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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Everybody likes to spend their money on different things. Many of us like to spend it on mountain biking, food, housing, and so on. But some people like to spend their money on traffic tickets. Seems silly to me, but there is a segment of society that goes way out of their way to achieve this goal. Here are some things that have worked for them:

1) Lie to the police:

Cops don't like doing paperwork any more than anyone else. If you do something wrong, and the officer can get you to correct the problem with a warning, it works out better for everyone. But if you lie, you've pretty much communicated that a warning won't work.

2) Illegally alter your vehicle to give the police reason to stop and cite you at any time, even if you're not currently committing any moving violations:

Common methods to achieve this goal are things like illegal window tint, fart-can mufflers, ginormous stickers on the windows, and blue-colored exterior light bulbs. Other successful methods include tires hanging out of the fenders, jacked up trucks without proper mud flaps, and tinted license plate covers.

3) Commit violations that attract unneccessary attention to yourself:

Everybody violates traffic laws. You are not a special and unique snowflake. So how do you make sure that your violations stand out enough to convince the officer to choose you over all the rest? Drive at night with your fog lights on and your headlights off. Speed more than everyone else. Don't signal your lane changes. Serenade everyone within a half mile with your favorite CD of the sounds of beating a wet refrigerator box with a tennis racket, accompanied by lyrics involving drug dealing, killing police officers, and/or referring to the women in your life (moms, sisters, daughters, baby-mamas, etc) in vulgar biological terms.





And if all else fails, combine as many elements as you can. For example, driving 25 mph over the speed limit slicing and dicing through traffic without signalling your lane changes, using your fog lights instead of your headlights, waking people up three blocks away with your stereo and fart-can muffler, while driving with blue marker lamp bulbs, illegal window tint, and no front license plate. Then, when the officer stops you, claim that the window tint, blue light bulbs, and muffler are stock, the car never came with a front license plate bracket, you forgot to turn your headlights on, you only had the stereo turned up to "2", and you thought that the residential neighborhood speed limit was 50 mph.

You may have to work hard at it. I've seen some pretty spectacular violations result in only warnings, including doing half a dozen 90 mph wheelies in a 45 mph zone right in front of a cop, and a buddy that got a warning after a state trooper got a radar lock on him at something in excess of 160 mph in a clearly posted 55 mph zone.
 

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RIS said:
Everybody likes to spend their money on different things. Many of us like to spend it on mountain biking, food, housing, and so on. But some people like to spend their money on traffic tickets. Seems silly to me, but there is a segment of society that goes way out of their way to achieve this goal. Here are some things that have worked for them:

1) Lie to the police:

Cops don't like doing paperwork any more than anyone else. If you do something wrong, and the officer can get you to correct the problem with a warning, it works out better for everyone. But if you lie, you've pretty much communicated that a warning won't work.

2) Illegally alter your vehicle to give the police reason to stop and cite you at any time, even if you're not currently committing any moving violations:

Common methods to achieve this goal are things like illegal window tint, fart-can mufflers, ginormous stickers on the windows, and blue-colored exterior light bulbs. Other successful methods include tires hanging out of the fenders, jacked up trucks without proper mud flaps, and tinted license plate covers.

3) Commit violations that attract unneccessary attention to yourself:

Everybody violates traffic laws. You are not a special and unique snowflake. So how do you make sure that your violations stand out enough to convince the officer to choose you over all the rest? Drive at night with your fog lights on and your headlights off. Speed more than everyone else. Don't signal your lane changes. Serenade everyone within a half mile with your favorite CD of the sounds of beating a wet refrigerator box with a tennis racket, accompanied by lyrics involving drug dealing, killing police officers, and/or referring to the women in your life (moms, sisters, daughters, baby-mamas, etc) in vulgar biological terms.

And if all else fails, combine as many elements as you can. For example, driving 25 mph over the speed limit slicing and dicing through traffic without signalling your lane changes, using your fog lights instead of your headlights, waking people up three blocks away with your stereo and fart-can muffler, while driving with blue marker lamp bulbs, illegal window tint, and no front license plate. Then, when the officer stops you, claim that the window tint, blue light bulbs, and muffler are stock, the car never came with a front license plate bracket, you forgot to turn your headlights on, you only had the stereo turned up to "2", and you thought that the residential neighborhood speed limit was 50 mph.

You may have to work hard at it. I've seen some pretty specacular violations result in only warnings, including doing half a dozen 90 mph wheelies in a 45 mph zone right in front of a cop, and a buddy that got a warning after a state trooper got a radar lock on him at something in excess of 160 mph in a clearly posted 55 mph zone.
Seems like a wealth of information here. So what does one do when they have actually received a ticket? Just got pulled over for having the bike rack blocking the plate (wife's car) on a segment of I-17. Cruse control was set at 75 and a large red Dodge was passing in the right. I got flagged cause I decided not to run when I saw him pull out of the center median. Make it worse my daughter has an accident in the back seat while we were stopped. Not a fun trip thanks to the AZ HWY patrol.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)
crux said:
Seems like a wealth of information here. So what does one do when they have actually received a ticket?
Well, there are probably several options listed on the back of the citation, that include something like:

1) Admit and pay: If you do not contest the citation, you can usually just mail in a check, and it's a done deal.

