[willie b]

I have been looking at several 5 to 6 inch travel bikes for all mountan (Heckler and '05 Reign 3 frames specifically). I don't want to spend more than a grand for the frame, so my choices ar a bit limited. I came across the add at CBO http://www.cambriabike.com/shopexd.asp?id=26958 , for an '05 Distance. I saw the new verion at the Competative Cyclist; http://www.competitivecyclist.com/za/CCM?PAGE=PRODUCT&PRODUCT.ID=1810 . My question is, what is the difference between the '05 and '06 other than the tubing? Why did they change? Is the frame change stronger or stiffer or lighter? The Ellsworth site is not active for the frame, it says "in development". I have read all of the posts on the frame here. There was one bad and several great. Also, I don't have any experience with Manitou rear shocks, so I am a little gun shy of the deal at CBO. One final queston, does the ATLAS rear triangle have a replaceable hanger or not, I can't tell from the photos I have seen.

Thanks for any help.

 

[zeb]

You can zoom details on competivecyclist site.Yes all Distance models has replaceble hanger :all new frames have same type as moment etc...One hanger fits all frames.

 

[chad1433]

The change in the frame stems from the change in manufacturing facilities - Ellsworth was outsourcing the frames to a company that owned the square frame design (SAPA I think). But now they make them in-house, so they changed the design. I don't believe these frames are currently being manufactured, so if you order one, you'd be waiting a while.

They're fun bikes to ride, so if you're interested in the Distance, you won't be unhappy. :thumbsup:

 

[willie b]

Same topic new question...

Thanks Chad and Zeb.:thumbsup:

I also have researched the Cannondale Prophet for comparison as well. Everyone loves the Prophet too (albeit out of my price range). How does the durability of the Distance compare to the Heckler or the Prophet? Both of which have good frame integrity and warranties. Frame weights seem to be in the same ballpark. I am not big, only 6' and 170lbs, however I do plan to jump the bike. In additon if I get a Distance, it will be replacing a Giant NRS as my XC bike as well. I really don't know if the Distance can be an XC bike and a All-Mtn bike at the same time. The main issue I have is not knowing anyone that has one for a test ride. So, I am counting on the feedback I get to help me with the decision.

 

[chad1433]

The Distance will be up to some heavy duty trail riding.

Compared to a Prophet, they're similar, but the geometry will probably be East Coast vs. West Coast style, so you may take that into consideration. Also, with Cannondale, you're often slated to that 1.5" headtube, which means "Lefty". If that doesn't bother you, then you'd be ok.

If you can't wait for a bike, you might look for a used ride...the Jokers are still good bikes and can be built up for trail/AM and FR, depending on your wallet! The Joker and the Distance will ride very similar.

On the flip side, the Heckler is a great bike and it can run the gammit of all the things you're looking to do. I don't know how it would directly compare with the Distance, but design-wise, they seem very similar. The SC seems to have a more progressive leverage ratio which helps it ramp up more at the end of it's travel. I've read that there are some shocks that work better with this type of ratio. The Distance seems like it is more linear, more XC/trail than jump/FR. Of course, this can be mediated with various suspension parts and/or upgrades (like a Push mod).

Of course, the Heckler is cheaper by about $100. It is capable of running a 6" fork up front, too. But you might want to size them first. I believe that the TTs of the Hecklers are short for that style of bike, while the Distance will tend to be longer. You'll want to scrutinize the geometry of each bike before you purchase, just so you know what you're getting into. The frame is a platform for all the stuff you're going to bolt to it, so if you know what that will be, it will help you decide, too. Air or coil, 6" or 5", 25mm or 28mm rims (or greater?), etc.

 

[willie b]

One final question:

Looks like CBO is out of '05 Distances so the decision has just gotten a lot easier. I probably will not end up with an Ellswroth. Either way I am still on the hunt for now and will look into the used Joker market as you suggested. The only question I have there is what length air shock to get 5 inches? I don't necessarily want the Romic Coil that comes on the Joker. It might screw the geometry to put a shorter shock in additon to increasing the over-all price. Two problems I don't want to have.

I don't break things as a matter of fact my NRS has 24 spoke UST wheels and I usually run under 30 psi. I have had them for 6 years without a single problem (jinx). I don't plan on building the indestructable bike. I was just reassuring myself that people are not breaking the Ellsworth frames like they were in the 1990's.

For what it is worth, I have had an extensive test ride, all-mtn and XC, on a Heckler. I wasn't blown away by the bike. It was fun, don't get me wrong. The TT is short for a 19 inch frame. But I could remedy that with a longer stem. Plus, it had a Marz66 on it and the HT angle was probably close to 66 degrees when I sat on the bike. I had a difficult time putting the front wheel where I wanted. If I do get a Heckler, I would put my TALAS on there which would help return the angle to 68 or 9 degrees. Also, the bike I rode was close to 35 or 6 pounds, I need it to be under 30 to do all of the things I want it to do. All of that said, I probably won't end up with one of those either.

