Mountain Bike Reviews Forum banner
1 - 20 of 26 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
425 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Since I started teleskiing, I've managed to get jumper's knee, tendonisits and bursitis in both of my knees. The pain left me to be inactive for a number of months time.

Went to the physical therapist, actually 2 of them, for about 4 months to work on strengthening certain places - which is really all there was to do (no corrective surgery). I get strong, they deem me "all better" and I'm on my way. Told to continue exercise for the rest of my life.:eek:

So I ease back into my activies, only skiing or biking once a week, until I feel I can do more. Well evidently I can't ever do more. I've had to "start over" from scratch (inactivity and only PT exercises) three times now since this winter. It seems I don't know my happy medium - and whatever that level is is clearly too mild for my liking.

I've got knee braces, but they just sweat up a storm and feel uncomfortable so much that I don't even know if they do anything for me.

Plus I'm allergic to all anti-inflammatories, so Ice is really my only deal. Once they are sore and swollen it takes 2-3 days or more for them to go back down.

What to do? Keep trying to figure my happy medium? Is this really the rest of my life - one sport a week? I'm only 30. It can't be like this. The PT people deemed me all better. There is no operation for this.
 

·
I wear two thongs
Joined
·
1,675 Posts
I got knee braces made by hanger orthotics after I had my ACL done a couple years ago and I can wear that all day and sweat doesnt move it, maybey have custom braces made for your knees if you havent already?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
425 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
We discussed a "U-Brace" before I left the PT. He said he wasn't sure if I was a candidate for that, but he said I could buy if I wanted. Being that he wasn't sure if it'd help me, I didn't go for that fancy U-Brace. It was very long and mechanical, but it did seem to have the most breathability than those neoprene sleeves. Plus I wasn't sure how I could teleski in it or even swim in lakes.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,083 Posts
both me and a daughter have knee problems. she had surgery I didn't at least on the knee.

We both have problems that crop up but proper exercises tend to alleivate the problems.

Get the right exercises and work back into shape??
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
425 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
jeffscott said:
both me and a daughter have knee problems. she had surgery I didn't at least on the knee.

We both have problems that crop up but proper exercises tend to alleivate the problems.

Get the right exercises and work back into shape??
I have the exercises and the extra exercises to add on after the intital phase from the PT. I follow their recs. Then they say that I'm all better and good to go. But "good to go" doesn't mean I can go back to everything like it was before. I went back after the repeat issue and they told me to start over - no activity only PT exercises, then ease into things. It's like I can never break through that all better phase and go back to normal. Maybe I never can go back to normal, but I am not ready to believe that.
 

·
Don't worry, be happy!
Joined
·
8,141 Posts
What is the root cause of all this?

The reason I ask is that I had a lot of knee issues that were misdiagnosed for about 7 years. It turns out the cause of all it is/was overtight IT bands, and a real regime geared at loosening them up without surgery is what worked for me. I did not get the proper diagnosis until I went to see a gait specialist/podiatrist. The ortho guys just wanted to cut me, the PT's just wanted to tape me, and it took a lot of diligence to get to the root of it.

formica
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
425 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
formica said:
What is the root cause of all this?

The reason I ask is that I had a lot of knee issues that were misdiagnosed for about 7 years. It turns out the cause of all it is/was overtight IT bands, and a real regime geared at loosening them up without surgery is what worked for me. I did not get the proper diagnosis until I went to see a gait specialist/podiatrist. The ortho guys just wanted to cut me, the PT's just wanted to tape me, and it took a lot of diligence to get to the root of it.

formica
On the right side, my hip bone flares out so my leg/knee are just really odd on that side. They said I was born that way and without shaving bone and such (ow!) let's just try to strengthen muscles to fix it. My right knee cap points quite oddly to the left, so there's tracking issues there, but it's all related to that flared hip socket. I've got IT band stretches and exercises also. They said I'll be predisposed to issues because of that. The left is a muscle imbalance. So at first we worked on strengthening the right's quad and the left's hamstring and I wasn't allowed to stretch the opposite.

I asked about orthotic shoe inserts, twice actually, and this orthopedic surgeon didn't seem to think that was my problem.

Maybe I need to see someone else. If I do this will be the third doctor/therpaist team I will have seen.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
24,083 Posts
That and /or tight calves. Was my problem initially and once I started stretching my calves, my knee pains stopped. I've since started going to a new masues and she told me my IT bands are way tight, so I'm working on stretches for them and plan on going to some yoga - I get all kinds of weird poping coming from my hip area when I lift my legs up etc.

formica said:
What is the root cause of all this?

