Mountain Bike Reviews Forum banner
1 - 20 of 30 Posts

·
Banned
Joined
·
35 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
We are attempting to petition the carlsbad city council to grant us land to build a freeride park. (dirt jumps, drops, etc.) This would give freeriders a legal place to have fun while keeping illegal environmental impact at calaveras and other locations minimal. We ask that anyone interested come to a meeting to sign a petition. Date of meeting tbd. thanks

calaverafreeriders
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
616 Posts
Oceanside

O'side has a skill park in the works, or so I have been told.

If you plan on petitioning the city or doing anything along those lines, be prepared for a long process, be patient, be well prepared and good luck.

I'm not saying that it cannot be done but I do believe that your best bet would be to pay very close attention to other related projects going on in San Diego and learn what you can from them, then go in well prepared.

When I say be patient, I mean, plan for at least a few months of getting your sh*&t together before even approaching the city.

And most of all, stay off of private property and leave homeowners hoses alone:band:

(one angry homeowner can shut things down quickly!)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
253 Posts
Don't Do things Twice

Contact Eric and or you could come to the SDMBA meeting. Eric is well along with Oceanside and we are giving a power point presentation to the MTRP CAC TUESDAY. Senior Ranger Tracey Walker got the presentation and liked it enough to get us bumped onto the agenda for January. Like it was said things are in the works but it takes a lot of homework and a big tincture of time. Want to get involved---SDMBA---we can get you more involved quickly.

You might find we have already knocked on Carlsbad's door. A couple of times.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
35 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Yes we understand it could be a very long process. And whats this skills park erik trogden is building? Would he be opposed to having extremely large dirt jumps? I guess I don't understand what a "skill park" means. The skaters have a skate park, the dogs have a dog park, why can't cbad have a bike park?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
253 Posts
What is a Skills Park?

Well it is a lot more then a jump or two and the advanced ones go plenty big. Just no gaps.
The skills include North Shore elements in a managed environment, good fall zones, incremental skills, top of the line materials and construction. Why doesn't C'bad have a park? Well we asked them and they dragged their feet like they had buckets of concrete on them. Oceanside just stepped up and said we want one and we want one now.
MTRP is saying lets take a look at a presentation. And that is way more then C'bad ever did. If you are insistent about C'bad knock yourself out. I personally think C'bad is bad and couldn't build a real trail to save it's skin let alone a park. Want to see a C'bad trail look one up on their site and go get your stroller.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
35 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Yeah I agree with you on the cbad being lazy and I am fed up with both the city council and the school board. But I'm still going to try. Not to be disrespectful, but there are only a few things in life that feel better than sending a gap. I want a gap and I want one now. Im glad you guys are doing what you are doing in oceanside, but the fact is I'm fed up with cbad crap and I'm going to try to give the freeriders that live here what they need. Cbad is too concerned with how to punish people then how to get to the route of the problem and I'm not taking no for an answer. If we work at it, hikers, mtbers, even people in strollers can all be happy. I'm not angry at anyone on this thread, but the fact is I'm not driving to a freaking other city if people are gonna kick me out and not give me any other place to go.
 

·
Single(Pivot)and Happy
Joined
·
1,778 Posts
Advanced jumpers hit doubles. Big tables create a false sense of safety. People that would not send it on a 8' gap may actually try a 10' table. If your not ready for 8', you sure shouldn't be hitting 10'. And coming in short head hot on a jump this size is going to hurt, gap or table.

Jumps don't hurt jumpers. Jumpers hurt jumpers.
 

·
Its only 1" on the map!
Joined
·
1,162 Posts
calaverafreeriders said:
Yeah I agree with you on the cbad being lazy and I am fed up with both the city council and the school board. But I'm still going to try. Not to be disrespectful, but there are only a few things in life that feel better than sending a gap. I want a gap and I want one now. Im glad you guys are doing what you are doing in oceanside, but the fact is I'm fed up with cbad crap and I'm going to try to give the freeriders that live here what they need. Cbad is too concerned with how to punish people then how to get to the route of the problem and I'm not taking no for an answer. If we work at it, hikers, mtbers, even people in strollers can all be happy. I'm not angry at anyone on this thread, but the fact is I'm not driving to a freaking other city if people are gonna kick me out and not give me any other place to go.
I would really like to hear what your efforts have been so far with the city council and the school board so far. Who have you talked to and what has been your approach. What has been your case to them for why you need big jumps and gaps in Carlsbad?
 

