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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My current setup is Deore hydros (either 515 or 525) with 8" Hope Gothic rotors. I'm having issues with modulation, alignment, and the 8" rotors are just overkill for what I ride (I'm 160 lbs).

Sooooo...I'm planning to change these out to BB7s (160 mm rotors) with Avid SD 7 levers.

I was told that mech discs are lighter. How much of a weight savings should I expect, just a couple ounces, or substantially more? I tried looking at the weight weenies website, but I was kind of clueless figuring out the weight of brake lines and fluid.

Thanks.
 

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BB7s are heavier, but,

the difference is in the "peace of mind" department. Do a search on the Brake forum, this has been covered, in detail fairly recently, and often. You switch from hydro to bb7 because you are tired of screwing around with the hydros, not for weight savings.
 

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Get good Hydros and you don't have to worry about them. My Hayes HFX-9 brakes were nothing but problems, but my Hopes are awesome. Haven't had to rebleed them since shortening the hoses. With cables you have to worry about the housing and inners wearing out, which seems like more hassle to me.
 

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I thought hydros was a fluke..

I moved from BB to Deore (M535). Compared to BB, it's abit lighter, weight wise.
Shimano brakes works, has well-thought design, above-average QC, DEFINITELY NO bling (mainstream product syndrome). It might fail, or need rebleeding, but then you will visit your LBS for other things before that thing happens; and you can ask the mechanic to do it before it fails. Thats LESS headache.
 

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dumper said:
the difference is in the "peace of mind" department. Do a search on the Brake forum, this has been covered, in detail fairly recently, and often. You switch from hydro to bb7 because you are tired of screwing around with the hydros, not for weight savings.
Bingo. Bleeding to get the right "feel" was a PITA, whereas I can just adjust the Speed Dial on my Avid levers.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
OK. So about how much more will the BB7 setup weigh?

I guess I had it backwards. For some reason, I just assumed hydros would be heavier.

Anyway, I am getting tired of dealing with the adjustment issues of the Deore Hydros. I also want to switch from 8" to 6" rotors. Figure with the price of adapeters, new rotors, and the new pads I need anyways, I may as well get the BB7s.

Sooooo...about what is the difference in weight, roughly. Are we talking an ounce of a half-pound? I really am clueless.:idea:
 

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Deore hydro weight: ~1080 (M555 - 2002), add ~100gr for 8" rotors.
Avid BB7 & SD7 weight: ~970gr
Avid Juicy 5: ~850gr
Hope Mono Mini: ~700gr

So you will actually save weight going to Avid BB7s, but you would save even more with the Juicy 5s. As I said before, a good hydro brake will require less maintence than a cable brake.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Some Guy said:
Deore hydro weight: ~1080 (M555 - 2002), add ~100gr for 8" rotors.
Avid BB7 & SD7 weight: ~970gr
Avid Juicy 5: ~850gr
Hope Mono Mini: ~700gr.
Thanks.

So, the weights you listed were for entire brake systems? For example the 970g for the BB7 + SD7 includes typical cable + housing and the 1080g for the Deores includes lines + fluid/oil + levers, right. That's why I was getting such a headache trying to figure this stuff out on my own. Thanks again.
 

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from what I hear

Deore hydros are good brakes -- good bang for your buck. I have some BB7's and then I went to 4-pot XT's -- the difference in modulation is truely eye opening -- at least it was to me. With a proper bleed you should not have much hassle with the hydro's. maybe just swap out your deore caliper for a newer 2-piston XT -- that would be some weight savings. Granted BB7's are stupid easy to adjust and peace of mind -- but on the other hand a good bleed on hydro's and you are set for a while. I agree with the statement that shimano brakes don't have much or any bling factor to them (except the new XTR stuff) but they work and are reliable --- parts are easily available. I don't think weight should be your deciding factor here unless you are willing to spend the bucks for a high end hydro brakeset.
 

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No MSG said:
Thanks.

So, the weights you listed were for entire brake systems? For example the 970g for the BB7 + SD7 includes typical cable + housing and the 1080g for the Deores includes lines + fluid/oil + levers, right. That's why I was getting such a headache trying to figure this stuff out on my own. Thanks again.
Those weights include lever, cabling or hose & fluid, caliper with pads & bolts, and the rotor. So basically the entire braking system, for both front and rear. The only thing they don't include are rotor bolts, but they weigh the same for all the systems :).

The weights came from http://weight-weenies.com btw.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
What would a good bleed do?

eman2 said:
Deore hydros are good brakes -- good bang for your buck. I have some BB7's and then I went to 4-pot XT's -- the difference in modulation is truely eye opening -- at least it was to me. With a proper bleed you should not have much hassle with the hydro's. maybe just swap out your deore caliper for a newer 2-piston XT -- that would be some weight savings. Granted BB7's are stupid easy to adjust and peace of mind -- but on the other hand a good bleed on hydro's and you are set for a while. I agree with the statement that shimano brakes don't have much or any bling factor to them (except the new XTR stuff) but they work and are reliable --- parts are easily available. I don't think weight should be your deciding factor here unless you are willing to spend the bucks for a high end hydro brakeset.
Is that why there's so little tolerance and I get the rotor rub? Or is it because the Gothic rotors are too thick--I bought the bike used and this was the setup. I don't have a problem attempting a bleed, but I don't want to do it if it's not needed.
 