The reason I ask is that I had a lot of knee issues that were misdiagnosed for about 7 years. It turns out the cause of all it is/was overtight IT bands, and a real regime geared at loosening them up without surgery is what worked for me. I did not get the proper diagnosis until I went to see a gait specialist/podiatrist. The ortho guys just wanted to cut me, the PT's just wanted to tape me, and it took a lot of diligence to get to the root of it.

formica
 

·
Don't worry, be happy!
Joined
·
8,141 Posts
Shannon-UT said:
On the right side, my hip bone flares out so my leg/knee are just really odd on that side. They said I was born that way and without shaving bone and such (ow!) let's just try to strengthen muscles to fix it. My right knee cap points quite oddly to the left, so there's tracking issues there, but it's all related to that flared hip socket. I've got IT band stretches and exercises also. They said I'll be predisposed to issues because of that. The left is a muscle imbalance. So at first we worked on strengthening the right's quad and the left's hamstring and I wasn't allowed to stretch the opposite.

I asked about orthotic shoe inserts, twice actually, and this orthopedic surgeon didn't seem to think that was my problem.

Maybe I need to see someone else. If I do this will be the third doctor/therpaist team I will have seen.
well if you have structural issues that have been identified, that's good that you know what's going. So many times with this kind of stuff, it's like throwing darts to try and figure out what's wrong...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
425 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
LyNx said:
That and /or tight calves. Was my problem initially and once I started stretching my calves, my knee pains stopped. I've since started going to a new masues and she told me my IT bands are way tight, so I'm working on stretches for them and plan on going to some yoga - I get all kinds of weird poping coming from my hip area when I lift my legs up etc.
I have that hip popping too, mainly on the odd side, probably due to the flared socket. He told me my achilles were awfully tight, so I stretch those also.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,014 Posts
Shannon-UT said:
On the right side, my hip bone flares out so my leg/knee are just really odd on that side. They said I was born that way and without shaving bone and such (ow!) let's just try to strengthen muscles to fix it. My right knee cap points quite oddly to the left, so there's tracking issues there, but it's all related to that flared hip socket. I've got IT band stretches and exercises also. They said I'll be predisposed to issues because of that. The left is a muscle imbalance. So at first we worked on strengthening the right's quad and the left's hamstring and I wasn't allowed to stretch the opposite.

I asked about orthotic shoe inserts, twice actually, and this orthopedic surgeon didn't seem to think that was my problem.

Maybe I need to see someone else. If I do this will be the third doctor/therpaist team I will have seen.
No ****?!?!??! You've got a screwed up pelvis, too?!?!?!

I've been seeing a PT for a while. He's been great. He's an osteotherapist. I won't waste my time with any of the other mojo-whosa-whatchmacallems. What was discovered in my case was that my pelvis is twisted/rotated/tilted (yes, all at the same time) and it used to contribute to back problems. Yes, used to. I have a regime of exercises/stretching to do as well ..... yes, for life, if I want to have one. Major pita is my hamstrings. Stretching is GOD to me now.

At the same time my problem is amplified with having been hit by a car some years back and my one leg healed longer then the other. Yup, that helps LOTS! :rolleyes: Inserts have the ability to help here, which i'm kinda looking into. Surprise here is that a lot of people have one leg longer then the other and the body can "handle it". Okay, if they say so. :skep: Personally, I don't care how many experts yell at me it's the truth - I call BS. The skeletal structure isn't meant to be used crooked all the time, especially the legs.

Knees - can't help you there. I figured i'd post up with what I did in hope's it might provide you with ..... something. (osteotherapist) Have you looked into massage therapy at all?

I'd lke to manipulate what formica said - it's like throwing darts knowing who knows wtf they're talking about (meaning the "experts"). Good luck!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,589 Posts
Did your doctor discuss using steroids (either injected or oral)? There's also a treatment called extracorporeal shock wave therapy (ESWT) that has some questionable efficacy. All of the above have potential negative effects to consider though. I think rehab is the mainstay treatment.

Did your PT do ultrasound or iontophoresis?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
425 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Nat said:
Did your doctor discuss using steroids (either injected or oral)? There's also a treatment called extracorporeal shock wave therapy (ESWT) that has some questionable efficacy. All of the above have potential negative effects to consider though. I think rehab is the mainstay treatment.

Did your PT do ultrasound or iontophoresis?
Thanks for all your replies. I do know I need to get my ski boots professionally fitted before ski season starts. Because of that flared hip joint, to keep my knee straight when I lunge on the right side, I'm actually balancing on the outside of my right foot! Not good. Otherwise when I lunge and keep my foot flat on the ground/shoe, my right knee shoots inward about 45 degrees.

When I was seeing the PT, we did do ultrasound and isophoresis, not sure if isophoresis is the same as iontophoresis. The first PT did massage therapy on my IT band and around the knee, the second guy did not - put used the isophoresis. I put this cortisone stuff on these patches and then put the patches over my pes anserine and patella femoral area, they were battery powered, one time use things. They would stay on for 4 hours and deliver the medicine for that time, since the in office "stim" was way too painful. Heck even those little patches were painful to me and he thought I was crazy. I did not see relief after using those patches for 7 times. He said I should have seen relief by then, but I did not.

By steroids, do you mean cortisone shots to the area? He told me he doesn't like to do shots to the knee because it can rupture tendons. So that wasn't in my overall plan.

