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HIYAH
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Had a chance to replace the seals in both of these forks this weekend. One older F80X and a newer F100X. Both were leaking from the right hand seal, both had lost some of their lock out...

We started on the F80X and found it easy to dissassemble. The system Fox uses on the bottom shaft (on bottom of the lowers) is a joke. When you turn the nut the entire shaft wants to turn and there is no way to prevent its turning. Enduro mentions this on their website. Why fox did not put an allen fitting on either the inside air piston or the bottom shaft is beyond me (plain stupidity). Once the air side was apart, the inertia side came apart nearly as easy. No real problems to report other than a very noticable amount of wear on the damper rod in the inertia unit. (Both forks had this same wear, heavy wear that could easly be seen and felt) It only occurs on the front of the rod as this is where it binds (I assume?). After reading the fox manual and prombtly throwing it away (as it is pure crap cake) we started rebulding. We completely cleaned the forks out (WD-40) and cycled the damper to ge the old fluid out of it. Take the old seals out, put the new seals in. The seals go in pretty easy, but not as easy as Enduro makes it out. The bottom seal is a VERY tight fit.

1. Fill up the air side first - we made this mistake the first time.
2. We inverted the fork and filled the bottom of the air side with 30-40cc of 7.5 wt motorcycle suspension fluid, then tighten the bottom nut.
3. We then filled the top of the air side (on top of the piston) with a 5-10cc mix of Manitou Prep M and the suspension fluid to create a heavier weight "Pillow Pack" (or whatever fox calls it). Then tighten the top cap.
4. then on to the inertia side, First tighten the bottom nut, Then fill the top with 150cc fork fluid while cycling the damper. Tighten the top cap.

DONE!

The seals work and the lock out appears to work better, won't get a chance to MTB till the weekend so we shall see. The fork felt real good after rebuild - but will need a full ride to report.

In conclusion - I am amazed at how much wear my relatively new F100X had inside of it. Fox needs to work on this. I am not suprised at all that so many people lose the lock out in the first few months, especially with heavy use. These forks are not worth 700 bucks, once you see whats inside of them. (I got mine as OEM on a Weyless SP, so thank god I did not pay that much)

Cia
 

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After taking my 100X apart, I said, "People are paying how much for this fork?"
Too simple, but it's marketing.
Anyway, I felt my "lock out" going away slightly. Wonder if it's all internal cuz I replaced my seals. The air pressure is still spot on each day.
 

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HIYAH
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754 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Put some good miles on the Enduro Seals this weekend. Did a long MTB ride at Devils Den State Park in Arkansas. Demanding terrain with lots of downhills and knarly climbs...

The seals work great, no oil leakage, no noticable stiction...

I e-mailed fox about the wear on my internals about a week ago, they have yet to reply. Will probably call today. Pretty sure they will tell me to F off since I rebuilt the fork with non OE seals...we will see.
 

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(aka SS_MB-7)
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On-One said:
Had a chance to replace the seals in both of these forks this weekend. One older F80X and a newer F100X. Both were leaking from the right hand seal, both had lost some of their lock out...
I just replaced the seals on my 4-week of F100X that were spewing oil from the right-side like Exxon Valdez. My 4-month old F80X is leaking, but not nearly as bad as my F100X...the 80's seals will be changed this week.

On-One said:
We started on the F80X and found it easy to dissassemble. The system Fox uses on the bottom shaft (on bottom of the lowers) is a joke. When you turn the nut the entire shaft wants to turn and there is no way to prevent its turning. Enduro mentions this on their website. Why fox did not put an allen fitting on either the inside air piston or the bottom shaft is beyond me (plain stupidity).
Agreed. But, I was actually surprised at how easily I was able to remove both the left-side air assembly and right-side TerraLogic assembly. The right-side was the only real problem, if I can even call it that. I just fully extended the cartridge rod, and compressed the fork, and then gently inserted my middle-finger as far in the stanchion as I could and gently pressed on the cartridge rod. Very gently. This seemed to create just enough friction to prevent the rod from spining when loosening the 10mm lower nuts. Again, they could have made it easier.

What I found to be more of an issue was trying to re-install the crush washer. It's a tight fit and trying to gently push it back onto the cartridge rod (that was trying to compress back into the leg) was tricky.

On-One said:
Once the air side was apart, the inertia side came apart nearly as easy. No real problems to report other than a very noticable amount of wear on the damper rod in the inertia unit. (Both forks had this same wear, heavy wear that could easly be seen and felt) It only occurs on the front of the rod as this is where it binds (I assume?).
Hmm, the internals of my F100X were prestine. Likely because it was only 1 month old, but it was really raced hard during the TransRockies a couple weeks ago...lots of mud, lots of water, etc. I was surprised that the internals weren't dirtier since the seals were essentially spewing oil out and down the legs.

On-One said:
After reading the fox manual and prombtly throwing it away (as it is pure crap cake) we started rebulding.
Ya, I wasn't very impressed with the Fox manual either...especially since there is 0 on the TerraLogic. Come on Fox, help us out!

On-One said:
We completely cleaned the forks out (WD-40) and cycled the damper to ge the old fluid out of it.
I simply adjusted the rebound and Threshold from open to close and vice versa, all while cycling the cartridge. It felt pretty empty, but I could still feel some oil in the cartridge. Is there anything else to be done?