2) Contest the citation: If you think that you are innocent, you can request a court date. The judge will review your side and the officer's side, and make a decision.

There may be other options too, like giving an explanation without contesting the citation, or having a trial by affidavit.

Just got pulled over for having the bike rack blocking the plate (wife's car) on a segment of I-17. Cruse control was set at 75 and a large red Dodge was passing in the right. I got flagged cause I decided not to run when I saw him pull out of the center median. Make it worse my daughter has an accident in the back seat while we were stopped.
Yeah, it's probably best that you didn't try running from the police with your daughter in the car, especially over a minor equipment violation. Standard procedures at that point probably involve a felony take-down at gunpoint. Officers are people too, and it can be very hard on us emotionally, to have to place children with the state child protective services division after arresting their parents.

It can also be a good idea to have everyone in the car go to the bathroom BEFORE breaking the law.

Not a fun trip thanks to the AZ HWY patrol.
Not sure I understand. Did the Arizona Highway Patrol create the equipment violation, or was that you?
 

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RIS said:
Not sure I understand. Did the Arizona Highway Patrol create the equipment violation, or was that you?
Ticket issued was for speeding. When we passed the patrol car I was being overtaken in the right lane by a large dodge ram truck. My speed was set at 75 with the cruse control.

Once we passed the officer the Dodge truck accelerated and got in the left lane ahead of me. I pulled to the right behind a large FedEx truck going down hill and slowed to let the officer by chasing the truck. He looked prepared to go after the truck, yet got behind me instead pulling me over. Ticket issued was for 85+. My cruse control must be very faulty for it to be over 10MPH off, that or the radar locked on the larger faster moving vehicle.

Equipment violation would be in regards to a Thule T2 hitch rack blocking the plate. That is obvious once I took a look at it with the officer. Rack is now off the car and back on the Jeep where it does not block the plate. With the Thule rack I'm not sure there is a viable solution as the rack folds with out any place of mounting the plate. The bike rack was a warning. I'd rather have gotten a fix it ticket or similar to having a moving violation on record. As I'm 5 hours out it appears as if I'm SOL on this issue.
 

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Crux, I have that rack too and wondered if APD would pull me over just for that. Did you have your bikes on it or was it in the raised position?

Sorry about the bad luck, dude.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
crux said:
Ticket issued was for speeding. When we passed the patrol car I was being overtaken in the right lane by a large dodge ram truck. My speed was set at 75 with the cruse control.

Once we passed the officer the Dodge truck accelerated and got in the left lane ahead of me. I pulled to the right behind a large FedEx truck going down hill and slowed to let the officer by chasing the truck. He looked prepared to go after the truck, yet got behind me instead pulling me over. Ticket issued was for 85+. My cruse control must be very faulty for it to be over 10MPH off, that or the radar locked on the larger faster moving vehicle.

I'd rather have gotten a fix it ticket or similar to having a moving violation on record. As I'm 5 hours out it appears as if I'm SOL on this issue.
I'm not an attorney, so I'm not going to give legal advise. But I can tell you what I'd do if I were in your situation.

If I thought I was guilty of speeding, I'd just pay the ticket. And if you were even 1 mph over the limit, technically you were speeding, so I wouldn't try to argue the difference between 76-77 mpn and 85+ mph, as it's pointless.

Me personally, I probably wouldn't cite unless the offender were doing 20 mph or more over the limit, but that's just me.

And please understand that many people attempt to argue against speeding tickets by claiming that they had their cruise control set at "X" mph. True or not, it sounds really lame in court, especially when it's about the 10,000th time his Honor has heard it.

I don't know what kind of vehicle you have, but over-sized tires can cause the speedometer to read low, which can also get you a speeding ticket. It's not a legit defense, I'm just throwing it out there for your consideration.

As far as the "big red Dodge" defense, I don't know any cop that would pick a vehicle other than the fastest one out of the bunch, so I'm telling you up front, that it's going to sound pretty lame in court. If you do want to go that route, you may want to file a request for discovery, to find out what kind of equipment he used to measure your speed. If he paced you, your going to want to request his training records regarding pacing, as well as the vehicle records for the particular patrol vehicle that he was using on that date. If the patrol car had under-sized tires, the speedo had not been calibrated recently, or it's been in the shop 10 times for a funky speedo, you might have a go at it. If it was radar (hardly anybody uses it anymore), you might have a chance, because most radar units have a pretty good beam spread, and the dopler audio tends to pick out the largest target. If it's laser, you're probably toast, as it's extremely accurate in it's aiming (it also gives direction of travel and distance to target). Either way, request the maintenance records for the unit he used, as well as his training records on that specific make and model.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
BTW, your original post said that you got pulled over for the bike rack, not speeding.

