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Fo' Bidniz in da haus
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Are there more than subtle differences between these rims? I am leaning towards a King wheelset for sure but am confused as to what rim is better under which scenario...basically, I do not know enough to differentiate them or does it even matter since they are all relatively comparable?

Cheers
 

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Do It Yourself
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In this size/weight range, the DT are tops in quality and durability but also cost a few bucks more. I haven't used them but the VXC are well priced and I've heard relatively good things. I don't think the Mavic 717 have significantly changed from the 317 which were the lightest of the bunch but also prone to dings.

You also might look at the Bontrager Mustang Disc. Real world weight is about 20g-40g heavier each than the others mentioned but they have a 2mm wider bead width (19mm vs 17mm for the others). This give the tire a wider profile and works out better with bigger tires. I have a buddy using these and he's been real happy with them. He has broken his Spec. Enduro frame several times but the wheels have been fine. I still haven't seen anything that can compete with the Mustang Disc execpt the Mavic F519 and XM719. The only caveat is they are only available through a Trek dealer (Trek, GF, Klein).
 

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Fo' Bidniz in da haus
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks for the prompt feedback...

Homebrew said:
In this size/weight range, the DT are tops in quality and durability but also cost a few bucks more. I haven't used them but the VXC are well priced and I've heard relatively good things. I don't think the Mavic 717 have significantly changed from the 317 which were the lightest of the bunch but also prone to dings.

You also might look at the Bontrager Mustang Disc. Real world weight is about 20g-40g heavier each than the others mentioned but they have a 2mm wider bead width (19mm vs 17mm for the others). This give the tire a wider profile and works out better with bigger tires. I have a buddy using these and he's been real happy with them. He has broken his Spec. Enduro frame several times but the wheels have been fine. I still haven't seen anything that can compete with the Mustang Disc execpt the Mavic F519 and XM719. The only caveat is they are only available through a Trek dealer (Trek, GF, Klein).
Thanks so much. I think for this bike (a project XC race bike) i will stay as light as possible. i should have mentioned the intent of the bike...

At this point, I am considering the DT Swiss rim / King wheelset at hammerheadbikes. I really like dealing with Charles or Larry (mtnhighcyclery) and have heard good things about this particular build.

I guess I should have also asked about spokes. At what point should one go with more robust spokes? For an approx 175-180 lb rider, would Supercomps be ok should Competition spokes be used?

Cheers
 

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Do It Yourself
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The King/DT combo is a good one. I've been beating on mine for over a year and they've held up very well. I definitely think you can get away with SuperComps in the front and maybe the nondriveside rear but would probably use Comps on the driveside. I'm using all Comps just due to the lower cost. I was spending enough on them as it was. My last front wheel was a King/317 with SuperComps and held up fine until I folded the sidewall on the rim. Brass nipples will be a good idea for the driveside as well, the rest should be fine with alloy. That limits you to black or silver if you want to match though.
 

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zeebot
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Homebrew said:
The King/DT combo is a good one. I've been beating on mine for over a year and they've held up very well. I definitely think you can get away with SuperComps in the front and maybe the nondriveside rear but would probably use Comps on the driveside. I'm using all Comps just due to the lower cost. I was spending enough on them as it was. My last front wheel was a King/317 with SuperComps and held up fine until I folded the sidewall on the rim. Brass nipples will be a good idea for the driveside as well, the rest should be fine with alloy. That limits you to black or silver if you want to match though.
FWIW, I use the velocity vxc. from what i've learned they are stronger than the 717 and just a tiny bit heavier. i was going to get the DT but was talked out of them due to their slightly heavier weight and apparently not any stronger than VXC quality.

the front is on an american classic disc lite and the rear is currently laced to a hope bulb. I've riden the rims solely on a hardtail single speed and also full rigid for a good chunk of the past 6 months. I ride a pretty fat 2.5 weirwolf up front and have no issues with the big tire like was mentioned and in the rear a 2.4 mutanoraptor...also no issues. they seem strong but the old rear VXC i had laced to the wtb laser disc lite that crapped out had a pretty big ding on it from a rock but they were exposed to hell over countless miles and never had to be trued.
 

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Trail rider and racer
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Larry built me up a set of VXC/King ISO at about roughly this time last year and after a years tough riding on them, numerous multi-day/2/8/24hr races and tons of trail riding they are still performing strong.

I went VXCs because they were cheaper then the DTs, just as tough an a little bit lighter too, and also better, rounder and stronger then the likes of a Mavic X317/717 rim.

Either option would be cool. DT products are very popular and it seems their rims are perfect.
 

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MTBR Tool
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Trevor! said:
Larry built me up a set of VXC/King ISO at about roughly this time last year and after a years tough riding on them, numerous multi-day/2/8/24hr races and tons of trail riding they are still performing strong.

I went VXCs because they were cheaper then the DTs, just as tough an a little bit lighter too, and also better, rounder and stronger then the likes of a Mavic X317/717 rim.

Either option would be cool. DT products are very popular and it seems their rims are perfect.
After a long conversation w/Mike Garcia I ended up going w/the DT XR4.1's. They've held up well although I did make the mistake of not pulling up on a very flat tire and put 2 dings in the rear while flailing around in a rock garden. Since that point tho they have been solid.
 

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Trail rider and racer
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Srexy said:
After a long conversation w/Mike Garcia I ended up going w/the DT XR4.1's. They've held up well although I did make the mistake of not pulling up on a very flat tire and put 2 dings in the rear while flailing around in a rock garden. Since that point tho they have been solid.
I have heard nothing but good comments about the rims. Seems the DT Swiss rims are spot on perfect. One of the LBS basically sells DT rims only for MTB and Road since the feedback has been so good.
 

