Mountain Bike Reviews Forum banner
1 - 20 of 20 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey,

I´m riding -19 Commencal Meta AM 29 with RS super deluxe ultimate coil right now and I actually love the bike. It´s riding very well, but as always, I´m thinking " Could it be better?"

So anyone want to give thoughts about DHX2 vs RS coil? Would I gain anything switching to DHX2 (Or some other coil perhaps?)

I´m riding XL-frame, Weight around 80-82kg with gears and I´m currently running 450lbs spring with RS. I´m using full travel pretty much everytime, but not feeling too many harsh bottom outs.

So yeah, basically just wondering if good could be better :rolleyes:
 

·
Elitest thrill junkie
Joined
·
38,789 Posts
You should not feel any harsh bottom-outs IME. If you have any event where you can feel the abrupt end of travel, it's too soft.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
514 Posts
I'm waiting on my DHX2 arrival (hopefully today) but only ordered it because RS didn't have anymore of the SDU coil units for my bike. I was opting for that because when needed, a local shop could rebuild it.

So though I can' help you with a comparison, just wanted to bring up that having the RS, you may be able to avoid the crappy shipping out of the shock when needing a rebuild.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
614 Posts
Seems like the CCDB has a better reputation for performance when it comes to poppet style 4-way adjustable shocks than the DHX2?

Had a Float X2 and wasn't all that impressed but every bike/rider is different and I'm not sure how similar the X2 and the DHX2 is for valving.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
686 Posts
I don't have any experience with either. However my recommendations would be to ride the RS dial it in the best you can then when it is do for service send it out have it serviced and retuned if necessary. No matter what shock you have to get the most out of it for your bike and your preferences it need to be tuned for you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks for everyone giving their thoughts. I am indeed feeling harsh bottom outs but only in situations where I actually think I should bottom out. I am still wondering if I should feel them at all in those situations. In fast chatter and rock gardens bike feels awesome, but actually I think worst performance is in slower rough sections. I feel like the back end is not tracking the best way and it kind of hops a little bit too much.

I think after hearing these opinions, switching to another shock is "waste" of money if this one is working properly and in good condition. Maybe in few months when shock is going for rebuild I should get it tuned.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,195 Posts
Biggest advantage of an x2 or ccdb type shock is it’s wide tuning range so if it’s an option to buy first or if your bike came with it then great but to buy one when you already have a good shock that can be custom tuned might not make the most sense. Looking at spring calculator the 450-475 lbs spring should be right do your weight but I have no idea what the leverage curve of the meta am 29 is so it may be too linear for you which makes your options a little more limited.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Yeah, I bought the bike with RS SDU because it was almost 400€ cheaper than dhx2. I prefer Coil shock and I´m thinking about trying out 500lbs spring, hey it´s not big investment and I can always gain some weight so it won´t be wasted money. I´m running pretty high spring rate in my fork also, RS lyrik ultimate, around 85psi atm.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,195 Posts
Yeah, I bought the bike with RS SDU because it was almost 400€ cheaper than dhx2. I prefer Coil shock and I´m thinking about trying out 500lbs spring, hey it´s not big investment and I can always gain some weight so it won´t be wasted money. I´m running pretty high spring rate in my fork also, RS lyrik ultimate, around 85psi atm.
At your weight 85 psi would be the norm for front fork so if your hard bottoming the rear and not the front and the rear has a norm avg sag, typically 30% on that kind of bike then I'm going to lean towards it not being progressive enough. If that's the case then you either get a stiffer spring but that has some downsides like harsher small bump, steeper effective head angle, higher effective BB. With a shock like the x2 (or custom SD) you can run firmer HSC but that can cause a harsher ride if taken too far. The other option that is fairly new option is the progressive rate coil springs now out. If done properly this option should help people running coil shocks on bikes that don't have enough mechanical progression (again I'm not sure where the commencal falls in terms of progression rate)
 

·
Read Only
Joined
·
2,101 Posts
Thanks for everyone giving their thoughts. I am indeed feeling harsh bottom outs but only in situations where I actually think I should bottom out. I am still wondering if I should feel them at all in those situations. In fast chatter and rock gardens bike feels awesome, but actually I think worst performance is in slower rough sections. I feel like the back end is not tracking the best way and it kind of hops a little bit too much.