It's nice that he gave you a break on the license plate violation.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Also, keep in mind that he may not have measured your speed where you think he did. I'm a decent shot, and I have regularly used the laser to bang cars out to over 4000 feet (coming up on a mile away). The operators often express surprise that I could get them that far away.
 

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You should have half a dozen attorneys contacting you that are local to the jurisdiction. They comb the records looking for out of towners to represent. For a few hundred they will usually beat or get reduced a speeding ticket. I have used these guys twice with good success. It's actually cheaper than paying the increased insurance rates over time.
 

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I have the Thule T2 hitch rack on a Camry and use it a lot so I keep it on permanently. I drive around with it up all the time and my area crawls with police, often right behind me. They've never seemed to care or else a 13-year-old gold 4-cylinder Toyota just doesn't get their adrenaline pumped enought to bother pulling over in the first place. Now, that I think about it not only does the rack block the plate, the trays probably block parts of the brake lights/turn signals too.

Problem is that if I drive with it down where I live it'll probably get hit by tailgaters pulling up too fast behind me at redlights, mess up the rack, and then take off.
 

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RIS said:
Me personally, I probably wouldn't cite unless the offender were doing 20 mph or more over the limit, but that's just me.
That's pretty amusing because sober drivers kill/injure A LOT more people than drug dealers. Like you said, +1mph is illegal. You should resign on the grounds that you took an oath to protect the public and are clearly violating it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
veryavgwhtguy said:
You should have half a dozen attorneys contacting you that are local to the jurisdiction. They comb the records looking for out of towners to represent. For a few hundred they will usually beat or get reduced a speeding ticket. I have used these guys twice with good success. It's actually cheaper than paying the increased insurance rates over time.
The fine for 10 over is probably a lot less than you'll spend on an attorney, and pretty much 100% of the attorneys I've seen who do this kind of work are complete scrubs, just this side of a street wino. You don't need an attorney to get your fine reduced anyway. You can do that yourself- just ask. And even if the fine is reduced, a conviction is a conviction. Eating poo on one speeding citation (especially since it's only 10 over) isn't likely to hurt the insurance rates of the average operator anyway.

I'd save your money.
 

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If you get a speeding ticket, some states will let you take a "Defensive Driver course". Pass successfully and the ticket is waived. It costs about the same as the ticket, but you end up with no points and no insurance increase
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
BritOnTour said:
If you get a speeding ticket, some states will let you take a "Defensive Driver course". Pass successfully and the ticket is waived. It costs about the same as the ticket, but you end up with no points and no insurance increase
Good point. About 10 years ago, I got stopped in the PRK by CHP troopers three times in about three hours, resulting in two citations. One of them I disposed of through an online class that cost me $20 and took 20 minutes, and the other one I was able to get dismissed.
 

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RIS said:
Also, keep in mind that he may not have measured your speed where you think he did. I'm a decent shot, and I have regularly used the laser to bang cars out to over 4000 feet (coming up on a mile away). The operators often express surprise that I could get them that far away.
I've worked some RF projects including radar and with laser. With the right antenna you can generate a very narrow beam singling out a given target out quite a ways. Regardless I was thinking of contacting the officer and asking if the citation could be dropped. I'm not one to break the law and don't want the hit on our insurance. I know the job of law enforcement is difficult, mind you not first hand, but working as a DoD contractor we did a few special projects with officers on the east coast giving us quite an insight most never will see. Hopefully what we developed will save lives on day. Sorry got a bit off topic. Not sure is a CIV gave you a follow up call if this would help or hurt matters, but thought I'd ask.

Other option is to suck it up and do the online traffic school.
 

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The part I dont understand is getting a ticket for 5 mph over the speed limit but the PO has to do 20 mph over the limit to catch me. How does that help?Fortunately for us the PO is not distracted by typing in the license plate on the laptop while driving or talking on the cellphone either
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 · (Edited)
crux said:
I've worked some RF projects including radar and with laser. With the right antenna you can generate a very narrow beam singling out a given target out quite a ways. Regardless I was thinking of contacting the officer and asking if the citation could be dropped.
Once a citation is written, it's out of the officer's hands. Police officers have a large amount of discretion in a lot of areas, but this ain't one of them. The best the officer can do is to recommend dropping the citation. It might be better for him to contact the prosecutor's office and speak to the prosecutor on it. He might be able to make a deal to plead out to a non-moving violation instead.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
MitchD said:
The part I dont understand is getting a ticket for 5 mph over the speed limit but the PO has to do 20 mph over the limit to catch me. How does that help?Fortunately for us the PO is not distracted by typing in the license plate on the laptop while driving or talking on the cellphone either
I've never seen anyone write a ticket for only 5 over. If you got a ticket for only 5 over, you must have done something to make yourself awfully special in the eyes of the officer.

The last speeding citation I wrote was for 90 mph in a 45 mph zone. At this level of speeding, it becomes a criminal offense (you can go to jail for it). We also generally have a pretty good sense of smell. In this particular case, the operator also had no license, because it had been revoked for a D.U.I. arrest a few weeks earlier. I'll drive as fast as I need to, to protect the rest of society from someone like that.
 
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