Mountain Bike Reviews Forum banner
1 - 13 of 13 Posts

·
Banned
Joined
·
656 Posts
dogonfr said:
Got a pic of what your bike looks like for set up?
What tires are you running?
Leaning forward does work just be carefull if you get to far forward it'll really stuff.
might have to so with your stack height, stem length or even tore pressure...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,762 Posts
There are allot of factors that can affect....

front end traction in a turn. If you are doing well at speed in the corners that indicates that your body position, tire choice, stem length and rise, spacer height, fork lenght etc. are all correct, at least for high speed turns. We really don't have enough information to diagnose the problem. A picture of your bike would be helpful. Here are some questions that might help you start to figure it out. Do you use the same body position at slower speeds? If not how is your body positioned differently during slower turns? Is your fork stock travel lenght? Longer travel forks than stock can lead to pushing in the front at slower speeds. What is your normal straight line riding position like. Is it upright? Leaned forward (racer style)? If you are riding a more upright position this can lead to front end push as your weight is further back on the bike. In high speed turns you are compensating for it. If you are planted in the saddle during low speed turns this could unweight the front enough to cause the push. Bike fit, does the frame fit you properly. I know that this is pretty elemetary, but if you are one of those people that are "in between" frame sizes and went with the larger frame and adjusted stem lenght and rise to accomodate a slightly longer head tube, this could cause an unweighting of the front and result in low speed push. Tire tread desing. What is the realationship between the side lugs and the transition knobs on the tire. Are tread blocks pretty much evenly spaced or is there are larger gap between the side knobs and the next row in (the transition knobs). This can cause push at lower speeds as well, as you are not leaning as far to turn at lower speeds so you don't use the side knobs, but are primarily on the transition knobs. If there is a large gap between the transition knobs and the side knobs you may be trying to turn on the gap. Other factors are terrain (soil type), braking, speed differential (what is fast for one person may be slow for another), tire pressure, tire compound, and so on.

My guess would be that perhaps your body position is enough different between the high and low speed turns that your weight distribution is a bit different. Either that or there are some component differences that are having an affect. Those are usually the primary culprits. But that is just a guess. Think about some of the above factors. I bet if you compare, that you'll figure it out. Let us know what your figure out, or give some more info, we might be able to figure it as well.

Good Dirt
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
523 Posts
I'd like a better description of what you are calling "push". I've only heard the term in relation to car handling, and doubt that the two are equivalent. Push in a car is when you turn for a corner, and the car keeps going straight, or understeers. This just doesn't happen with bikes.

Bikes tend to go where the rider goes, not the other way around. Try this: on a straight piece of road, turn the handlebars. Which way do you go? You go the OPPOSITE DIRECTION! It sounds crazy until you try it: To turn left you actually turn the handlebars right so that your body goes left, then the bike falls left to begin the turn. NO PUSH.
 

·
bike dork extraordinaire
Joined
·
628 Posts
OldBiker said:
How do I go about fixing front end push on my XC bike? If you can carry some speed through a turn, it will carve real nice, but at slower speeds it just pushes.
Sounds like an overly slack head tube angle for the terrain. What kind of bike do you have, and what kind of fork?

With a slack head angle, the bike will be more stable at high speeds, but will be sluggish at low speeds. This is why I would rather ride my old GT Zaskar hardtail than my 6"x6" Azonic Saber on really tight singletrack. The big bike just doesn't go through slow turns well. If you have an adjustable travel fork, try lowering it for tight sections. That might help.
 

·
Samsonite Tester
Joined
·
3,993 Posts
Sqaush covers it well.

My add is ;

Likely at higher speed you are out of the saddle and body crouched abosbing terrain with elbows , knees ect. This gets your center of gravity lowwer and more forward . As now you are putting the majority of your weight on the pedals ,some more on the handlebars ,instead of the seat . As you are likley sitting and cruising at slow speed.
 