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Tubeless kit available for DT XR4.1D

One consideration that might be of interest when comparing these rims is the availability of the DT-labeled version of the Eclipse tubeless kit for the XR4.1d. For folks that are considering a tubless conversion, it gives them a factory approved solution that has been tested for compatibility with that specific rim. DT has told me that the bead-hook section on the XR4.1d is also slightly more pronounced to enable it to better engage UST tires. (Of course, what true weight weenie would be running a UST tire???)

So it was allegedly designed with an eye toward it being able to operate as a tubeless rim. Of course, there are also lots of folks running the X317/XC717 Disc and the VXC as tubeless wheels. Still, I kind of like the idea of having a factory approved tubeless rim/kit combo. If you are using a Mavic or Velocity non-UST product with a tubeless kit, the rim manufacturer isn't going to be very supportive if you are having comptibility issues. They'll just tell you "Don't".
 

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Get your freak on!
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bianchi4me said:
One consideration that might be of interest when comparing these rims is the availability of the DT-labeled version of the Eclipse tubeless kit for the XR4.1d. For folks that are considering a tubless conversion, it gives them a factory approved solution that has been tested for compatibility with that specific rim. DT has told me that the bead-hook section on the XR4.1d is also slightly more pronounced to enable it to better engage UST tires. (Of course, what true weight weenie would be running a UST tire???)

So it was allegedly designed with an eye toward it being able to operate as a tubeless rim. Of course, there are also lots of folks running the X317/XC717 Disc and the VXC as tubeless wheels. Still, I kind of like the idea of having a factory approved tubeless rim/kit combo. If you are using a Mavic or Velocity non-UST product with a tubeless kit, the rim manufacturer isn't going to be very supportive if you are having comptibility issues. They'll just tell you "Don't".
Any idea on the cost of those kits?

BTW, I also feel DT are very nice rims. But so are the velocity and the 717's. But if your not to worried about weight, then go DT. But I don't think you can really go wrong with any of them:)
 

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(aka SS_MB-7)
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FoShizzle said:
At this point, I am considering the DT Swiss rim / King wheelset at hammerheadbikes. I really like dealing with Charles or Larry (mtnhighcyclery) and have heard good things about this particular build.
I went with the following wheelset for my Racer-X 100 that I used during the TransRockies:
- Hubs: King
- Rims: DT Swiss XR 4.1d
- Spokes: DT Revolution
- Total weight = 738g (front) + 875g (rear) = 1613g

I've been bashing on this wheelset since July (so 4 solid months) and they are still true. Keep in mind that I'm only 135lbs, but I've been a little more daring with my new RX-100, so the wheels aren't being ridden lightly or babied ;)



On my SS, I've got a similiar set-up with the exception of the rims and front Hope Bulb hub, which refuses to die...on this set, I'm using Sun DS1-XCs. These wheels are now over 4-yrs old and have been to hell-and-back.
 

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Feeding your addiction
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I've built a lot with all 3 rims and while they are all very good I definitely prefer the DT. They are stiffer than the other 2, and seem to be stronger (also the heviest of the 3, but not by much). Quality control (straightness/roundness, seam quality) is the best on the DT. I seem to consistently spend less time truing with the DT's than the others. As for spokes, I think the Supercomp would be perfect for what you want. I have lots of customers in your weight range (and heavier for that matter) running them with zero problems.
Larry Mettler
http://www.mtnhighcyclery.com
 

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mainly roadie
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After a lot of research, etc. I decided on a set of DT XR4.1/DT 240s/DT SuperComp.
This was Mike Garcia's recommendation (90kg rider, XC use). He will build them.

I also spoke with Dave Thomas and with Larry at Mtn High.
They were all great (and I have a pair of Dave Thomas, excellent road wheels) but the price and build of Mike's suggestion was the best for me.
 

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.

Likewise, I also went with DT XR4.1/DT SuperComp, but chose the kings for reliability. I have another set of wheels with 317's, and to be honest, I haven't had any truing issues in 1.5 seasons.

I knew this wouldn't be the lightest wheel set, but for a main set of wheels that will see general trail riding, enduros, and some short races, I think they are a perfect combination of components.

I had Larry at Mtn High build them for me, and am currently awaiting my package with much anticipation.
 

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cadence90 said:
After a lot of research, etc. I decided on a set of DT XR4.1/DT 240s/DT SuperComp.
This was Mike Garcia's recommendation (90kg rider, XC use). He will build them.

I also spoke with Dave Thomas and with Larry at Mtn High.
They were all great (and I have a pair of Dave Thomas, excellent road wheels) but the price and build of Mike's suggestion was the best for me.
Do you typically run with tubes, or tubeless, on your DT XR4.1's?
 

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ballbuster
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Secodn the Bontis

I got a set of those on Hope XC/Sport hubs, whichever they are calling them this week.

I also had a set of Bonti Mustangs for rim brakes on XT hubs, also held up well.

I weight 195# and ride the steeps and rocky bits a lot, and no issues as of yet. I flat spotted my old Bonti rear rim on a nasty rock while running 30 psi, but oddly enough, didn't pinch flat. Still true, but the rim wall is tweaked out a tad.

Weight is decent, but not stupid light. 420g each, IIRC, which is the same as the DT Swiss.

They have UST strips for them that go for like $12-15 each. I tried a homebrew UST on them with a non-UST tire without good results. I may try a UST tire if I can find one of decent weight. I prolly need a proper UST presta stem as well. I used one cut from a Bontrager tube with a removable core with lots of sealant around it. It leaked. O-well!
 

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My apologies for semi highjacking this thread, I am in the market for a light 28H disk rims. Out of the 3 rims mentioned here only the XR4.1D and perhaps the VXC (custom drilled from factory) do 28H. I am going to used rim strip tubless are there any other rim choices?

I wish there is a 717 28H disk....
 
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