails, the healthier our sport. Giving possible newcomers to the sport the wrong idea about the kind of people that are mountain bikers only hurts us.
All the forums generally are really good and are used as the tool they were meant to be, riders helping other riders in whatever way they can, mechanical, advocacy, experience sharing etc. But i think we all need to make an effort to not let a thread degenerate into finger pointing, name calling and the like. it only hurts us all.

 

[Pete]

I think you missed the point. while manbike may have gone on about "get on your bike and ride" a bit much what i think he meant was, alot the threads that get alot of visibility are hotbeads of negativity, ("Ah, I LOVE the smell of idiocy in the morning!") and that repels would be newcomers to the sport. .

How can you possibly make this leap?

What you perceive to be negativity in some threads on a discussion board that at the most has had 2,000 people online at once repels newcoomers to the sport? Apparently you can't understand how incredibly naive your conclusions are.

The more there are people riding trails, the healthier our sport.

And the more crowded the trails are. How do you define the "healthiness of our sport"?

Giving possible newcomers to the sport the wrong idea about the kind of people that are mountain bikers only hurts us. .

ROTFLMAO!

All the forums generally are really good and are used as the tool they were meant to be, riders helping other riders in whatever way they can, mechanical, advocacy, experience sharing etc. But i think we all need to make an effort to not let a thread degenerate into finger pointing, name calling and the like. it only hurts us all.

How does it hurt us all?

Furthermore, how does a bunch of consumers sharing their experiences with a manufacturer "hurt us all"?

Heck, you would think that these were "consumer review" forums or something...

 

[Maurice]

Maybe they didn't ride because the bike was ... "temporarily unavailable" ?



Maurice

 

[Belfrey]

These people are not cyclists. They are not my friends. They are not of any consequence.

For those still reading, I am about to give some advice. If you are fuming mad about what I had to say about your posts, please stop reading.

Advice: Get out and ride.

I didn't have anything to add to the Ellsworth thread, but this post annoys me.

I've said this before, and I'll say it again here: the whole "shut up and ride" argument is stupid. You don't know anything about these people, how much they ride, how much they WANT to ride when they're stuck at their computers pretending to work, etc. There is obvious irony in the fact that you're taking the time to post something about how those who post don't take the time to ride.

Also, like Pete said, this is a consumer review site. It was an entirely appropriate thread, more so than the majority here. It was made especially interesting because the owner of the company posted a couple of replies. What a rare opportunity in this industry!

I know that sometimes accepting information from Pete means reading through his acerbic wit, and often that's as much fun as a prostate exam... but when he's right, the best thing is just to relax and take it. Struggling only makes it more painful.

 

[DSR]

Thanks Mr Thought Police... Sorry, this is a mountain bike forum where people discuss mountain biking and mountain bikes. Usually those discussion are very positive (pics of my weekend ride, question about a component selection), but they are sometimes negative (I broke my leg, my bike broke, bike company won't warranty my frame) because unfortunatley not every mountain bike-related experience is 100% happy, smiley and fun. Either way, it's discussing mountain biking and mountain bikes which is the whole point of the forum. Most people on this board are pretty passionate and discussions can sometimes get heated. But those passionites are the ones that I'd like to share my experiences with and gather information from.

As to the whole Ellsworth warranty discussion, I don't see why some people are so offended. Again, it's discussing a relevant topic within the mountain biking community. In this case, an aggressive warranty policy (from a marketing standpoint) and folks sharing their experiences with that policy. If this isn't the forum for riders, customers, potential buyers, dealers, manufacturers, etc to discuss the topic, then what is?

