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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
hi all, im new here.

i'm looking for a new full sus bike basically.
i ride DH (on a Specialized Demo9) and XC / DJ (on an Ellsworth Specialist).

however riding north shore a lot, and the demo9 is just too big for the tech stuff we got round here, and its gearing is fine for world cup / national DH courses but not too great for north shore, and obviously its useless for XC. the specialist is great but i want some suspension in that!

so im looking at an Ellsworth Moment, or possibly an ID.
the catch is...

im possible riding the Cape-Epic Enduro next year, so would need a bike for that.

so im asking the impossible really, which bike is capable for 6ft hucks as well as riding 140k a day! im pretty strong in my legs, so used to slightly smaller bikes and slightly heavier ones.

so if it was the moment i'd probably go for a float / rp3 combo. but i might switch to sherman / dhx combo if i got back and wanted a more agressive bike.

also from the owners, im 6ft, could i get away with riding the small? i rode a medium with some z1's and the front end was very difficult to lift. VERY. might end up getting a banshee chaparral!

thanks :)

all advice required, necessary AND appreciated!
 

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JKF said:
hi all, im new here.

i'm looking for a new full sus bike basically.
i ride DH (on a Specialized Demo9) and XC / DJ (on an Ellsworth Specialist).

however riding north shore a lot, and the demo9 is just too big for the tech stuff we got round here, and its gearing is fine for world cup / national DH courses but not too great for north shore, and obviously its useless for XC. the specialist is great but i want some suspension in that!

so im looking at an Ellsworth Moment, or possibly an ID.
the catch is...

im possible riding the Cape-Epic Enduro next year, so would need a bike for that.

so im asking the impossible really, which bike is capable for 6ft hucks as well as riding 140k a day! im pretty strong in my legs, so used to slightly smaller bikes and slightly heavier ones.

so if it was the moment i'd probably go for a float / rp3 combo. but i might switch to sherman / dhx combo if i got back and wanted a more agressive bike.

also from the owners, im 6ft, could i get away with riding the small? i rode a medium with some z1's and the front end was very difficult to lift. VERY. might end up getting a banshee chaparral!

thanks :)

all advice required, necessary AND appreciated!
To begin with, no way could you ride a small. I'm 5'7" and used a 90mm stem on my small - if you like your bikes sized smaller you could maybe get away with a medium but would most likely end up running a stem that would make technical riding almost impossible. Bottom line you need the Large.

ID - No way for 6" hucking!

Moment - 6' hucking only for the incredibly smooth rider to transitions. The Moment is a trail bike and is not in the same playing field as the Chaparral.

You might also want to consider the Ventana La Bruja or Turner 6 Pack if you want a hucking bike that you can pedal. They are both heavier but will hold up to the abuse of 6' drops and still be pedalable (if that's even a word).
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
well at my height, i still ride a small demo9 and a small ellsworth specialist (with a large thomson stem)

saying all that, i doubt i could do the cape epic on a turner 6 pack / banshee chaparral. i ideally would want a sub 28lb moment, if possible, and i would go to all lengths to do so! (tubless, cx rays, ti, anything!)

the intial idea was to have a freeride bike, then someone mentioned the cape epic and i thought hmmm, well ill need an xc bike too, aka, SC Blur or something similar. but then i thought again, what about an enduro bike....and then how about i cross all boundries and get a do all, enduro, north shore everything thats sub 30lbs.

any other comments?
theres no way i could ride a large.
 

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Moment

(TE) said "the I'd is a big XC trailbike not a freerider". You're asking for trouble dropping it 6'. With seperate ultralite wheelset and light air suspension you could probably get the Moment under 30 but a freind of mine has a Medium Id on full XTR Minute 2 and easton carbon bars, the only heavy parts on the bike are the Romic which is a pound heavier than an RP3 and 2.3 tubless tires and his bike weighs about 29 #. I would get the moment if I planed on doing sizable drops and have a few light parts like wheels/ tires and shocks to make it more race ready.
 

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I really think you need two bikes for what you are wanting to accomplish. Moment isn't really a XC bike and I don't think it would make a good huckster. I think you could get it down below 30 lbs with the right group, but would that group take the abuse of 6 footers? Maybe a Moment frame with parts for 6 foot hucks and parts for XC? Not sure man, but maybe its time to shell out for a couple of bikes instead of one for two vastly different things?

Other brands to consider -- Specialized Enduro, SC Heckler, Turner 6-pack, something from Yeti (only sayting them because they have an incredibly light "almost" 6 inch travel bike in the 575).

Love my Moment but for a long XC ride it could get heavy. I'm getting ready to swap out the DHX for a Float to save some weight and I'll soon have a set of slightly lighter wheels to see if it becomes more enjoyable on the trails for 4+ hour rides. Currently, if its going to be a long ride, or one with more ups than downs, then I take the 5 spot out. Would I want to pedal the moment 140 miles/day? Heck no! LOL

FB
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
yeah it seems after all, i will need 2 bikes, but having 6 bikes is a bit excessive i think. im only going to be a mechanic for a few more weeks, so thats the end of that perk!

chaparral for freeride, and an id / 5-spot for the cape epic?
 

