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Stiff yet compliant
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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hi guys -

Am about to order spokes and nipples for my first wheel build (for my commuter MTB) and had a couple of questions:

1/ Am using Sun Ringle Rhyno Lite rims and Shimano XT hubs. This is a zero spoke bed offset. Just to clarify - that is not the same thing as rim spoke hole offset (where alternate spoke holes are closer to the left and right edges of the rim), correct? So I should be able to do a 3x lacing pattern without any problems.

2/ A question for other beginner wheel builders - is the risk of damaging aluminum nipples while tightening them that much higher than brass nipples? I am sure all you experienced wheel builders can manage either - given that this is my first build, I am debating whether or not I should keep it simple and avoid one potential for screwups (although green nipples would be PERFECT with my overall build!).

3/ I am getting spoke lengths of 295, 295.1, 296, 296.1 - I gather 296mm spokes will work everywhere (meet the +/- 1mm requirement)? Am planning on using 2/1.8/2 spokes.

Thanks,
Vandit
 

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A wheelist
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vkalia said:
Hi guys -
Hi vkalia.

1/ Am using Sun Ringle Rhyno Lite rims and Shimano XT hubs. This is a zero spoke bed offset. Just to clarify - that is not the same thing as rim spoke hole offset (where alternate spoke holes are closer to the left and right edges of the rim), correct?

Correct.

So I should be able to do a 3x lacing pattern without any problems.

Whether you can do 3x is nothing to do with "zero spoke bed offset". Whether you can do 3x is down to how many spokes there are in a wheel. Low spoke count wheels won't accept 3x - the tangential spoke angle at the hub causes spokes to interfere with other spoke heads.

2/ is the risk of damaging aluminum nipples while tightening them that much higher than brass nipples?

It is higher but I don't know if it's "that much higher". See next answer.

I am sure all you experienced wheel builders can manage either - given that this is my first build, I am debating whether or not I should keep it simple and avoid one potential for screwups (although green nipples would be PERFECT with my overall build!).

Whether you damage aluminum nipples depends on two things -
  • The care you take making sure the spoke wrench is properly seated on each nipple before exerting pressure.
  • The quality and type of spoke wrench.
You should use a very good one and one that grabs 4 corners of a nipple. The Park Tools SW-40 is one. There are others. If you get the Park get the black one. With the Park, color = nipple size.
http://www.parktool.com/products/detail.asp?cat=16&item=SW-40
What's the worst that can happen if you have a problem? You round a nipple off? Make sure you have a few spares. If you want the green ones go for it. Just be careful.

3/ I am getting spoke lengths of 295, 295.1, 296, 296.1 - I gather 296mm spokes will work everywhere (meet the +/- 1mm requirement)?

296 should be ok - IF you have done the spoke calcs correctly and if any hub and rim specs you used were correct :)

Am planning on using 2/1.8/2 spokes.

Perfect!

Thanks

You're welcome. Good luck with your first build. Go slow. Let us know how you make out.
 

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vkalia said:
Hi guys -

Am about to order spokes and nipples for my first wheel build (for my commuter MTB)

...

I am getting spoke lengths of 295, 295.1, 296, 296.1 - I gather 296mm spokes will work everywhere (meet the +/- 1mm requirement)? Am planning on using 2/1.8/2 spokes.
I assume you are using the 29'er/700c version. Just making sure you didn't accidently choose the wrong size rim in your spoke claculator!

--
Roger
 

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Stiff yet compliant
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Roger - yeah, I am building up a 29er wheelset (am building up a full 29er, actually - a Bandersnatch). I have sized everything using the Spocalc spreadsheet by Dave Rinard, and verified the Rhyno Lite dimensions from their website (need to find the specs for the Shimano XT M756 hubs somewhere though).

Mike - thanks for that confirmation. Bontrager also has an article on spoke bed offsets which indicated it was different from rim spoke hole offset, but good to know for sure. Btw, I read your article on wheelbuilding (have it saved as a PDF for reference, actually) - thank you for a most excellent resource for beginners!

Based on what you wrote - I think I'll go for the green nipples (will also get a bag of brassies, just in case... hehe), and will spend on a better spoke wrench as well. Was going to get one of those 3-in-1 jobbies, but might as well get one for each size.

One other question - how are nipples sized: by spoke diameter or by rim hole diameter?

Cheers,
V.
 

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Roger - yeah, I am building up a 29er wheelset (am building up a full 29er, actually - a Bandersnatch). I have sized everything using the Spocalc spreadsheet by Dave Rinard, and verified the Rhyno Lite dimensions from their website (need to find the specs for the Shimano XT M756 hubs somewhere though).

Try Roger's own Spoke Calculator. He wrote it himself. It's strongly suggested that you measure the parts yourself and then you're not a victim of bad specs. Roger's calc shows how.

Mike - I read your article on wheelbuilding - thank you for a most excellent resource for beginners!

You're very welcome. Roger's e-book is light years better but mine's free :D

.....spoke wrench.....Was going to get one of those 3-in-1 jobbies

No-no-no-no-noooooooo!! The Park black one (or other make of equivalent size) is all you need. Get a really good one and it will last a lifetime of home use and won't wreck your nipples (!!)

how are nipples sized: by spoke diameter or by rim hole diameter?

For the spoke. 14g (2.0mm) spokes take 14g nipples. 15g spokes (1.8mm) as in DT Supercomps with their 2.0/1.7/1.8mm thickness take a 15g (1.8mm) nipple. Straight 15 gauge (1.8mm) spokes take the 15g nipple of course.
 

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Stiff yet compliant
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Cool, thanks! I have Roger's Ebook as well and punched in the numbers on his Spoke Calculator, and got pretty much the same readings.

Have ordered the nice Park Tool individual spoke wrenches, and am going to build a truing stand this weekend.

Will post back here once the wheels are done - appreciate the advice and help, Mike!

V.
 

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vkalia said:
Cool, thanks! I have Roger's Ebook as well and punched in the numbers on his Spoke Calculator, and got pretty much the same readings.
Great! We gotta keep checking up on that boy! :D

Have ordered the nice Park Tool individual spoke wrenches, and am going to build a truing stand this weekend.
Will post back here once the wheels are done - appreciate the advice and help, Mike!
Great stuff. Welcome to the wheelbuilders' club.
 
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