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GAME ON!
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
i'm wondering if anyone has gone from riding a dw-link bike to riding an enduro (or similar) and if they could inform me as to noticeable differences. i am considering this switch as my 2006 IH mkiii is prone to breaking and i'd like to jump ship before i am forced to.
 

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I had a SC Blur LT at the same time as my Enduro. The SC was set up very light. After 3 local rides on it and six crashes, I hated it with a passion. But, I did manage to sell it for a slight profit.

You will notice the FSR works better and is stiffer than your old bike.
 

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I've never owned a DW-link bike, but I've read about many of the bikes that have it.

My gut says your MKIII's suspension is a better all around performer than an Enduro. DW also likely behaves better during hard jamming, unless you've got an enduro with a boost valve fox or something like the Manitou Evolver ISX.
 

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forget about the 07-09 enduros, go for the 10 ones or older enduro sx(05)!!!
I have to say the suspension on the new enduro feels very similar to a dw link(mate's ibis)
personally id perfer 10 enduro coz its i like it's more active, plush suspension feel instead of the pedal efficiency bla bla bla (in which i will get a stumpjumper to compare instead of enduro), anyway overall new enduro handles drops, jumps better than mates dw link which is more of my style!!
go for a test ride if im you, try it out yourself and see what you perfer
 

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The Other Dude
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darkshadow said:
forget about the 07-09 enduros, go for the 10 ones or older enduro sx(05)!!!
+1 on that statement!

In my opinion you are comparing the 2 best tried and true suspension designs out on the market right now. I own a 2010 Enduro expert, if you get a chance to ride one, i would seriously recommend it, the bike rocks, and unlike a lot of all mtn bikes that "can" ride everything, this one rides everything well, and its one of the few bikes that work so well stock, that i have not wanted to change/upgrade too much on it.
 

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Team Blindspot
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PB Matrix said:
I had a SC Blur LT at the same time as my Enduro. The SC was set up very light. After 3 local rides on it and six crashes, I hated it with a passion. But, I did manage to sell it for a slight profit.

You will notice the FSR works better and is stiffer than your old bike.
Umm.... Your SC is not a DW link bike. It's a VPP. :rolleyes:
 

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The old 07 to 09 horst link and the new 2010 horst link suspension is basically the same if you run the math on it,
I think its so funny that everytime there is a different looking fsr set up ---( or any new set up ), everybody thinks its so different.

In reality there is not much difference at all.

The big difference in most suspensions is how the shock is tuned , and how well you can alter it for your style and needs .

The DW link is a good design and I like the 5 spot , I had to alter the shock to suit my style and needs , but when I got it valved where I wanted it , it was close to my FSR bikes,
2010 or 08 enduro .

These designs are all good and can be made to suit many different riders :thumbsup:
 

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saturnine said:
i'm wondering if anyone has gone from riding a dw-link bike to riding an enduro (or similar)
Its usually the other way around.

My prediction for 2012 - Specialized abandons the horst link due to the expense of defending the patents and having so many customers jump ship to ibis, turner and pivot. They license DW link and switch their entire line over to it. That guy dave buys his own island and spends his new fortune building a theme park with living dinosaurs. :D

Seriously though... buy what you like and what fits well. Your iron horse isn't bad because of the suspension design, its bad because they can't build a frame right.
 

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GAME ON!
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
92gli said:
Seriously though... buy what you like and what fits well. Your iron horse isn't bad because of the suspension design, its bad because they can't build a frame right.
that's true. i love the suspension, but the frame worries me. if i had the money to go to ibis or turner i would in a heartbeat, but i don't. the only reason i ask is that i've had a 2009 enduro frame offered to me for $700 CAD and it seems like a great deal for that bike.

as for the '10 enduro.. if i had $2500 to spend on a frame, it certainly wouldn't be a specialized.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
JCL said:
Go on then I'll bite.

I have the money and I can not think of a better 160mm AM frame than the Enduro.
'09 turner 5spot. i know it's only 140mm, but that's where my money would go. plus, i don't really have to have 160mm but it's a nice extra. and i suppose a 6point, but it's a little piggy.
 