Thanks again for your input.
Later,

 

[chad1433]

I don't remember what size bike you needed, but the Orange Peel bike shop in Steamboat Springs, CO has what looks like a large blue Distance frame in stock with a sticker that says "20% off". You might give them a call, if this is your size and you still want a Distance. It's a nice looking bike.

http://orangepeelbikes.com/

 

[Biker Tom]

Got one, love it.

:thumbsup: I hit on the Cambria deal last winter... And am very Happy with it. The Frame quality and design is outstanding. I like to buy USA made products when I can. No regrets here. Very tight handling in the corners. I also didn't want the Swinger but had no choice. I have to say I am really impressed with the SPV platform and at this point wouldn't trade it. We'll see how it holds up long term, it's got about 500 miles of Michigan single track on it so far. The Swinger balances very well with the Marzocchi 120 MX Pro ETA Fork I have on it. I stripped out a perfectly good GT i-drive I had extensively upgraded to build this bike. Except for alot of good mermorys I don't miss the GT at all. The GT weighted 33 pounds. Same components on the Distance brought it in at 29. Put on light weight wheels, Single Digit 7's (by-by disc's I don't miss you a bit) and a Thomson post - 28 lbs. I Have a carbon bar and lighter seat on the way - might put me below 27... with 5 inches of travel... I love it! Light going up and rock-on down the hills...
Tom

 

[[email protected]]

Hey all. Super busy here but wanted to drop in. There is no such thing as an 06 distance. The one on the Competitive site is a prototype that never was produced--probably for 07. The Distance is a great bike--it was my 1st Ellsworth long before I worked here and it is like no other single pivot. But the Distance hooks us so well and can take a huge amount of punishment. There are several around the country still in dealerships you might check with Tani at the Path in Tustin, Ca or Webcyclery in Bend, OR. I love that bike and I can't wait for it to come back!

 

[Unsatisfied Customer]

Tony Ellsworth is a Crook of the Highest Order

Anthony Ellsworth is a crook of the highest order... you should believe all of the posts questioning his integrity. He simply has no integrity. He is a very, very bad man. He makes a defective product and does not honor his contracts. I would NEVER do business with this man or his company EVER!!!!

 

[Lobbydosser]

Anthony Ellsworth is a crook of the highest order... you should believe all of the posts questioning his integrity. He simply has no integrity. He is a very, very bad man. He makes a defective product and does not honor his contracts. I would NEVER do business with this man or his company EVER!!!!

After some detective work, I discovered that the above poster "Unsatisfied Customer" is actually an ex-girlfriend of Tony Ellsworth when they both went to college.

Back in those days life was wonderful, walking hand in hand, sharing popcorn at the movies, talking about their future together, until... Tony got into biking. The clingy girlfried got the bullet and Tony discovered the joys of fast singletrack and beer.

Fast forward 30 years and the embittered ex is back with a vengance :madmax:

Funny thing is Tony seems to have quite a few ex-girlfriends

Cheers,

Lobby

Ride it like you stole it!

 

[Unsatisfied Customer]

Lobbydosser... you are funny!

Hey Lobby --

Great "detective" work... are you Tony Ellsworth's secret lover??? It would explain a lot of things about this man. Sorry, but you are wrong, wrong, wrong. I am a customer of Tony's whose warranty he failed to honor. But, from what I've read, that's par for the course with this man who is short in stature but big on bullying.

It is obvious that the way I was treated about my Truth warranty is apparently par for the course with Tony "The Liar" Ellsworth. I have also checked around town and this is seems to be a consistent story about this jerk. How he's still in business is a mystery.

Sorry to disappoint....

 

[chad1433]

Just so you know, we don't lend much credibility to folks who've got 2 total posts and come on just to flame.

You want to add something constructive, then do that. But don't expect much sympathy from us. We've heard it all before...years ago. And whether you like it or not, many of us have had good customer experiences with Ellsworth. Dave has provided good feedback and attention to owners in need. You look more like "Uniformed Customer" to us...ut:

 

[Unsatisfied Customer]

New to Site

Yes, I did just find this site last night. I happened to Google Tony Ellsworth (since I have been so mistreated by him and his CS dept), and low and behold I found all kinds of posts from people who have the SAME problems!

And, like I said, it does not appear that TE has updated his customer service despite the public outcry. Glad your experience has been great -- mine sure has not! This guy is a crook and his colors really show when a problem emerges.

As I said, from what I have found out in our town (I live in San Diego), Tony's reputation in town is for being a sheisty business man -- and not just with his own company. Sorry if you don't want to accept it, but that is my experience. Glad you like his product, but I'm sticking to the bigger companies where I know I'll be taken care of if a problem occurs.

 

[chad1433]

Yes, I did just find this site last night. I happened to Google Tony Ellsworth (since I have been so mistreated by him and his CS dept), and low and behold I found all kinds of posts from people who have the SAME problems!