·
Combat Wombat
Joined
·
1,848 Posts
I think he knows what he's asking.

Crusty Oldman said:
I'd like a better description of what you are calling "push". I've only heard the term in relation to car handling, and doubt that the two are equivalent. Push in a car is when you turn for a corner, and the car keeps going straight, or understeers. This just doesn't happen with bikes.

Bikes tend to go where the rider goes, not the other way around. Try this: on a straight piece of road, turn the handlebars. Which way do you go? You go the OPPOSITE DIRECTION! It sounds crazy until you try it: To turn left you actually turn the handlebars right so that your body goes left, then the bike falls left to begin the turn. NO PUSH.
A bike will push the front end in a turn. Unweight the front, lean into a loose turn and see what happens. Like pretty much all the others have pointed out, this is usually either fit, setup or a combination of both. Adding more travel on the front than what a bike was designed for will easily cause this, as well as setting up the bike so it is not balanced front and back.

Brian
 

·
I ride a Swarf
Joined
·
1,314 Posts
Crusty Oldman said:
I'd like a better description of what you are calling "push". I've only heard the term in relation to car handling, and doubt that the two are equivalent. Push in a car is when you turn for a corner, and the car keeps going straight, or understeers. This just doesn't happen with bikes.

Bikes tend to go where the rider goes, not the other way around. Try this: on a straight piece of road, turn the handlebars. Which way do you go? You go the OPPOSITE DIRECTION! It sounds crazy until you try it: To turn left you actually turn the handlebars right so that your body goes left, then the bike falls left to begin the turn. NO PUSH.
You are describing counter steering which initiates a turn, once leant over you do steer the bars the way you are turning. The front can push or wash out once in the turn. When I changed to a bike with a slacker head angle I got this push more on loose surfaces. Getting used to it now....but can't say conciously how which doesn't help. Tyres help a lot though. On loose stuff my paneracer trailrakers are quite bad for pushing on....but that because they are intended for softer/muddier conditions. my paneracer fire xcs are better on loose stuff.

where is this push occuring? what kind of surface?

Stu
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
523 Posts
Stuart B said:
You are describing counter steering which initiates a turn, once leant over you do steer the bars the way you are turning. The front can push or wash out once in the turn.
Maybe I'm making too much of this, but your front wheel basically points straight ahead, in relation to the direction of travel, even in a turn. You don't use the bars to make the front wheel go thru the turn, you use the bars to push the front wheel off its line to unbalance the bike to make it go thru the turn.
 

·
ride hard take risks
Joined
·
25,423 Posts
Crusty Oldman said:
Maybe I'm making too much of this, but your front wheel basically points straight ahead, in relation to the direction of travel, even in a turn. You don't use the bars to make the front wheel go thru the turn, you use the bars to push the front wheel off its line to unbalance the bike to make it go thru the turn.
Lets say your bombing single track going through a left hand turn & the front wheel drifts twords the outside of the turn now you have to get the bike around this left hand turn while the front end is running away or you go off the trail. I think that this is what the question "pushing" is about.
 

·
I ride a Swarf
Joined
·
1,314 Posts
Crusty Oldman said:
Maybe I'm making too much of this, but your front wheel basically points straight ahead, in relation to the direction of travel, even in a turn. You don't use the bars to make the front wheel go thru the turn, you use the bars to push the front wheel off its line to unbalance the bike to make it go thru the turn.
You are still talking about countersteering and faster corners (10mph +)

Oldbiker said low speed corners...which I guess means haipins, switch bags, turning sharply off a fireroad onto a perpendicular runing track....the bars are nothing like straight ahead in these circumstances. These are where i get the problems described occasionally too. If the front hasn't got enough grip for what ever reason, it has to run wide and skid, push, understeer...what ever you want to call it. push makes sense though :)

Happy new year every one! last post for 2005 for me :).

Stu
 
1 - 13 of 13 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top