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LOL. i just upgraded my wifes rig from BB7's to deore hydro's with XT levers. i didn't write the numbers down, but it was a savings of a couple of ounces by going with the hydro's and significantly better power, modulation and feel.
 

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Rotor manufacturing is not rocket science, but it needs very low tolerance of manufacturing. I personally dont trust products coming off somebody's garage, insanely-priced, and then called it high-end.
Use shimano's rotor (they might be a bit heavy, but they stay true for a long long time), & ask experienced mechanic to setup your brake (any brand), give him cold beer, and you both be happy.

Half a pound? Sure you can. Just lose the rotors..
 

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Got pad rub?

If one of your complaints about maintaining Deore hydros is how to get rid of that freakin' pad rub that me and many others have had (amazingly, some riders don't seem to mind it but it drives me nuts) then BB7s solve that with their design. I currently have three sets of BB7s on three bikes and absolutely know, for sure, without a doubt, that my next ride will be pad-rub free. I'm not saying that they're going to save you that much weight, if any, but the "peace of mind" mentioned that I can dial out pad rub for me is almost the most important consideration. I have two sets of Hayes HFXs that are currently sitting in a box in my basement. Maybe if I had gone with Hopes or Formulas or Juicys I might have had a pad-rub free experience, but the Hayes were ALWAYS rubbing and I could never get rid of it. If BB7s didn't stop close to as well as a good hydro that would be a major consideration, but they stop me just fine. I've probably said the above a million times on other mtbr forums, but there's always riders saying that BB7s really aren't that good, go hydros for problem-free great modulation great stopping power...as if the BB7s suck.
 

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xcguy said:
I've probably said the above a million times on other mtbr forums, but there's always riders saying that BB7s really aren't that good, go hydros for problem-free great modulation great stopping power...as if the BB7s suck.
I don't think the BB7s suck. Far from it, they are probably the best cable disc brakes on the market. However, a good set of hydro brakes is better.
 

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I've been here before

Some Guy said:
I don't think the BB7s suck. Far from it, they are probably the best cable disc brakes on the market. However, a good set of hydro brakes is better.
and I truly believe that some hydro users (when my Hayes didn't rub I loved them) have never had the problems that I've had with the Hayes. My bike mechanic says his Hayes have always worked flawlessly but I know he's a much stronger rider than me (so probably doesn't notice pad rub like I do) and can expertly deal with his equipment. I just wish my experiences with hydros would have been as trouble-free as my years of BB7s have been so I could make an apples to apples comparison.

But just for arguments sake--what makes your experience with hydros so much better? Is it the personal judgment of "modulation", is it stopping power, can it possibly be that your hydros are more trouble free (even though my BB7s for me are never ever any trouble)? I would like nothing better than to mount some product that would be trouble free and "better" in all regards to my BB7s, but it's just very easy to keep these brakes on my bikes. If the pads start to rub, a turn of a dial eliminates that. If the Hayes rubbed, nothing I did would solve the problem. During your next ride, stop in the middle of it and spin your front and rear wheels. Do they rub at all? If they do does it matter to you? I would love to hear that never ever in any ride do your pads start to rub so that you could enjoy the same thing I get from my Avids. Really, I'm not trying to start an argument here--I just want to know a rider's secret who has hydros, loves them, has a trouble-free riding life, wouldn't change a thing...I'd love to have the same thing with a set of hyros.
 

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xcguy said:
and I truly believe that some hydro users (when my Hayes didn't rub I loved them) have never had the problems that I've had with the Hayes.
I haven't. My Hayes gave me no end of troubles. Leaks, constant alignment problems, levers undoing themselves. Worked OK when they worked, but so often they didn't. I've since switched to Hope brakes though, which I have not had any problems with.

During your next ride, stop in the middle of it and spin your front and rear wheels. Do they rub at all? If they do does it matter to you?
Yes, sometimes the pads will rub (generally it happens when I put a wheel back in). However by loosening the caliper mounting screws, realigning the caliper, and then doing them up again, I can remove it. I was able to do the same thing with my Hayes, but they went out of alignment much more often.

If you like your BB7s, then by all means stick with them. For me the better modulation and lighter weight of the Hopes makes them a better choice.
 

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I do want to give hydros another chance

Some Guy said:
I haven't. My Hayes gave me no end of troubles. Leaks, constant alignment problems, levers undoing themselves. Worked OK when they worked, but so often they didn't. I've since switched to Hope brakes though, which I have not had any problems with.

Yes, sometimes the pads will rub (generally it happens when I put a wheel back in). However by loosening the caliper mounting screws, realigning the caliper, and then doing them up again, I can remove it. I was able to do the same thing with my Hayes, but they went out of alignment much more often.

If you like your BB7s, then by all means stick with them. For me the better modulation and lighter weight of the Hopes makes them a better choice.
I'm glad to hear you like your Hopes. They're Minis? Don't know anything about Hopes. I tried that loosening the caliper mounting screws trick on the trail with my Hayes but just like you it never really worked. But you say it works with the Hopes. That's almost the moral equivalent of turning the knobs on my BB7s, which, yeah, I do occasionally on the trail. I might try them this summer, you know, become a hydro convert! And since this is the Save Some Weight forum, an added bonus is I'd get a lighter bike as well. Such a deal.
 
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