And, like I said, it does not appear that TE has updated his customer service despite the public outcry. Glad your experience has been great -- mine sure has not! This guy is a crook and his colors really show when a problem emerges.

As I said, from what I have found out in our town (I live in San Diego), Tony's reputation in town is for being a sheisty business man -- and not just with his own company. Sorry if you don't want to accept it, but that is my experience. Glad you like his product, but I'm sticking to the bigger companies where I know I'll be taken care of if a problem occurs.

I'm farily certain you haven't found posts like that in well over two years. And you haven't noted what your problem was, so we cannot see that it's the same.

Customer service HAS improved. I suspect you aren't actually reading enough posts. In fact, in this VERY THREAD, Dave has taken time out to respond to a potential customer.

I know there are excellent companies out there with great warranties. You should buy and ride what you like. But whatever you're trying to convey to us here has all been done before. We don't come here to debate anyone's character - just share our experiences. If you want to share yours, you should be more specific because generalizing doesn't help.

 

[Zakster]

Troll alert!

0/10 for effort.

 

[[email protected]]

OK, I'll bite.

Welcome to the forum. I am the Vice President of Global Markets for Ellsworth and I run every aspect of our warranty program and our customer service department. I am interested to learn about your problem. Contrary to your comments, Tony has not personally been involved in a warranty claim in nearly two years. Over that period of time we have recrafted our warranty program and completely restaffed our customer service department and have conducted some extensive training imported from a Fortune 500 model which has earned us a great deal of praise (thanks to those who have helped us). I was an Ellsworth customer long before I was an employee and I am well aware of then versus now. And I really think we have made some positive progress. However, we still have a way to go and if we have not acted in accordance with our warranty, I want to know about it.

I would invite you to contact me directly either by phone or email ([email protected]) and I will pull up your incident report and we can see if we can find a satisfactory resolution for you. Or if you like, you can provide me with some information including your serial number as an original owner and we can work it out here on the forum.

Look forward to hearing from you.
Dave

 

[Pinch]

I gotta speak out here. I'm so sick of people saying that TE is a crook or a bad guy. Fortunately it hasn't happened in a while. Unfortunately, I don't think it will ever stop. What do you people know? Have any of you dealt with TE on a personal level? Have you been over to his house for dinner and socialized with him?

Unsatisfied Customer - Until you can provide facts you have no credibility. By your tone we can only suspect that you've had more of a personality clash with TE IF you have even had any interaction with him. I find it a little hard to believe that you had a Truth and just recently found mtbr.com. If you are in to mountain biking enough to have a Truth chances are very good you found mtbr.com a long time ago. If I had to guess I would say that you have an agenda against TE for some reason and are using mtbr.com as a forum to further that agenda.

I am glad that there is so much passion about mountain biking on this site. But, you have to separate the individual from the bike. Despite all your passion you need to realize that designing and manufacturing bicycles is a business. Bike companies are not non-profit organizations. When was the last time that a manufacturer gave away all their bikes for free and stayed in business? My guess is that TE and everyone who puts their name on their product takes a lot of pride in it and works hard to keep their customers happy within reason. What is reasonable to TE/Ells may not be reasonable to DT/Turner or any other manufacturer. None of them are crooks, they are trying to run a business for which you have a real passion. But the fact remains that you don't know what they are like outside of their business. Talk about the bikes all you want, but leave their personal character alone.

 

[Zakster]

I gotta speak out here. I'm so sick of people saying that TE is a crook or a bad guy. Fortunately it hasn't happened in a while. Unfortunately, I don't think it will ever stop. What do you people know? Have any of you dealt with TE on a personal level? Have you been over to his house for dinner and socialized with him?

Unsatisfied Customer - Until you can provide facts you have no credibility. By your tone we can only suspect that you've had more of a personality clash with TE IF you have even had any interaction with him. I find it a little hard to believe that you had a Truth and just recently found mtbr.com. If you are in to mountain biking enough to have a Truth chances are very good you found mtbr.com a long time ago. If I had to guess I would say that you have an agenda against TE for some reason and are using mtbr.com as a forum to further that agenda.

I am glad that there is so much passion about mountain biking on this site. But, you have to separate the individual from the bike. Despite all your passion you need to realize that designing and manufacturing bicycles is a business. Bike companies are not non-profit organizations. When was the last time that a manufacturer gave away all their bikes for free and stayed in business? My guess is that TE and everyone who puts their name on their product takes a lot of pride in it and works hard to keep their customers happy within reason. What is reasonable to TE/Ells may not be reasonable to DT/Turner or any other manufacturer. None of them are crooks, they are trying to run a business for which you have a real passion. But the fact remains that you don't know what they are like outside of their business. Talk about the bikes all you want, but leave their personal character alone.

Well said Pinch. And somehow Dave I don't think this sad person will be contacting you. Lets not feed the troll.

END OF THREAD.