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I just installed some Enduro seals on my bike (as well as the needle bearings, which work great, btw).

Somewhere I read that since the Enduros are rigid they damage the fork stanchions, has anybody who have used it for long time have any opinion?

I've only used them two times, and still notice the suspension stitchion(?), but less on the second one, so I think it's just a mater for the system to bed in, but what I'm concerned about is if the seals damage the stanchions.
 

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The Enduro seals themselves won't damage your fork stanchions, but dirt will.

The service intervals for cleaning and oil changes must still be followed.
 

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they wouldn't be the most popular seals if they were damaging the stanchions. i've logged thousands of miles since i started using Enduro seals in '05, and i've never seen the least bit of damage on the stanchions that could be attributed directly or indirectly to the Enduro seals.

idk if i'm a bit anal, but i routinely wipe clean the wipers/seals and stanchions after every ride.
 

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Zanetti said:
The Enduro seals themselves won't damage your fork stanchions, but dirt will.

The service intervals for cleaning and oil changes must still be followed.
Zanetti is absolutely right. Installing Enduro seals doesn't mean you can slack off on maintenance. They're just going to keep your oil cleaner and keep it inside the fork between oil changes.

This topic has been covered several times already. Enduro seals DO NOT DAMAGE STANCHIONS!!!
 

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rzozaya1969 said:
I just installed some Enduro seals on my bike (as well as the needle bearings, which work great, btw).

Somewhere I read that since the Enduros are rigid they damage the fork stanchions, has anybody who have used it for long time have any opinion?

I've only used them two times, and still notice the suspension stitchion(?), but less on the second one, so I think it's just a mater for the system to bed in, but what I'm concerned about is if the seals damage the stanchions.
They do wear on the surface of the stancions and add stiction in my expierence. They may have changed them in the last 2 years, don't know. What ever you do, put the original seals back in if you send your shock to fox for serviceing. The FOX seals will last a lot longer with proper maintenance.
 

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LAKESNAKE said:
They do wear on the surface of the stancions and add stiction in my expierence. They may have changed them in the last 2 years, don't know. What ever you do, put the original seals back in if you send your shock to fox for serviceing. The FOX seals will last a lot longer with proper maintenance.
It is not possible for a Polyurethane wiper with a 60 durometer to wear down a hardened and polished anodized stanchion coating. Stanchion tube coating wear is usually caused by:

1) Metal-to-metal contact. Fox forks rely on "hydrodynamic lubrication" at the bushings. This means that a thin layer of oil exists between the stanchion tube and bushings. If, for any reason, this layer of oil is not present, the slick surface coating of the bushings will quickly wear out and metal-to-metal wear will occur. Not running enough of the proper lube inside the fork legs is one possibility. Hydrodynamic lubrication is also not properly maintained if bushing tolerances are too loose.

or

2) Accumulated grit inside of the seal head working like sandpaper on the tubes. If stanchions are not regularly cleaned and lubed, contaminants can get past the wipers and end up trapped in the seal head area. This can also be caused by a severe bottom out where the wiper edges are driven very near to the crown and accumulated debris is forced past the wiper lip. All fork manufacturers recommend regular tear down and inspection so that contaminants, if present, can be removed and lubricating oil can be replaced.
 

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Yes,
I've owned 3 different VAN 36's since late 05'. After a year the Fox seals were leaking so bad it was running down the fork leg onto the rotor. I replaced them with Enduro's which did stop the leaking, but at the cost of stiction and stancion wear. They sent a special lube to put on the stancions, but they never got as smooth as the factory FOX seals. I will say the Enduro's NEVER leaked, but there are tradeoffs. The fox coating (pre-kashima) is not that durable anyway, so adding more surface area to rub in not going to help the wear factor.
 

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LAKESNAKE said:
After a year the Fox seals were leaking so bad it was running down the fork leg onto the rotor. I replaced them with Enduro's which did stop the leaking, but at the cost of stiction and stancion wear.
Yeah, I'm going to say the wear was already there. The 36 doesn't have a lot of bath lube, and is your seals were leaking that much, the fork was probably running very low on bath lube. Additionally, a leaking seal will also let in dirt, so what oil was in the fork was contaminated with dirt, which will always accelerate wear.
 