By the way, I am posting in the middle of the latest 365 Days of Adrenal Gland race via a satellite link-up brazed on to my bike, so your "ride, don't post" point is moot in my case. Gotta badge in for lap 1,123 so I'm signing off now... S

 

[26street]

yeah dude

right on dude. street riding kicks ass. how did you learn nose bonks? are those hard?

if yuor ever in Chi town we'll shread it up theres a rockin bowl at the Wilson sk8 park its dope as hell smooth transitioons and a sweet skinny island in the midle....yaaaahhhowww

dont' sweat steve3 and pete and those dudes, they just have their periods and are all running estrogen balls to the wall style. you didnt' even name them and their all flipping their sh*te. its funny as hell.

guys are all defenisive like "WHAT DO YOU MEAN I DON"T RIDE! ASS!!! JERK!!!! I RIDE ALL THE TIME!!! SEEEEE I HAVE 500 POSTS! I KNOW WHAT I"M T ALKIN!!!"

people are so dramatic...smoke a blunt or somethin

 

[Belfrey]

Lol!

Well, 26street just joined today and has a similar birthday, praising manbike in an utterly pitiful and childish Instant Messenger style. I wonder what IP's would show...

And with that, any crediblity manbIKE/26street might have had goes up in a puff of pungent smoke...

Man, he's really impressed with himself!

how did you learn nose bonks? are those hard?

I wonder if he would have continued the conversation if you hadn't busted him.

 

[Locoman]

Is that you Mr. Ellsworth?

And I wanted to add my 2 cents.......they will never be what you can.

Wow, you posted some bizarre crap. The strange nature of that post makes me think Tony's up to his weird posting again.

Keep them coming. The laughs make my day that much easier.

 

[26street]

Found out

good detective work!

tony in the hizouse...jk...i'm gone...see if you can figure out who i am next time...the last ones didn't get connected by you guys....

peace, brush the sand out of your underwear...

 

[DMFT]

Grow up.
Trolls S U C K !

 

[colker1]

do you work for ellsworth?

i see fish businness...

 

[fred3]

He usually misses the point...

I think you missed the point. while manbike may have gone on about "get on your bike and ride" a bit much what i think he meant was, alot the threads that get alot of visibility are hotbeads of negativity, ("Ah, I LOVE the smell of idiocy in the morning!") and that repels would be newcomers to the sport. The more there are people riding trails, the healthier our sport. Giving possible newcomers to the sport the wrong idea about the kind of people that are mountain bikers only hurts us.
All the forums generally are really good and are used as the tool they were meant to be, riders helping other riders in whatever way they can, mechanical, advocacy, experience sharing etc. But i think we all need to make an effort to not let a thread degenerate into finger pointing, name calling and the like. it only hurts us all.

because he spends about 99% of his time here and everywhere else looking for things he can rag on. It's a "Pete" thing. Not to be confused with a helpful response. He's the crusader of all things he considers wrong with everyone else, but don't do what he does. It's not acceptable.

 

[Pete]

because he spends about 99% of his time here and everywhere else looking for things he can rag on. It's a "Pete" thing. Not to be confused with a helpful response. He's the crusader of all things he considers wrong with everyone else, but don't do what he does. It's not acceptable.

Ah, it's not only a midget, it's a midget that has delusions of being psychic!

How can you possibly know how I spend my time frederica? I'm not surprised that you can't fathom the point, just like I'm not surprised that you're getting buddy-buddy with another handle swapping anonymous spaz, giving your history of cowardly posting under multiple handles.

 

[GEEI'MGROSS]

Furthermore, how does a bunch of consumers sharing their experiences with a manufacturer "hurt us all"?

I never said that sharing experiences with a manufacturer hurts us all. If you read a little closer the last paragraph with the sentence i put in bold letters, it said finger pointing, name calling and the like hurts us all. As you might be aware mountain biking is not as popular as it was in the mid 90's and mountain bike sales have been flat for the last couple of years. Low sales mean that there are not alot of new riders and a community that does not have new blood will wane (i.e. trail closures, etc.). More new riders doesn't have to mean crowded trails, it can and does mean people making new trails and new life in local trail advocacy in alot of places.
if you had a choice to be part of a community that was passionate about what they did and did everything they could to keep it going or one that was passionate about what they did and then argue sophmorically about a discussion that started out as a simple and beneficial relay of experience?
I know that a bunch of other people are going to post a decontruction of my post that misses the point and I will let them have the last word. i am not going to post on this thread after this and be part of the tit for tat.