·
Lord of the Chainrings
Joined
·
2,925 Posts

·
Banned
Joined
·
35 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Heres a quick rough draft of a proposal, I know it still needs a lot of work but feel free to give advice to help us out.

To the Carlsbad City Council,

The time has come for change. For many years the Calavera Nature Preserve has be a home to hikers, horse back riders, mountain bikers, dirt bikers, and many other enthusiasts who have taken advantage of the different terrain. However, since tensions have mounted between the groups recently, the city has gotten involved and enforced the regulations with more vigor. The particular enthusiasts we represent here tonight are the freeride mountain bikers. For those of you who don't know, freeride mountain biking is a new evolving sport that deals with downhill obstacles at high speeds and dirt jumps that propel the rider in the air. Although it may sound similar to bmx riding and motocross, freeride mountain biking is unique because it combines the maneuverability of motocross riding with the versatility of a bmx bike. For many years now we have ridden the Calavera preserve and enjoyed the technical downhill trails and gap jumps. However, recently we have been notified that if we continue our jumping and down hilling we will be arrested and our bikes will be taken. We completely understand the reasons why we are not allowed to jump and ride illegal downhill trails. We do not wish to disrespect or oppose the law. We understand the consequences for our actions, and instead of fighting the new laws that have been laid upon us, we wish to seek a peaceful alternative that would allow all freeride mountain bikers a place to ride so riders do not feel pressure to destroy precious protected land in order to have a good time. How do we accomplish this? We build a freeride park here in Carlsbad for everyone to enjoy. This project is far from impossible, since a freeride park is already under construction in Oceanside. However, unless we have a park in our own city, illegal construction of dirt jumps will continue and environmental destruction will be inevitable. We do not want to see the day when Calavera Hills Preserve is riddled with scars and torn out plants. We need to act now. Skaters are not allowed to skate on city property so they have a skate park built for them. Dogs needed a place to socialize and get exercise so a dog park is build for them. The freeride mountain bikers need a recreational area where they can jump and socialize, so the time is now to make a freeride park. However, the construction of this park is unique and different from that of the dog park and skate park because the manual labor necessary to construct dirt jumps and other obstacles can be provided by volunteers rather than paid laborers. Believe it or not this city is filled with kids and adults alike who would be willing to put in time and effort toward making this project a success. Here is a basic layout explaining how this park would work: The Freeride Park in Oceanside is approx. 4 acres. However, 40,000 square feet of land would be sufficient for an enjoyable freeride park here in Carlsbad. Land with a slight slant would be Preferable.The Park would be single use, only for mountain bikers. The park would also cater to all skill levels. Beginning bikers will have the choice to ride a beginning line comprised of small jumps without gaps to hone their skills. The intermediate biker will be able to ride a jump line with medium sized gapless jumps. More experienced riders would be able to jump large gap jumps. With this environment, bikers are encouraged to learn and no obstacle is overwhelming. These obstacles will be surveyed every week and maintained regularly for reliability. Also, exit or “bailout” zones will surround every jump so it is possible to exit if one does not feel safe or comfortable. Signs above each jump line will indicate difficulty. An area where water is accessible via hose will increase safety since dirt could be wetted and packed for more reliability. Signs will also be posted with park rules and regulations. If we work at this project, mountain bikers will have a safe place to ride where they do not tread on the space their environmentalist friends love. A responsible city creates outlets instead of opportunities for discipline. Thanks
 

·
Single(Pivot)and Happy
Joined
·
1,778 Posts
[QUOTEcalaverafreeriders] I know it still needs a lot of work [/QUOTE]

You obviously have access to a computer. Use the computer to research what others have done in similar situations.

However, unless we have a park in our own city, illegal construction of dirt jumps will continue and environmental destruction will be inevitable.
I believe I know what you are trying to convey in this statement. Unfortunately, someone may interpret your statement as a threat.

One last thing. Your post looks like a black rectangle.

I know you spoke with Rich. I hope you make it to La Costa. Your enthusiasm and energy can make a impact in the mountain bike community. Whether it's positive or negative, that's up to you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
153 Posts
calaverafreeriders said:
Heres a quick rough draft of a proposal, I know it still needs a lot of work but feel free to give advice to help us out.