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saturnine said:
'09 turner 5spot. i know it's only 140mm, but that's where my money would go. plus, i don't really have to have 160mm but it's a nice extra. and i suppose a 6point, but it's a little piggy.
The head angle is two degrees too steep for serious tech descents. I'd also bet the Enduro is as light and stiffer too. From my knowledge the only 160mm bikes that have proper AM geometry along with the Enduro are the Orange Alpine 160, Banshee Spitfire and the new Evil Sect. The rest have XC geometry which is totally pointless with 150mm+.
 

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saturnine said:
'09 turner 5spot. i know it's only 140mm, but that's where my money would go. plus, i don't really have to have 160mm but it's a nice extra. and i suppose a 6point, but it's a little piggy.
JCL is correct , as much as I liked the 5 spot, it could not pedal as well or climb as well as my enduro,
and when charging DH there is no chance the spot was as stable or plush.

And when you add a 160mm fork on the spot it really screws up the climbing , ( the spot would lift the ft easily with the 140 )I have a modded 160mm e-150 on my enduro and it climbs just the same as it did with the 150 mm travel ( of course the e-150 still has its same A to C measurement in 160 as it did in 150 ) ------
These enduros are really hard to beat for AM bikes .
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
here's my summation of dw-link ride properties; compare to your fsr. works optimally with about 33% sag. sits super high in its travel even with sag and feels bottomless. i can't remember a time when i've had a noticeable bottom out, but the ziptie is right at the end of the shock's travel. as you climb, the shock actually extends its travel and pushes the rear downwards. this is with zero compression/propedal.
 

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Bug74 said:
So is the FSR stuff holding up to the DWLink well? Does it really feel that plush over square edge bumps?
The short dual link bikes have been around along time , the v.pp, maestro , Marin's quad link, BMC's APS series, karpiel's disco, schwinn rocket 88, the DW link------the system is a 4 bar and it can work well.

So this is not new , some of the iron horse bikes had to steep of a progressive rate twards the mid and end of stroke and were harsh , but you could valve a shock around it .

The Pivot is stiff and harsh if you do not run the large can on the shock, and have a plush tune on the shock , The turner as well ----( I could easily bottom the 5 spot badly , and the sweet spot was in the middle ring , not the small ring )-----this works well untill you start slaming on the bike and then you can have a bottoming problem you need to solve for.

So the DSL 4 bar , and or the Horst link 4 bar do all work , The tune of the shock is major importaint on how plush the bike will be and its resistance to bottoming.

Either set up will work without the PP on , and be plush over squair edge bumps , the anti squat works on either set up and is greater in the small ring where its needed most, the movement of the instant center migration is similar.--( the HL bike had a wider sweet spot in more gears than the DW 5 spot )

The big problem with the DSL bikes is the sweet spot is easily missed unless you have a set sag , the horst link is way more forgiving and the sweet spot is there through a wider range of ride heights no matter what the sag .

All this stuff is not new , and the HL has been around longer and really does work nicley, Dave is getting the DW better all the time too.

I really like Dave's newer DELTA system on the Evil Revolt , this will be one of his best designs of all.
 

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92gli said:
Its usually the other way around.

My prediction for 2012 - Specialized abandons the horst link due to the expense of defending the patents and having so many customers jump ship to ibis, turner and pivot. They license DW link and switch their entire line over to it. That guy dave buys his own island and spends his new fortune building a theme park with living dinosaurs. :D

Seriously though... buy what you like and what fits well. Your iron horse isn't bad because of the suspension design, its bad because they can't build a frame right.
You may be on to something. The FSR patent runs out soon and I would bet money that they are looking to buying something like the dw patent. I would bet they would spend big money as well...
 

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S-Works said:
Umm.... Your SC is not a DW link bike. It's a VPP. :rolleyes:
Actually the vpp is a DW link, it does not say DW on it , but it is a "Short dual link" bike all the same , the SDL bikes are not new ------they are a 4 bar and so is the Horst Link bike .
These two set ups have been around along time
 
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