 

[Ken in KC]

Ummm...

I never said that sharing experiences with a manufacturer hurts us all. If you read a little closer the last paragraph with the sentence i put in bold letters, it said finger pointing, name calling and the like hurts us all. As you might be aware mountain biking is not as popular as it was in the mid 90's and mountain bike sales have been flat for the last couple of years. Low sales mean that there are not alot of new riders and a community that does not have new blood will wane (i.e. trail closures, etc.). More new riders doesn't have to mean crowded trails, it can and does mean people making new trails and new life in local trail advocacy in alot of places.
if you had a choice to be part of a community that was passionate about what they did and did everything they could to keep it going or one that was passionate about what they did and then argue sophmorically about a discussion that started out as a simple and beneficial relay of experience?
I know that a bunch of other people are going to post a decontruction of my post that misses the point and I will let them have the last word. i am not going to post on this thread after this and be part of the tit for tat.

At the expense of being called out for "tit for tat" or missing the point of your post, you seem to be lumping a considerable amount of assumptions on top of one another in order to make grander assumption.

Mountain biking is more popular now than it was in the Mid 90's, not less popular. In fact, according to the Outdoor Industry Association (OIA), 46 million people participated in mountain biking in 2001 and 7.5 million people consider mountain biking their primary sport, making mountain bikers the 2nd largest trail user group behind hikers.

1983 - Mountain bike ownership: 300,000 bikes
2000 - Mountain bike ownership: 30,000,000 bikes

Mountain bike sales are flat, not down. Flat sales indicate a saturated market, not a decline in the market.

There is absolutely no connection between new riders and new trails. In fact, I suggest that riders that have been riding longer contribute more to new trails than new riders. It takes time (usually several years) for new riders to "get it". It takes them passing work crews. It takes them being brought in to the fold. They don't walk out of a LBS automatically enlightened about trails, trail building and trail maintenance.

My parting advice: You'll receive more credibility if you know what you're talking about and can back your words up with either facts or experience. I would suggest that trying to argue advocacy with Pete is the equivelent of you bringing a knife to a gun fight. Not intented as a slight, but you'll probably take it that way.

Ken

 

[GEEI'MGROSS]

I lied, i'm posting again

At the expense of being called out for "tit for tat" or missing the point of your post, you seem to be lumping a considerable amount of assumptions on top of one another in order to make grander assumption.

Mountain biking is more popular now than it was in the Mid 90's, not less popular. In fact, according to the Outdoor Industry Association (OIA), 46 million people participated in mountain biking in 2001 and 7.5 million people consider mountain biking their primary sport, making mountain bikers the 2nd largest trail user group behind hikers.

1983 - Mountain bike ownership: 300,000 bikes
2000 - Mountain bike ownership: 30,000,000 bikes

Mountain bike sales are flat, not down. Flat sales indicate a saturated market, not a decline in the market.

There is absolutely no connection between new riders and new trails. In fact, I suggest that riders that have been riding longer contribute more to new trails than new riders. It takes time (usually several years) for new riders to "get it". It takes them passing work crews. It takes them being brought in to the fold. They don't walk out of a LBS automatically enlightened about trails, trail building and trail maintenance.

My parting advice: You'll receive more credibility if you know what you're talking about and can back your words up with either facts or experience. I would suggest that trying to argue advocacy with Pete is the equivelent of you bringing a knife to a gun fight. Not intented as a slight, but you'll probably take it that way.

Ken

Thank you for posting constructive criticism and not an attack. (I'm serious, just in case you were wondering)

craig