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Delirious Tuck
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2,470 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So, those on demos of the Warden, but are Endo aficionados, what are your thoughts on the bike differences and how would you build to get the most separation?

I love my Endo. Best riding full suspension bike I've ever been on, and I'm a certifiable bike wh#$%. I've been on my Enduro 26 Sworks all winter and back on the Endo Friday, and its just stupid how great the bike is.

So, help us with Wardens on the way make the most of the build differences between the bikes!
 

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Delirious Tuck
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2,470 Posts
Discussion Starter · #2 ·
PS - I have e-ridden the Warden so many times its not funny. Right now in my e-stable its my stop and play bike and the one I bring to Highland/Kingdom/B-St. for New England multi-stop riding trips or possibly to some where new with known features or a possible stop at Snowshoe on the way south to Pisgah.
 

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Pivoteer
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I don't have any time on a Warden, but plan on getting one at some point in the near future. Originally, I was planning on replacing the Endo with the Warden, but after some killer rides on the Endo, I decided that was a poor choice. However, with the release of the new Fox 36RC2 160, and the upcoming Marzocchi 350, and based on pferrell's comments, I think the Warden would be a better replacement for the Chili. I can see my Warden setup with XO1, King wheels/carbon rims, beefy fork, and the rear shock is still undecided. Do I move the Woodie to the Warden, CCDBA-CS, or Avy tuned CTD? I'd like to keep the weight at 30lbs or less, which I think is doable with the Woodie.

I get ill whenever I think about replacing my Chili, but I am also excited at the prospect of a 30lb Chili like bike. Keep in mind my Chili is pushing 35lbs. Hopefully I can get some time on a Warden demo in the next few months to determine how it fits in my plans.
 

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Delirious Tuck
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I sold the Chili. With Endo and Podium, it just didn't fit and I didn't like riding it on the trail once Endo came in.

Waiting for my Warden CCDBa-CS order. I could bore you w/build plans and acquired parts, but more importantly, where the Endo is day glo + purple king bling, the Warden will be murdered out, including black kmc x10sl chain and 10 mm more front and rear travel.
 

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I get ill whenever I think about replacing my Chili, but I am also excited at the prospect of a 30lb Chili like bike. Keep in mind my Chili is pushing 35lbs.
Why not drop some weight on the Chili to hit 30 lbs? Mine is 32 lbs even with a 7.5 lb. Marz 66 and Woodie...
 

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The Warden I demoed really fit right between the two bikes. It had a ccdb CS and 150 Pike. If I built one I would definitely go with a 160 fork; probably the Pike.

The Chili is going to be a bit plusher and the Endo a bit snappier. The Endo is a bit more fun in the tight and twisties but maybe that is just something to get used to. The stability is what most surprised me about the Warden. The faster I went the more stable it felt. Even more so than the Chili. It felt like a race bike.

To get some separation I would build a Warden with 160 fork, short stem, and slightly beefier tires. The bikes suspension and geometry will dictate the most significant changes. As for geometry, I would definitely run it in the slack setting.

Can't wait to see these builds. Should be any day now.
 

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What are your specs? I can't see dropping 3lbs on my bike without dropping some serious coin, or running compromised components.
Large 2012 Chilcotin, non 3D rockers
2010 Marz 66 RCV, Avalanche cartridge, steel spring, 1.125" steerer
2013 Woodie, steel spring
XT brakes, 203/180 Icetech rotors
Roval Traverse SL wheelset, Butcher Control 2.3's, 2 scoops Stan's/tire, Specialized tape
Six C crank, 34t Raceface narrow-wide ring, Straightline bash, Time X rock pedals
XO 11-36t cassette, SRAM 1091 chain
Zee shifter and rear d.
S Works DH 780mm bars, ESI chunky grips, Renthal Duo 50mm stem, CC 40 series headset
Command post blacklite 125mm dropper, Chromage trailmaster saddle, Salsa QR clamp

32 lbs with pedals, ready to ride.

Originally thought the Butcher Control tires were going to be an issue, but I've had good luck so far in St. George, Salt Lake, Austin, and on XC rides.

Only way to drop any significant weight would include air suspension and I'm not a fan, but have toyed with the idea of a 2015 Float 180 with Avy cartridge and Float X with Avy guts to drop it to around 29. I keep thinking about lighter weight, less travel, better pedaling, bla bla bla, and then I go ride and have a permanent grin so I just keep riding the bike everywhere from chasing lycra to bike park.
 