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JKF said:
yeah it seems after all, i will need 2 bikes, but having 6 bikes is a bit excessive i think. im only going to be a mechanic for a few more weeks, so thats the end of that perk!

chaparral for freeride, and an id / 5-spot for the cape epic?
Sounds like a good plan, especially if you have the means to get a deep discount. Man you must have some stable if bikes!

Id vs 5 spot? Hmm, tough one. When I had an Id, I loved it, pedaled great and felt very plush. I liked the high BB which helped me roll over many obstacles I normally could or would not have been able to. But, it did feel like I was a million miles off the ground...well maybe not that high, but it did take some getting used to. I was somewhat leary of the 5 spot initially as I didn't care for the XCE, but I have to say the 5 spot is one sweet bike. Pedals great (maybe the ICT? LOL) and soaks up the bumps like nothing else. Turner has a fantastic rep as a dealer (but I wont get into that again) and the bike is top notch. Id's finish will be nicer than the 5 spot, if thats a concern for you. But between the two bikes, try to ride them both, and I would imagine that you could not go wrong either way.

Now, if you want a XC bike, you may even consider the Truth and or Flux. Never riden either one, but the Truth seems to be a great all around XC bike and the later models do not seem to have reliability issues. I don't know anything about the Flux. I'm sure some owners of each type will be happy to respond.

Good luck with your search!

FB
 

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JKF said:
yeah it seems after all, i will need 2 bikes, but having 6 bikes is a bit excessive i think. im only going to be a mechanic for a few more weeks, so thats the end of that perk!

chaparral for freeride, and an id / 5-spot for the cape epic?
I owned an Id, a 5 spot, and now a Moment. The Spot is a great bike, it's easier to flick around than the Moment, but is much less stable on the downhills. Overall, I like the Moment more, It's rear end is simply better, it soaks hits better, it has absolutly no lateral flex and it's bb is a little taller, but still inspires you with tons of confidence . It also handles better with a>125 mm fork, like the RockShox Pike, or the Fox 36 that seems to fit this bike like a glove.
The Id is simply a long legged XC bike. I didn't like the way it handeled at all.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
so what's the actual designated use of the Moment?

looks too long for a trail bike, and whats the maximum you can launch it off? but looks a bit heavy to go uphill. as i say, im mostly a dh'er and am not light on components (never broken a chain, but 5 bbs in a year with not that much riding)

if i went for the chaparral for an fr bike, which would be the best enduro bike for an aggresive (likes to pedal and overtake on the downhills) rider, 5 spot? id? moment?

or is this launching bike impossible with changing to a lighter shock / forks / wheels / lightweight kit for the epic
 

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What did id riders think of id before moment came out ?

I'm relatively new to this forum but have noticed that quite a few moment owners used to have ids and quite a few id riders are considering changing to a moment.

Is this because the moment will do everything the id will do and more ?

Also, having just bought an id, which i'm genuinely very happy with, can id riders explain to me what limitations the bike has from a 'what you can do with it' perspective.

I'm just interested and wondering if in a couple of years i'll be moving over too. Next year i'm moving to Austria to live and thus my riding will change slightly. I don't anticipate my wheels ever leaving the ground but i do like to move quite fast on descents. I do like/plan to do loads of epics though (events like Transalp)

I know the Id has been labelled a long travel xc bike but what does that ACTUALLY mean ?

Any thoughts on any of that ?
 

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for me, the Id is the perfect bike...as most of my riding is on forest trails with sandy conditions (dune areas around Georgian Bay) i need something that is stiff, responds quickly in tight corners, and gets me through the stumps and roots. The high bottom bracket and 5" travel is perfect, and until recently, have been planted firmly on the ground

am now riding with a more aggressive group and am looking at something that will take a beating in the rocks of Blue Mountain (really only a bigger hill), but the Id is the perfect trail XC bike for fast downhills through the trees and in the dunes, have never seen anything that climbs like the Id. The Moment was very similar but in my test rides but seemed not to respond as quickly in tight turns and was bit heavier as well

but then, i'm 55, the Id makes me feel 40 again

Cheers
 

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I think you could build a Moment up to be just about anything you wanted. With the new DHX air coming out and the Fox 36, you could have6" of air travel. That equates to light weight.

Maybe the difference between the enduro and hucking would be as simple as switching wheels/tires and compression rates. A riding friend of mine (Squeaky Wheel) rides a 6-Pack like JM's and he's doing lots of XC/trail riding on it. With a Fox 36 up front and lots lightweight/high quality parts, his bike is around 32 lbs, maybe less. That's with bigger tires and brakes and a coil DHX. Built a different way, he could easily get under 30lbs.