I think after hearing these opinions, switching to another shock is "waste" of money if this one is working properly and in good condition. Maybe in few months when shock is going for rebuild I should get it tuned.
Bottoming is OK but it shouldn't be harsh as it indicates the energy hasn't been absorbed properly. It indicates either the spring or compression is too soft, but would need to check the frames specific leverage curve to know which
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
At your weight 85 psi would be the norm for front fork so if your hard bottoming the rear and not the front and the rear has a norm avg sag, typically 30% on that kind of bike then I'm going to lean towards it not being progressive enough. If that's the case then you either get a stiffer spring but that has some downsides like harsher small bump, steeper effective head angle, higher effective BB. With a shock like the x2 (or custom SD) you can run firmer HSC but that can cause a harsher ride if taken too far. The other option that is fairly new option is the progressive rate coil springs now out. If done properly this option should help people running coil shocks on bikes that don't have enough mechanical progression (again I'm not sure where the commencal falls in terms of progression rate)
Oh yeah, I thought that I kind of had a bit stiffer front end. Rockshox is suggesting around 75psi for my weight. I've yet to completed my setup so front might end up yet stiffer. Rear I'm around 30%sag. Going to try 500lbs spring as I'm now running pretty much LSC on rear shock also. And small bump is pretty awesome, I just wanna try it out. If it feels too harsh then I'll just go back to 450 spring.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Bottoming is OK but it shouldn't be harsh as it indicates the energy hasn't been absorbed properly. It indicates either the spring or compression is too soft, but would need to check the frames specific leverage curve to know which
As far as I know, Meta AM 29 should have pretty similar leverage curve to AM V4.2 which is here. So maybe this indicates that end ratio is little bit regressive and needs a bottom out resistant from either stiffer spring or compression.
Colorfulness Blue Green Text Slope
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
614 Posts
Dougal (shockcraft) has a good guide on setup. He suggests opening up all the damping (full fast) and then bouncing around on the bike to see how balanced out it is and pay attention to how firm it is.

If your Front/Rear balance is off, it's been my experience it can really mess up how the bike feels and lead you in the wrong direction. Too stiff on one side forces the extra weight onto the opposite side of the bike, particularly on bigger hits. Are you using up all the front travel too when you bottom the back hard?

Maybe a different bottom out bumper would help with the bottoming?
Shape Factor Bumper
 

·
Read Only
Joined
·
2,101 Posts
As far as I know, Meta AM 29 should have pretty similar leverage curve to AM V4.2 which is here. So maybe this indicates that end ratio is little bit regressive and needs a bottom out resistant from either stiffer spring or compression.
View attachment 1274685
The 29er is a little more progressive than that, and needs a relatively firm compression setting. What tune is in the shock? Bumping up to a 500lb spring would be good too
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,195 Posts
Oh yeah, I thought that I kind of had a bit stiffer front end. Rockshox is suggesting around 75psi for my weight. I've yet to completed my setup so front might end up yet stiffer. Rear I'm around 30%sag. Going to try 500lbs spring as I'm now running pretty much LSC on rear shock also. And small bump is pretty awesome, I just wanna try it out. If it feels too harsh then I'll just go back to 450 spring.
My mistake I thought it used a 160 fork which would be 85 for 81kg it's 75 for a 170.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
The 29er is a little more progressive than that, and needs a relatively firm compression setting. What tune is in the shock? Bumping up to a 500lb spring would be good too
Tune is M. I already did order a 500lb spring, as I tried out even harder front without token (Had 1 before) and liked it alot. But now I can feel that front spring rate is way higher than rear and it is not totally balanced. I will settle around 90psi front and 500lbs rear when next trying this out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Dougal (shockcraft) has a good guide on setup. He suggests opening up all the damping (full fast) and then bouncing around on the bike to see how balanced out it is and pay attention to how firm it is.

If your Front/Rear balance is off, it's been my experience it can really mess up how the bike feels and lead you in the wrong direction. Too stiff on one side forces the extra weight onto the opposite side of the bike, particularly on bigger hits. Are you using up all the front travel too when you bottom the back hard?

Maybe a different bottom out bumper would help with the bottoming?
Shape Factor Bumper
Yeah, actually I´ve read that guide many times (even took screenshots to my phone so could easily refer back to it) and first time I tried setuping spring rate with these suggestions and that´s why I have now way higher front PSI than I had before this. I liked it alot more when front was more supportive and it actually felt like I could push to it. But now like I said, balance is a little bit off so have to try harder rear. I´m not using full travel front as often as I´m on back, yea I have 170 front and 160 rear, but still rear feels softer.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,629 Posts
Seems like the CCDB has a better reputation for performance when it comes to poppet style 4-way adjustable shocks than the DHX2?

Had a Float X2 and wasn't all that impressed but every bike/rider is different and I'm not sure how similar the X2 and the DHX2 is for valving.
CC at least have different valve bodies for different applications. Fox is one-size-fits-all. Which is great if it does........

Poppets are really easy to get the low speed feel you want, but really hard to change high speed and to increase total damping energy.

RS Deluxe and Vorsprung Tractive is currently the best option. Shims give you far more tuning options but the stock RS tunes are weird.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
28 Posts
Hey,

I´m riding -19 Commencal Meta AM 29 with RS super deluxe ultimate coil right now and I actually love the bike. It´s riding very well, but as always, I´m thinking " Could it be better?"

So anyone want to give thoughts about DHX2 vs RS coil? Would I gain anything switching to DHX2 (Or some other coil perhaps?)

I´m riding XL-frame, Weight around 80-82kg with gears and I´m currently running 450lbs spring with RS. I´m using full travel pretty much everytime, but not feeling too many harsh bottom outs.

So yeah, basically just wondering if good could be better :rolleyes:
I know this is an old thread but I am not sure if anyone has done what I did. I have a 2020 Meta 29 and I put the cascade link and dhx2 on it. Wow this bike now outperforms my Ripmo in almost every category. Granted I haven't done the same to my Ripmo AF but I haven't heard anyone else do this and it is truly unreal. The platform is super progressive and pedals very well while the traction from the coil is unreal. The bike now pedals and is more poppy then the stock air shock!
 
1 - 20 of 20 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top