[Freewillie]

First a little background...

I have a 2010 Specialized Stumpy FSR. It came stock with DT 420 SL wheels and an SWorks Purgatory on the front and a Captain Control on the back. I had the shop convert the bike to tubeless when I bought the bike and off I went.

About a year ago I cut the SWorks tire out on the trail and put a tube in it to get home. Once home, I tried to reseat the tire and could not get it to work. I even borrowed a compressor and that didn't work. I just couldn't get the bead to seat so I resigned myself to a life of tubes.

Flash forward to today. My rear tire, which has been tubeless for 3 years, finally wore out and needed to be replaced. I got another Captain Control and planned to put a tube in it. Just for kicks, I mounted it up and tried to seat it with my floor pump. Bam! It seated immediately! I was super stoked. I put some Stans in and no leaks at all.

So, the lesson is...its wasn't me, it was that stupid SWorks tire. I love Purgatory tread as a front tire, so I'm going to get a Purgatory Control and mount it up front.

Thanks for reading

 

[mr_chrome]

sometimes it works out that way, sometimes it doesn't......but tubeless IS the way to go.......

 

[Freewillie]

I agree tubeless is the way to go. Although it's maybe not always worth the trouble. I can definitely tell a positive difference with tubeless, but for some reason, when I ride with tubes I still leave the trails with the same grin on my face. I'm still stoked I got the tire to seat, but tubes are fine as well👍

 

[Bike Whisperer]

So, the lesson is...its wasn't me, it was that stupid SWorks tire. I love Purgatory tread as a front tire, so I'm going to get a Purgatory Control and mount it up front.

It appears you might have missed the lesson...

Unless you are running tubeless rims and tubeless tires, there will always be a level of variability. The DT 420 rims are only tubeless with the specific DT rim kit and designed for using UST or Tubeless Ready tires.

Do your rims have this kit installed (it will be a red molded plastic rim strip)? The kit is pretty expensive and I know when I purchased my 2011 Specialized with DT 520 rims the dealer told me the wheels were tubeless ready. When I got home I pulled the wheels off and checked. "Tubeless Ready" was nothing more than a wrap of blue 3M strapping tape and a couple of tubeless valves. I did get my 2Bliss tires to mount and seal, but had multiple burps out on the trail.

So the lesson may be that your rims are not actually tubeless ready and that you now know that there is a degree of variability when using a "ghetto" tubeless system.

 

[Glide the Clyde]

I actually got the Stan's 21mm tape to work well with a set of the 520s as I had long ago pulled the blue strips off due to having to install a new spoke now and then. I run about 26lbs front and 28lbs rear and so far no burps.

Whisperer, what pressures were you running when you had burps?

Btw, aren't the 420s tubeless compatible and aren't the stock S-Works 2Bliss? Perhaps the beads had worn to the point they wouldn't seal.

 

[Freewillie]

Btw, aren't the 420s tubeless compatible and aren't the stock S-Works 2Bliss? Perhaps the beads had worn to the point they wouldn't seal.[/QUOTE]

It looks like the 420s are tubeless compatible. I'll try to post a pic of the rim profile. I do believe you are right in that the SWorks rubber is so thin that the bead stretched out. It is very loose on the rim while the Captain Control tire, which is much thicker, was tight on the rim. That's the lesson learned for me...tire and wheel combo is critical

 

[Freewillie]

420 SL rim (from my phone so hope this works)

 

[Bike Whisperer]

No, the DT 420 SL rims are NOT tubeless with just tape (BTW Stans Tape and 3M Strapping tape are the same thing, except you pay 10x more when it says Stans).

The only way the 420 and 520 rims are true tubeless rims are with the DT Tubeless Kits installed. Just taping a rim to make it air tight does not make it a tubeless rim. This is a what is referred to as GHETTO TUBELESS.

The DT 520 rim I was running required a compressor to seat the 2Bliss tires and the OP has mentioned the same with his rims. This is a normal requirement with Ghetto Tubeless systems. With true tubeless ready tires and rims or with UST tires and rims, I have NEVER needed a compressor to seat tires. This includes using Mavic (UST), Stans, Sun Ringle (Stans), WTB, and Velocity tubeless ready rims.

To keep from burping tires on Ghetto Tubeless systems I have had to run >28 psi on pretty much every system. This includes tubeless tires on non-tubeless rims and non-tubeless tires on tubeless rims. The burping on the DT520 rims with 2Bliss tires was at around 25 psi. In comparison I regularly run my tubeless ready tires as low as 18 psi on my tubeless ready rims with no burping.

So to the OP:

The S-Works tire had nothing to do with your failure. Your ghetto tubeless rim set-up had everything to do with your failure. There is always going to be a variable success rate with this "system". IF you would like to eliminate the variables...get the DT tubeless kit.

FYI-the 420SL is an OEM rim, the standard 26" XC kit from DT will work in it.

 

[Glide the Clyde]

Hmm. I'd guess ghetto works for me cuz I'm running higher pressures, around 28psi. I'm not comfortable with the amount of deflection and rim strikes with pressures lower than that anyway.

I find it interesting that the DT kit contains tape, sealant, and tubeless stems, the same items I used with the Stan's name on them to set up my "ghetto" system. Am I missing something? Not trying to be a pain but is there something in the DT kit that is tailored more to the DT hoops?

I also don't see it as a failure to have to inflate initially with an air compressor since I have an air compressor. Sure, out on the trail, I probably won't be able to re-seal and inflate with a hand pump but it will likely need more sealant which I won't carry on the trail, and I'll tube the tire anyway.

 

[Bike Whisperer]

I find it interesting that the DT kit contains tape, sealant, and tubeless stems, the same items I used with the Stan's name on them to set up my "ghetto" system. Am I missing something? Not trying to be a pain but is there something in the DT kit that is tailored more to the DT hoops?

Yes, you are missing the most obvious part. The molded plastic rim strips that adhere to the double sided tape. This is what gives the DT rims a UST compatible bead hook.

 

[Bike Whisperer]

I also don't see it as a failure to have to inflate initially with an air compressor since I have an air compressor. Sure, out on the trail, I probably won't be able to re-seal and inflate with a hand pump but it will likely need more sealant which I won't carry on the trail, and I'll tube the tire anyway.

PS-I never said using a compressor is a failure, I only said that it is normal to need a compressor to seat ghetto systems while true tubeless systems have never needed a compressor to seat the tires IME.

 

[desertred]

PS-I never said using a compressor is a failure, I only said that it is normal to need a compressor to seat ghetto systems while true tubeless systems have never needed a compressor to seat the tires IME.

This is good to know info, and explains why I was easily able to seat my TLR tires on my TLR rims using a floor pump last night. However, I have a set of non-TLR wheels on an old XC bike that I would like to convert to tubeless (Stan's lists the rims as being compatible). I assume that I will need a compressor to seat TLR tires to the non-TLR rims?

 

[dremags]

I will fill you in on my experience with tubeless and Specialized tires. I have 2 sets of Stan's wheels and 2 sets of Mavic UST wheels and have used Specialized tires on all of them. Every NEW Specialized tire I have installed has aired up with a floor pump and fits very tight on the rim. EVERY OLD Specialized tire I have installed has become very loose and requires my air compressor and a lot of patience. I even "converted" some cheap Bontrager wheels with Stan's tape and installed new Specialized tires with using only a hand pump. Don't worry...it's not you or your wheels, it's just the used tires.