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LAKESNAKE said:
Yes,
I've owned 3 different VAN 36's since late 05'. After a year the Fox seals were leaking so bad it was running down the fork leg onto the rotor. I replaced them with Enduro's which did stop the leaking, but at the cost of stiction and stancion wear. They sent a special lube to put on the stancions, but they never got as smooth as the factory FOX seals. I will say the Enduro's NEVER leaked, but there are tradeoffs. The fox coating (pre-kashima) is not that durable anyway, so adding more surface area to rub in not going to help the wear factor.
The feel of a fork is a very relative thing and one rider's percieved stiction is not another's. Therefore, there is no point in arguing about stiction, other than to say that hundreds of Fox 36 owners running our seal kits would disagree with you. However, I can and do say that you are flat out wrong if you are saying that Enduro's accelerated your stanchion coating wear. Unless the coating was faulty to begin with, it is not possible.
 

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I have an '05 Fox Vanilla that's on it's second set of Enduro Fork seals. The last time I disassembled the fork, I did not see any stanchion wear in the areas contacted by the seals. There is some wear lower down on the left stanchion, which, I believe, is caused by one of the lower bushings.
 

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bad mechanic said:
Yeah, I'm going to say the wear was already there. The 36 doesn't have a lot of bath lube, and is your seals were leaking that much, the fork was probably running very low on bath lube. Additionally, a leaking seal will also let in dirt, so what oil was in the fork was contaminated with dirt, which will always accelerate wear.
I'm glad they work for you. These are some valid points regarding wear that are very subjective over the life of a fork, except for the "low oil bath" which was never the case even when leaking, but the stiction was apparent from beginning to end in my case.
In regards to soft durometer plastic not wearing on the coating, ask the liars at FOX :D
 

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The Fox coating is susceptible to wearing out pretty quick. Among my riding buds and I, we've killed several (some serviced all the time, others not so much).
 

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LAKESNAKE said:
I'm glad they work for you. These are some valid points regarding wear that are very subjective over the life of a fork, except for the "low oil bath" which was never the case even when leaking, but the stiction was apparent from beginning to end in my case.
In regards to soft durometer plastic not wearing on the coating, ask the liars at FOX :D
Are you kidding? You find it hard to believe that someone at Fox would blame a non-OE seal for a problem? Fox has had many problems with stanchion wear with their own seals and were more than happy to blame someone else. Did you ever take a middle school earth science class and learn about hardness (i.e.: "what scratches what?")?
A properly coated stanchion cannot be scratched by a 60 durometer material. It's simple science vs. a "story" some Fox tech told you.
 

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LAKESNAKE said:
I'm glad they work for you. These are some valid points regarding wear that are very subjective over the life of a fork, except for the "low oil bath" which was never the case even when leaking, but the stiction was apparent from beginning to end in my case.
25ml of bath oil gets low very quickly when dealing with a leaking seal, and just having the oil level be low can starve the upper bushing of oil.

The older generations of Enduro seals had slightly more stiction, but the new generation of seals (available since Fall of last year) and virtually eliminated it.

LAKESNAKE said:
In regards to soft durometer plastic not wearing on the coating, ask the liars at FOX :D
Please stop repeating statements which you know are wrong:
http://forums.mtbr.com/showpost.php?p=4796078&postcount=9
 

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Chris2fur said:
Fox has had many problems with stanchion wear with their own seals
So you are saying the rubber OEM fox seals are of higher durometer than Enduro's plastic ?. OK

The OP posed a question, I tried to relate my expierence. If you are the expert, I'm sure He can discern that for himself. I'm truly sorry for any mis-information and failing earth science class.
 

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Chris2fur said:
Are you kidding? You find it hard to believe that someone at Fox would blame a non-OE seal for a problem? Fox has had many problems with stanchion wear with their own seals and were more than happy to blame someone else .
This basically covers why I've not used Enduro seals again, after trying a set. They did have noticeably more stiction than the Fox seals. If my fork is gonna die one way or the other, seal-wise, why tolerate lesser performance in the mean time?
 

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Wear in this kind of situation (elastomer seal and hard metal shaft) is caused by abrasive particles which get embedded in the seal material making a sort of sandpaper effect.

So, the question is: is dirt more likely to embed in the Enduro material rather than the standard Fox seal material (presumably fluorocarbon rubber)??? I have no idea the answer to that but am certain that general cleanliness is a good thing.

One thing I found recently is that gobbing up the foam ring, and the cavity above the foam ring, with grease really helped reduce stiction on my 32 Vanilla fork.
http://www.enduroforkseals.com/id80.html
 
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