I have the intentions of swimming. In fact yesterday I brought it all with me (cap, goggles, suit, towel). As a university employee I get free lap and rec swim access at the pool here. But I was in so much pain yesterday I could barely walk down stairs, let alone bike all the way up to campus and make it to the pool. But I hope to swim at least once a week here, it's free after all.

So as of now, I'm cooling it on the biking (I drove today because I'm still inflammed), going to beef up my stretching and start over on my PT exercises which include all hip and gluteus exercises. Then work up to the quads and hamstrings. *Sigh* This can't be how it is? Starting from scratch every time?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
425 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
k1dude said:
Bummer Shannon-UT. I would give up telemarking right away and go back to regular skiis (no moguls though). Then during the summer....have you thought of taking up swimming?
I never learned to ski parallel! I went straight into teleskiing after having been only a XC skier really. But all the folks on the teletips board tell me that as you get better, teleskiing is actually better on the knees. You get more graceful as you get better.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,589 Posts
Shannon-UT said:
Thanks for all your replies. I do know I need to get my ski boots professionally fitted before ski season starts. Because of that flared hip joint, to keep my knee straight when I lunge on the right side, I'm actually balancing on the outside of my right foot! Not good. Otherwise when I lunge and keep my foot flat on the ground/shoe, my right knee shoots inward about 45 degrees.

When I was seeing the PT, we did do ultrasound and isophoresis, not sure if isophoresis is the same as iontophoresis. The first PT did massage therapy on my IT band and around the knee, the second guy did not - put used the isophoresis. I put this cortisone stuff on these patches and then put the patches over my pes anserine and patella femoral area, they were battery powered, one time use things. They would stay on for 4 hours and deliver the medicine for that time, since the in office "stim" was way too painful. Heck even those little patches were painful to me and he thought I was crazy. I did not see relief after using those patches for 7 times. He said I should have seen relief by then, but I did not.

By steroids, do you mean cortisone shots to the area? He told me he doesn't like to do shots to the knee because it can rupture tendons. So that wasn't in my overall plan.

I have the intentions of swimming. In fact yesterday I brought it all with me (cap, goggles, suit, towel). As a university employee I get free lap and rec swim access at the pool here. But I was in so much pain yesterday I could barely walk down stairs, let alone bike all the way up to campus and make it to the pool. But I hope to swim at least once a week here, it's free after all.

So as of now, I'm cooling it on the biking (I drove today because I'm still inflammed), going to beef up my stretching and start over on my PT exercises which include all hip and gluteus exercises. Then work up to the quads and hamstrings. *Sigh* This can't be how it is? Starting from scratch every time?
Tendon rupture is one of the potential adverse effects of steroid (aka "cortisone" although I don't know if anyone uses actual Cortisone, but one of its relatives) injections. It usually takes repeated doses to cause rupture, and it also depends on your doc's comfort level with taking the responsibility. Usually you try to inject the bursa and the area around the tendon rather than the tendon itself. If it does rupture, then that's what surgery is for. Ha ha.

Sometimes I write for Medrol Dose-Pak, an oral steroid. You take the pills by mouth and it tries to achieve the reduction in inflammation. It can make peoples' face puff up like Fat Bastard (amongst other things) though.

I've only heard of the term "isophoresis" in use with cosmetic procedures such as face peels, but it sounds like the same thing as ionto. It is a modality that carries medication through the skin. Some PT's use it, others don't I guess.

I'm not speaking of knees specifically, since I don't manage them, but of tendinitis in general. If you still get nowhere, maybe seek the input of a Physical Medicine and Rehabilitation (PM&R, or physiatry) specialist.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
425 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Sometimes I write for Medrol Dose-Pak, an oral steroid. You take the pills by mouth and it tries to achieve the reduction in inflammation. It can make peoples' face puff up like Fat Bastard (amongst other things) though.
I have taken oral steroids when they are so inflammed I'm crippled and can barely walk. But I don't like taking them often, #1 I ache so badly I feel like I was beaten with a baseball bat, #2 mess with BC pills.

I'll have to see if there's a Physical Medicine and Rehabilitation (PM&R, or physiatry) specialist in my area.

Thank you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
292 Posts
Shannon-UT said:
I never learned to ski parallel! I went straight into teleskiing after having been only a XC skier really. But all the folks on the teletips board tell me that as you get better, teleskiing is actually better on the knees. You get more graceful as you get better.
I think you are taking medical advice from tele-enthusiasts. They will always find a way to justify their passion just like we do on bikes. I can't tell you how many former tele skiers I know that gave it up because their knees couldn't take it anymore.

I ski Tahoe all the time and know some of the docs at Tahoe Forrest Hospital. They will tell you that same thing. Tele is bad for your knees. You don't even need to have a doc tell you that. We've all been told to not do deep-knee-bends because they will blow your knees out. You basically do a deep-knee-bend on every turn in tele. Why did the military stop doing deep-knee-bends during PT? Same reason, too many blown knees.

You're still young, it's not worth the risk. Take up a winter sport that will save your knees. Tele isn't one of them.
 
1 - 20 of 26 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top