To the Carlsbad City Council,

The time has come for change. For many years the Calavera Nature Preserve has be a home to hikers, horse back riders, mountain bikers, dirt bikers, and many other enthusiasts who have taken advantage of the different terrain. However, since tensions have mounted between the groups recently, the city has gotten involved and enforced the regulations with more vigor. The particular enthusiasts we represent here tonight are the freeride mountain bikers. For those of you who don't know, freeride mountain biking is a new evolving sport that deals with downhill obstacles at high speeds and dirt jumps that propel the rider in the air. Although it may sound similar to bmx riding and motocross, freeride mountain biking is unique because it combines the maneuverability of motocross riding with the versatility of a bmx bike. For many years now we have ridden the Calavera preserve and enjoyed the technical downhill trails and gap jumps. However, recently we have been notified that if we continue our jumping and down hilling we will be arrested and our bikes will be taken. We completely understand the reasons why we are not allowed to jump and ride illegal downhill trails. We do not wish to disrespect or oppose the law. We understand the consequences for our actions, and instead of fighting the new laws that have been laid upon us, we wish to seek a peaceful alternative that would allow all freeride mountain bikers a place to ride so riders do not feel pressure to destroy precious protected land in order to have a good time. How do we accomplish this? We build a freeride park here in Carlsbad for everyone to enjoy. This project is far from impossible, since a freeride park is already under construction in Oceanside. However, unless we have a park in our own city, illegal construction of dirt jumps will continue and environmental destruction will be inevitable. We do not want to see the day when Calavera Hills Preserve is riddled with scars and torn out plants. We need to act now. Skaters are not allowed to skate on city property so they have a skate park built for them. Dogs needed a place to socialize and get exercise so a dog park is build for them. The freeride mountain bikers need a recreational area where they can jump and socialize, so the time is now to make a freeride park. However, the construction of this park is unique and different from that of the dog park and skate park because the manual labor necessary to construct dirt jumps and other obstacles can be provided by volunteers rather than paid laborers. Believe it or not this city is filled with kids and adults alike who would be willing to put in time and effort toward making this project a success. Here is a basic layout explaining how this park would work: The Freeride Park in Oceanside is approx. 4 acres. However, 40,000 square feet of land would be sufficient for an enjoyable freeride park here in Carlsbad. Land with a slight slant would be Preferable.The Park would be single use, only for mountain bikers. The park would also cater to all skill levels. Beginning bikers will have the choice to ride a beginning line comprised of small jumps without gaps to hone their skills. The intermediate biker will be able to ride a jump line with medium sized gapless jumps. More experienced riders would be able to jump large gap jumps. With this environment, bikers are encouraged to learn and no obstacle is overwhelming. These obstacles will be surveyed every week and maintained regularly for reliability. Also, exit or "bailout" zones will surround every jump so it is possible to exit if one does not feel safe or comfortable. Signs above each jump line will indicate difficulty. An area where water is accessible via hose will increase safety since dirt could be wetted and packed for more reliability. Signs will also be posted with park rules and regulations. If we work at this project, mountain bikers will have a safe place to ride where they do not tread on the space their environmentalist friends love. A responsible city creates outlets instead of opportunities for discipline. Thanks
A little work..... If you send this type of letter it will only do more harm then good. This may be harsh but here it goes,

You need to take out this whole section,

"For those of you who don't know, freeride mountain biking is a new evolving sport that deals with downhill obstacles at high speeds and dirt jumps that propel the rider in the air. Although it may sound similar to bmx riding and motocross, freeride mountain biking is unique because it combines the maneuverability of motocross riding with the versatility of a bmx bike. For many years now we have ridden the Calavera preserve and enjoyed the technical downhill trails and gap jumps. However, recently we have been notified that if we continue our jumping and down hilling we will be arrested and our bikes will be taken."

And tone the whole thing down a ton. I'm only reponding because I'm afraid that you are actually going to send this letter, and put the spot light on the mtn bike community again, in a bad way. You need to understand that cities think in terms of black and white. Anything that they can be liable for, they will not approve. And the actions you are proposing in your letter screams of liability to the city. In order to approve this type of project, they need to insure it. How in the world are they going to insure 40,000 sq of space and all the users? Please do your homework and talk with people that have gotten this sort of thing approved before.

