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Bike Ninja |||
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Got this straight from Santa Cruz themselves....

looks like using a taco as a bash on the V10 and Bullit are grounds for your frame warranty being voided.

Subject: Santa Cruz ISCG bashguard/chainguide alert

Hello,

We have recently fielded several queries from riders who want to run
taco-style bashguards on their Santa Cruz V-10s and Bullits. In case
you are
wondering, a taco-style guard would look something like this:
http://www.e13components.com/product_directmount.html

The reasoning behind this type of product is to do away with a
crankarm mounted
guard and have a lighter weight bash/guide system.
Unfortunately, the ISCG tabs on most bike frames (including our V-10 and
Bullit models) were designed to hold chain guide systems, not
bashguards.
Smacking one of these taco-style bashguards hard enough can possibly
damage
the ISCG mounts on the bike frame, and that will void your warranty.

IF that occurs, we will honor our crash replacement purchase policy,
but will not consider it warranty-able manufacturing defect.


Cheers
---
Garen Becker
Santa Cruz Bicycles
Inside Sales
 

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Bike Ninja |||
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
William42 said:
interesting. can you mount one of the external iscg cups (dont really know the name for them) that has the tabs and is held in place by the BB and use that instead?
Seems legit to me... The stress would not be applied to the frame, more so the ISCG bb adapter. those are replaceable. It's not a question if the BB can take the load, it's if the welded on ISCG tabs welded on can take the abuse.
 

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check your six
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Interesting...... but it makes perfect sense... And a good way to cover your azz as a bike manufacturer.
 

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.WestCoastHucker. said:
makes perfect sense, a warranty is for manufacturing defects. all too many people these days are whining warranty over anything...
Yeah, just check the Specialized forum. They want to return their bikes for warranty for things they've caused, such as scratched stanchions.
 

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Pivotal figure
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I think the reasoning behind the ISCG05 was to have a larger area to distribute the load. Not really sure if that applies in this case though...
 

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graps the nettle
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yeah, but...

_dw said:
Seems like a great reason to go to ISCG05..
the V-10 and bullit already are ISCG05. it's a matter of intended design of a part, how that design (and it's intent) is incorporated into a frame, and what the final consequences of a subsequent divergent design could be for the frame in question.

in this case, the mount might get damaged if the taco guard takes a massive hit. and that damage will not be considered a warranty issue.
 

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posted just this question in the intense forums a while back.

to me that is a flaw of the lg-1(or any of these new style of CG), having iscg tabs take on the forces of the bash guard not to mention the 3 bolts aren't ideal for preventing the back plate from sliding on impact... but who am I to question DW.
 

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Mikey_C said:
posted just this question in the intense forums a while back.

to me that is a flaw of the lg-1(or any of these new style of CG), having iscg tabs take on the forces of the bash guard not to mention the 3 bolts aren't ideal for preventing the back plate from sliding on impact... but who am I to question DW.
The ISCG05 standard was designed by component and frame manufacturers together to distribute the impacts from a back plate into the frame. This does not mean that you can just throw the ISCG05 bolt pattern on and be all good, you need to follow the standard, which includes dimensions for tab thickness and location in 3 directions.

All e.thirteen products are designed around the standard in its entirety, not just part of the standard. Each aspect of the design is carefully considered and repeatedly tested before it goes to market.

The LG1 back plate is designed to work with the taco and ISCG05 standard to give the greatest protection from impact available at the lightest weight possible. The "taco" is designed to flex under impact. This lets the taco absorb impact rather than just bluntly distribute it. e.thirteen has applied for a host of patents on the impact absorbing bashgaurd ideas.

The back plate itself is designed to fail well before the ISCG05 tabs can. It will bend away in a catastrophic crash and you can bend it back just like a replaceable dérailleur hanger. Even at that, it takes a MAJOR impact for this to happen, just huge.

Additionally, 18-8 stainless bolts are used to mount the system to the ISCG05 tabs instead of high tensile steel bolts so that a catastrophic crash will deform the bolts rather than the tabs.

What's cheaper to replace, a crankarm or a backplate? We know that the answer is a backplate.

I've seen literally thousands of bikes run the LG1 and taco successfully, the design has won 6 World Championships and countless other pro and amateur titles. The LG1 with taco works equally as well on your bike, Fabien Barel's bike, Sam Hill's bike, Sabrina Jonnier's bike, Luke Strobel's bike, Bryn Atkinson's bike, Andrew Neethling's bike, Matti Lehikoinen's bike, etc...

Think about this, how is the impact force from a taco different than that from a Mr. Dirt, an MRP System 1, or a Blackspire? All of those guides have an inner bashguard and bikes have used them for years. It's a rhetorical question, the impact is the same on all of them.

Bottom line is that if your bike uses tabs that are designed to the standard, its a non-issue. Not like anyone should be trying to warranty a bike because they crashed it anyways.. That's a different thread though.

Hope this helps

Dave
 

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Mr. Blonde said:
How exactly will that make a difference?
ISCG05 is a chainguide mounting standard that includes dimensions for the location of the bolts, and also specifies the thickness of the tabs and location of the tabs in 3 directions.

The standard was developed by a group of frame and component companies together in 2003 so that we could all develop products that could take advantage of its strength and light weight.

ISCG05 offers the strongest and lightest way to mount a chain retention system to a frame. There is no equal.

You can read more about it at www.iscg05.com
 

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kenbentit said:
I think the reasoning behind the ISCG05 was to have a larger area to distribute the load. Not really sure if that applies in this case though...
You'e got it, it also uses 10mm wide tabs and positions the guide in relation to the rear wheel. This makes bikes using the standard hold up to huge abuse, and makes mounting easier for you when you have your bike apart in your basement.
 
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