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What are your specs? I can't see dropping 3lbs on my bike without dropping some serious coin, or running compromised components.
Here's my just for comparison, right now it's right at 33.25. Suppose I could go full air (won't happen) and lose some weight, and maybe carbon rims. Other than that, not much else I can do lighter her up.

Frame Size: Large
Rear Shock: Avalanche Van RC w/ 500 lb Ti spring
Fork: 2013 Marz 55 Ti RC3 with Avalanche Cartridge
Brakes: XTR Trail, 203 fr, 180 rr
Shifter: XTR 10 Speed
Cranks: Race Face SixC
Chainring: Raceface N/W 32t
Chain: KMC x10SL
Chainguide: MRP AMG
Rear Derailleur: Shimano Zee short cage
Pedals: Race Face Atlas
Stem: Race Face Atlas 50mm
Handlebar: Race Face SixC (780mm)
Seatpost: Thomson Dropper
Seat clamp: Chromag
Saddle: WTB Pure V Pro
Cassette: Shimano XT 11-36
Headset: Chris King Inset upper/external lower cup
Grips: TLD lock ons
Front Tire: Schwalbe Big Betty 2.4 - tubeless
Front Rim: Stans Flow
Front Hub: King
Rear Tire: Schwalbe Muddy Mary 2.35 - tubeless
Rear Rim: Stans Flow
Rear Hub: King
 

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Buehliever
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873 Posts
If you are running a 2x10 then converting to 1x10 is easy weight savings. My medium Chili lost a pound when I went from 2x10 to 1x10 (33lb 7oz to 32lb 7oz).

Sorry to the OP for the derail.
 

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I think it would be easier to separate the Warden from the Endorphin than the Chilcotin. Both my test rides on the Warden reminded me more of my Chili than the Endo. With a160mm Avy Cartridge coil fork. 2.4 TK tires, Chubbie, wide bars, dropper, and you're there. It's stability in high speed rough, extra rollover ability for the uber chunk, and dialed geometry make it a very capable bike.

Yet , like ti'SSer said, it can be wrapped in a sub 30 lb package fairly easily too and crossover into that lighter trail slayer category some as well.
 

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I am on the flip side of this discussion. Wondering how close the feel of the Warden can be to the Endorphin. I have been riding my Endorphin with a Fox 36 at 150, Avalanche CTD, Flow EX and rarely feel under biked for most of the riding I do. Now that I have had a taste of how playful a modern mid travel bike can be, I am not sure I can go back.

I have been on the Endorphin for a year and recently got a demo on a Mach 429c. The Endo and the 429c are what I would call "more than the sum of their parts" bikes. The 429c was a huge surprise with only 100mm of travel out back and 120 up front. The bike really handled the rough (within reason), jumped well, and was easy to pump off of bumps to gain speed. A year ago I was riding 160mm+ bikes and would have never thought I would be going back the other way. I now realize that I have disconnected myself from the trail too much. I am having as much fun as I did back in the pre-suspension era racing friends down dry creek beds. Luckily I don't crash as much now. :)

It sounds like the Warden is somewhere between 50/50 to 30/70 ratio of Endorphin/Chilcotin. It will be interesting to hear what opinions on that will be once frames filter into the wild. So how playful can the Warden be? Maybe a fugitive could teach that Warden a few things...
 

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formerly shabadu
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961 Posts
I am on the flip side of this discussion. Wondering how close the feel of the Warden can be to the Endorphin. I have been riding my Endorphin with a Fox 36 at 150, Avalanche CTD, Flow EX and rarely feel under biked for most of the riding I do. Now that I have had a taste of how playful a modern mid travel bike can be, I am not sure I can go back.

It sounds like the Warden is somewhere between 50/50 to 30/70 ratio of Endorphin/Chilcotin. It will be interesting to hear what opinions on that will be once frames filter into the wild. So how playful can the Warden be? Maybe a fugitive could teach that Warden a few things...
This is almost exactly my scenario, but I have a 160mm 36 and a non-Avy CTD, but I do have the 3/5 volume spacer in it.

That said, I want my Warden(2nd batch) to be closer to my Endo than a Chili. I'm going for a pretty light set up.
 
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