So I think the Moment frame could do what you wanted. Now if you wanted to WIN that enduro race, then you're back to two bikes.

Other bikes to consider:

* Ventana X5 (different travel options, different rear triangle set ups)
* Titus Super Moto (with diff linkages, you can build different bikes with the same frame. A guy I rode with last night said this is the best bike he's ever ridden, comparing it to Turner, Ells, Spec, etc.)
* Specialized Enduro
 

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BTW, the pack weighs an honest 31.4lbs, as weighed today at my shop. Put a DHX air on it (when it comes out) and slightly lighter tires, and it's 30lbs, or put an RP3 on it and it's 30lbs.
 

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My .02. Ok, its long. More like a buck and a quarter.

dizzyone said:
I'm relatively new to this forum but have noticed that quite a few moment owners used to have ids and quite a few id riders are considering changing to a moment.
Is this because the moment will do everything the id will do and more ?
Also, having just bought an id, which i'm genuinely very happy with, can id riders explain to me what limitations the bike has from a 'what you can do with it' perspective.
I know the Id has been labelled a long travel xc bike but what does that ACTUALLY mean ?
Any thoughts on any of that ?
I think you see riders moving away from the Id because it was largely misunderstood when it first came out. Everyone saw 6" travel and said "Dude, it must be freeride." I have seen loads of them built up with 8" rotors, 150mm travel forks, humungous wide bars and beefed out tires and wheels (except in the rear). Couple of problems with that. The bike's headtube is too steep and the top tube is too long a FR bike. Also, the high bottom bracket is needed to keep the rider in the optimal 1-3" drop from the saddle to the bars that XC riders like. If you raise the front of the bike with longer travel, you have to raise the BB to get the rider back into a good pedaling position. FR riders want the bars above the saddle, so you will usually see a huge riser stem and/or set of headset spacers on an Id that someone is trying to turn into a huckster rig - and ultimately unhappy with. The reason bikes like the Moment or the 5 Spot dont climb like the Id is not suspension or weight so much, it is geometry. The Id favors climbing geometry over descending geometry, to put it another way.

I had an Id, sold it, tried a Cannondale Prophet (also a high bb - it is an east coast thing, I think), and a Specialized Stumpjumper 120. Both are big XC bikes, really. But there is no beating a 4 bar (and one pivot has to be on the rear of the chainstay, forget rear seatstay pivots). Also, the Stumpy has a lower than average BB. Your pedals bang on top of all kinds of stuff as you ride the rough. I will take a high BB over a low BB any day. So I bought another Id frame and plan to build it back up. From what I can gather, the Id will change soon and get way from it's big XC formula that has everyone so confused. If that is true, it will be a shame, but Ellsworth has mostly itself to blame for perpetuating the idea that the Id was a freeride bike to start with.
 

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@ DirtDad : You're opinion seems to be honest about the Id's out there. I builded up mine for a little rough stuff; it climbed well for sure! But with a 150mm fork (Z150SL), the bike felt just too tall (because of te high bottom bracket and more of because the top tube is so high...) Top tube clearence was'nt really a big concern for me as I never had to dismount in those "hard" situations... The bike climbed great but was a little too nervous from what I expected. SO I SETTLED MY CHOICE ON THE MOMENT... What a smart move! This bike is what I have expected the Id to be... Stable on downhills, top tube clearence, a more relax position... And guess what, when I put a Vanilla R fork with the Float R in the back, this bike is even lighter than my Id was! I've finally find a perfect fit! :cool:
 

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raceimp said:
@ DirtDad : You're opinion seems to be honest about the Id's out there. I builded up mine for a little rough stuff; it climbed well for sure! But with a 150mm fork (Z150SL), the bike felt just too tall (because of te high bottom bracket and more of because the top tube is so high...) Top tube clearence was'nt really a big concern for me as I never had to dismount in those "hard" situations... The bike climbed great but was a little too nervous from what I expected. SO I SETTLED MY CHOICE ON THE MOMENT... What a smart move! This bike is what I have expected the Id to be... Stable on downhills, top tube clearence, a more relax position... And guess what, when I put a Vanilla R fork with the Float R in the back, this bike is even lighter than my Id was! I've finally find a perfect fit! :cool:
My thoughts exactly...
 

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If you're going to ride constantly rough trails with both uphill and downhill steep sections and are mainly going to keep your wheels on the ground, the Id is an excellent choice. I recommend using the shorter (7.5" eye to eye) shock to make it the so called California edition. I think that's how the bike should originally have been sold and in fact is how it is pictured in the current Ellsworth catalog.

The Moment built light would probably be just about as good but is a little beefier and heavier than necessary for the kind of riding I referred to.

Ellsworth can indeed be blamed for originally marketing it as a freeride bike.
 
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