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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My super deluxe is trashed, need a new damper shaft which is unavailable in the UK for a long time, so need a new shock.

I want to stick to air on my mullet meta am 2021.

I was really happy with my super deluxe, I had a megneg and custom tune by a good tuner.

Borrowing a 2019 float x2 in the meantime, it feels pretty good, not as good as my trashed super deluxe. The spring feels a little "hollow" if that makes sense, ie I have it packed with volume spacers and either run a lot of compression damping or overspring to make up for it. The overspringing kills the small bump, the extra damping makes it harsh and out of balance with the front. Does the 2021 float x2 have a more supportive spring? Is the 2021 better at being less compromised?

I'd be more than happy with a tuned super deluxe again, but super annoyed at spares availability.
 

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While the dampening has been improved some on the 2021 X2, the air spring has not, and the new ones have been having reliability issues. Consider a Manitou Mara Pro (will feel closest to to you current shock), DVO Topaz (good air spring, not as plush, but very poppy/active), both of which can be easily retuned if you want. SR Suntour has the Tri Air 3CR which is vitually the same shock as the Topaz but with a piston ifp instead of a bladder.
 

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While the dampening has been improved some on the 2021 X2, the air spring has not, and the new ones have been having reliability issues. Consider a Manitou Mara Pro (will feel closest to to you current shock), DVO Topaz (good air spring, not as plush, but very poppy/active), both of which can be easily retuned if you want. SR Suntour has the Tri Air 3CR which is vitually the same shock as the Topaz but with a piston ifp instead of a bladder.
Would you go for a Super Deluxe Ultimate over an X2? How does the dampener and air spring compare to the X2?
 

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I think RockShox is absolute garbage.

Fox and DVO are the way to go.

Santa Cruz moved to RS and IMO it rides poorly .

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All Rockshox products? Rockshox shocks that have been tuned? There is a reason that Vorsprung does not tune Fox shocks and Avalanche states:
"We highly recommend our tuning and mods for the Fox VanRC/BomberCr as a better option than the DHX2
Call us for an air shock alternate that can be tuned better option than the Float X2.
The DPS, DPX2 and the Rockshox Super Deluxe/Ultimate are very good alternates."
 

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Would you go for a Super Deluxe Ultimate over an X2? How does the dampener and air spring compare to the X2?
Six days a week and Sundays also. X2 has poor support and cannot be tuned as poppet valves have two positions, closed or shut. The Superdeluxe can be tuned and fully upgraded by Vorsprung or Avalanche If you are not happy with the performance.
 

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The Super Deluxe is a better damper than either generation Fox X2 IMO. There is very little you can do to tune the Fox X2's. If someone wants a coil I'm recommending the Bomber CR or CC DB Coil (bit one, not inline).

Air shocks the Manitou Mara and CC DB (big one, not inline) are the best. DVO have very light compression damping and which only really works well for light or less aggressive riders. Super Deluxe benefits hugely from VS Tractive tune but the compression damping from Tractive tunes are very firm which works best for the most aggressive riders.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thanks everyone.

I don't really mind which is more tuneable, just care about the end result.

So on the float x2, I'm at 200 psi which puts me in the middle of the range for all the clickers according to the fox recommended base tune, so surely I'm going to have range to tweak as far as I need to?

Comments above on poppets...both the CCs and fox still both have a shimmed main piston right, on both compression on rebound? Got someone above recommending a poppet shock and another saying they're not good.
 

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The CCDB is a bit different than the X2. Dougal has far more experience than most of us, it is his business.
 

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X2 has poor support and cannot be tuned as poppet valves have two positions, closed or shut
It's not quite that simple, there's a lot to dislike about the 2019 float x2 but the reliability would be more of a deal breaker than the damping.

If I had to pick one off the shelf on performance alone it would be the X2 but all things considered I would prefer a super deluxe with a megneg (depending on frame) with a tractive tune
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I'm also swayed by the extra tunability externally since the bike it's for, meta am 2021 mullet, it's range of use really is full spectrum, bike park smashing, xc rides and slow, junky, greasey steep. TBF the xc and bike park setting is the same, stiff and damped, it's the steep woods where the setup comes to a conflict. It would be nice with a couple of click to change the attitude of the bike.
 

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It's not quite that simple, there's a lot to dislike about the 2019 float x2 but the reliability would be more of a deal breaker than the damping.

If I had to pick one off the shelf on performance alone it would be the X2 but all things considered I would prefer a super deluxe with a megneg (depending on frame) with a tractive tune
Megneg doesn't help anyone. What should be more mid-stroke support from extra negative is offset by the deeper notch position. It's then no different for the rest of the stroke.
Standard can is better.
 

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I'm also swayed by the extra tunability externally since the bike it's for, meta am 2021 mullet, it's range of use really is full spectrum, bike park smashing, xc rides and slow, junky, greasey steep. TBF the xc and bike park setting is the same, stiff and damped, it's the steep woods where the setup comes to a conflict. It would be nice with a couple of click to change the attitude of the bike.
I think I missed the last part, the 2021 Fox is much better and deals with most of the flaws of the old shock
 

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We have been very impressed with the new Cane Creek Kitsuma shocks, everyone who has had one has been really impressed with them. The air one seems very nicely made and parts availability in the UK for service centres like I run is not a problem.

The Super Deluxe is a great shock, it is a large improvement on the old Monarch plus. However as you have found out parts availability is terrible. They could have the best shock in the world but if you cannot get basic parts then we cannot recommend one.
 

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I'm also swayed by the extra tunability externally since the bike it's for, meta am 2021 mullet, it's range of use really is full spectrum, bike park smashing, xc rides and slow, junky, greasey steep. TBF the xc and bike park setting is the same, stiff and damped, it's the steep woods where the setup comes to a conflict. It would be nice with a couple of click to change the attitude of the bike.
High speed compression and rebound adjustments are highly overrated. Both are dictated by spring rate and leverage curve and in a shock that is properly tuned from the factory or tuner does not need to be adjusted. It also adds a lot of complexity to setup, as low and high speed controls effect each other. Johnny has a good writeup on the 2021 X2:

 

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The Super Deluxe is a better damper than either generation Fox X2 IMO. There is very little you can do to tune the Fox X2's. If someone wants a coil I'm recommending the Bomber CR or CC DB Coil (bit one, not inline).

Air shocks the Manitou Mara and CC DB (big one, not inline) are the best. DVO have very light compression damping and which only really works well for light or less aggressive riders. Super Deluxe benefits hugely from VS Tractive tune but the compression damping from Tractive tunes are very firm which works best for the most aggressive riders.
What are you on about DVO, you just ring them when you order it and have it built the way you need.
 
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