On-One said:
Take the old seals out, put the new seals in. The seals go in pretty easy, but not as easy as Enduro makes it out. The bottom seal is a VERY tight fit.
Yes, I could not get the inner seals to sit straight with finger-pressure. Fortunately, I had a near-perfect home-press (from some old scrap) that worked perfectly. I then used an old vacuum extension attachment (PVC piping would work, too) to press in the outer seals. Worked great! FWIW, I had both the inner and outer seals in a freezer for ~15 minutes, and each was coated with some grease to ease installation.

On-One said:
1. Fill up the air side first - we made this mistake the first time.
2. We inverted the fork and filled the bottom of the air side with 30-40cc of 7.5 wt motorcycle suspension fluid, then tighten the bottom nut.
3. We then filled the top of the air side (on top of the piston) with a 5-10cc mix of Manitou Prep M and the suspension fluid to create a heavier weight "Pillow Pack" (or whatever fox calls it). Then tighten the top cap.
4. then on to the inertia side, First tighten the bottom nut, Then fill the top with 150cc fork fluid while cycling the damper. Tighten the top cap.

DONE!
Hmm, seems to be some discrepancies on the right-side fluid levels. Fox says 155cc, I've read here 165cc. You've got 150cc? Which is it? Is it the same for the F80X?

On-One said:
The seals work and the lock out appears to work better, won't get a chance to MTB till the weekend so we shall see. The fork felt real good after rebuild - but will need a full ride to report.
I was very impressed with the Enduros on their first ride. The fork worked perfectly and actually felt better than it did the day before. Very smooth and bottomless and there was not a single oil ring left on the stanchions...granted, it was very dry, but even so, there would have been some oil rings left with the stock Fox seals.
 

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HIYAH
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754 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Agree with most of your points. I am anxious to see what other people are finding on their fork internals as far as wear. Hopefully more people will replace the seals with enduro and we will get some feedback. I have only done two forks, but they both looked bad.

It is not a sealing surface that is wearing, and maybe the wear will quit now that I have seals on there that actually keep the oil IN the fork.

Also, fox sent me a rebuild kit for my RL rear shock, and it came with one of those pillow packs - that stuff looks just like prep-m...? When I talked to fox on the phone they made a big deal out of not using prep-m - apparently its a big no no. They said it either has to be slick honey or fox products. Whatever...
 

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otb club member
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Couple of points...

1speed_Mike said:
I was actually surprised at how easily I was able to remove both the left-side air assembly and right-side TerraLogic assembly. The right-side was the only real problem, if I can even call it that. I just fully extended the cartridge rod, and compressed the fork, and then gently inserted my middle-finger as far in the stanchion as I could and gently pressed on the cartridge rod. Very gently. This seemed to create just enough friction to prevent the rod from spining when loosening the 10mm lower nuts. Again, they could have made it easier.

What I found to be more of an issue was trying to re-install the crush washer. It's a tight fit and trying to gently push it back onto the cartridge rod (that was trying to compress back into the leg) was tricky.
Mike, glad the Enduros are working well for you. How about a review? http://www.mtbr.com/reviews/Shock_Upgrade/product_122719.shtml

As for the shafts not spinning, I'm glad you had no real problem with it, but you should realize you were lucky. Sometimes I think they over-torque them and it can be a major pain when they spin (hence the need to post the ratchet-strap compression method in our Vanilla instructions). As for re-installing the crush washers (yes, they can usually be re-used), they usually conform to the shaft threads once they have been used, so the trick is to thread them on instead of pushing them on. Just use a rag to grip them and thread them on all the way before putting the foot nuts on.

-Chris
 

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(aka SS_MB-7)
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Chris2fur said:
Mike, glad the Enduros are working well for you. How about a review? http://www.mtbr.com/reviews/Shock_Upgrade/product_122719.shtml
I'll be happy to once I get some real mileage and some hard, Fall/Winter (i.e, wet-n-muddy) riding in, I'll then do a review. Not much point after one 2-hr dry ride ;)

Chris2fur said:
As for the shafts not spinning, I'm glad you had no real problem with it, but you should realize you were lucky.
Yes, after reading your Fox Enduro instructions, I was aware of possible problems with the shafts spinning...guess I was lucky! I'll see how my F80X goes.
 

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Probably the only way to know for sure....

danK said:
How many times you reusing the crush washers? Fox told me " a couple" and I've taken them off maybe 3 times.
You'd have to experiment and see how many times you can use them before they fail. Doesn't sound like a fun experiment.... I'd figure three times was pretty good and have a spare set on hand for future use, but that's nothing but my opinion.

-Chris
 

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Enduro crush washers?

Chris,
Any plans to supply crush washers with your seal kits? It would seem to make sense. Also, any plans for instructions for TALAS seal replacement? I like the details and pictures on your web site for the Vanilla but I don't know how similar the TALAS installation is.
 

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Yes. Yes.

dangerDan said:
Chris,
Any plans to supply crush washers with your seal kits? It would seem to make sense. Also, any plans for instructions for TALAS seal replacement? I like the details and pictures on your web site for the Vanilla but I don't know how similar the TALAS installation is.
We are working on having crush washer/O-Rings available to go with all of the seal kits. Most of these things take more time than one would expect to go from idea to reality, but we are working on it. It would make sense for everything required for the job to be available at the same site. And yes, eventually we will have pictorial instructions for the TALAS.

-Chris
 

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HIYAH
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754 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
SEAL UPDATE----- :)

They are still holding, no oil spillage...no stiction...and I have had more than a couple trail head conversastions that go something like...

"what are those blue things on your fox?"....

Thanks Chris...!
 
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