Below are links to groups that got orginized and got got their s%&t together and were allowed to build a pump track with full approval,

http://www.novatoadvance.com/articles/2008/06/18/sports/doc48597a3b294a3481465939.txt

http://www.hartmarin.com/hmportal/ptn/documents/PTNBusinessPlanOutline.pdf

http://www.mbaction.com/ME2/dirmod....0&tier=3&nid=A8905D9CEC904877A5E1C545F8728C32

I can tell you are very passionate about opening a freeride park in Calaveras, but did you ever stop to think that this is not the place for one? I know you see open land at Calaveras and think it perfect for building jumps, gaps, drops, etc but that land is used my many different user groups. Trust me, I ride Calavera at least 4 times a week and I love it as well, its not the best trails but they serve a purpose. I also would love to see more challenging trails with better lines, etc, etc. But please do not bring unnessary heat to a already sensitive area and ruin it for everyone. Get organized, show the city and their is group with a need for this type of activity, and it can be safe and be fun for a large group. Not just one person writing in. And start small. Don't talk about huge jumps, drops, etc etc. rant over.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
58 Posts
One question...your talking about insuring the place, and I know it's cuz the city could get sued if someone was hurt. So this is why they say no illegal DJ building as well, because of ruined habitat or people getting hurt and go to sue the city? Has anyone ever actually heard of a story like this?????

There are DJ all over the freakin place, I've never heard of someone building jumps, getting hurt on them and then trying to sue....and I know most of us wouldn't cuz it would be ridiculous and I'd like to think they wanna keep biking instead of money.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,126 Posts
Here's a few suggestions.

It's a draft. That's cool. You got some ideas down. Now organize it.

Work on your language and structure. Shorter sentences and paragraphs help a lot.

I think you make good points in mentioning other special recreation needs: dog parks, skate parks, tennis courts..

You might mention and tie in Carlsbad's history with the moto-x races back in the day

Think about why Carlsbad should allow space for this if Oceanside is already building a park:
distance, accessibility, age of park users

Is there somewhere on city owned property that your park could be built? Vacant lot, buffer zone near the airport, unused portion of a city park? I think Seattle has a park under a freeway.

I agree with Boulder Pilot's comments. The way you phrase what you want to say is something along the lines of "providing a legitimate outlet for young people with a passion for this sport".

Know that this is a process. You may be looking at several years :madman: of planning, meetings, and plan reviews.
Good Luck
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
153 Posts
Thrillride said:
One question...your talking about insuring the place, and I know it's cuz the city could get sued if someone was hurt. So this is why they say no illegal DJ building as well, because of ruined habitat or people getting hurt and go to sue the city? Has anyone ever actually heard of a story like this?????

There are DJ all over the freakin place, I've never heard of someone building jumps, getting hurt on them and then trying to sue....and I know most of us wouldn't cuz it would be ridiculous and I'd like to think they wanna keep biking instead of money.
2 words, Big Bear. I know alot of you on this board are too young to really enjoyed Big Bear when it was in full swing. But all it took was 2 lawsuits and that place is closed for good, and none of the surrounding mountains will touch our group. Cities get hit all the time with frivolous lawsuits, why do you think there are so many lawyers in this world. I used to work for a city a few years ago at a skate park, I know first hand. Thats why you have to pay to use all the city run skate parks around here, just to cover the insurance on the place, and everyone has to sign a waiver to use the park. I know you say no one here would sue, but trust me plently of people would. All it takes is for a younger kid to go off one of the "big" jumps, and for mama and papa to be money hungry.

Yes there are DJ's all over the place, and they are all "illegal" in the eyes in the of the city. I can guarantee none of them are sanctioned by the city. So if someone does get hurt, they can say they never knew about them even if they turned a blind eye to them.

Dog park, golf courses, tennis, etc = No liabilty on these types of activites. And the insurance is very, very cheap. Mtn biking, skateboarding, are high risk activites in the eyes of many people, espeically people outside of the sport, even if more people have probably gotten hurt on a gold course then mtn biking. So when you start using words like "big jumps, huge gaps" decision makers are going to run the other way. All I'm asking is to get very orginized before approaching a city with this type of request. Or it will make us all look stupid, and make it even more difficult to approve other projects in the future.

And please, NO MORE ILLEGAL TRAIL BUILDING AT CALAVERAS. Thats the quickest way to get us all kicked out of there.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
35 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 ·
What about skate parks? There's a whole lot of liability there! Quit commenting rockit.No one wants to hear your pessimism and just because you don't like freeride doesnt mean you have to discourage us. I've taken crap for a lot of things in order to try and legalize trails, but I'm not taking yours.
 
1 - 20 of 30 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top