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race
n.
1. Sports
a. A competition of speed, as in running or riding.
b. races A series of such competitions held at a specified time on a regular course​
so....I have always thought of a race was a group of riders on the same course on the same day attempting to be faster than the other cyclist.

I like it that i would have to train....pay...and travel to a specific location/time to pit skills against fellow cyclists...for me, it shows commitment and a sense of ceremony.

now we have Strava....which lets riders time routes....and apparently there are online competitions going people are calling 'races'....

is this virtual field of competition actually racing?...IMO no. It smells of 'second life', virtual gaming and the growing trend of avoiding personal interaction.

There is a world of difference lining up and competing on the same route in the exact same conditions than practicing a course by yourself over and over and over....only to say 'gotcha by a second so I win'....

meh...

Although i will admit that Strava would make an excellent training/motivation tool....
 

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Snowjnky McDreamy
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I agree 100% I got rid of my GPS three years ago.
well put Chumdog
 

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Mtbr Founder
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These gps time trials are just like timing yourself with a stopwatch. Except you can just stick it in your pocket and never have to hit start and stop.

Not much more really. Not worth crapping on.

It's kind of like the the hour record of cycling but on a penny budget.

fc
 

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"it smells of 'second life', virtual gaming and the growing trend of avoiding personal interaction"

So what is the MTBR norcal forum then? It is kinda like the pliny thread. I would much rather enjoy a pliny with friends at a bar or house but not always possible. I do think however that if we were to enjoy some beers talking about a days ride over Skype, that would be a bit much.
Racing is great and I know I enjoy the competition. The stopwatch analogy is a good one too. Maybe the GPS thing is not your cup of tea and that is fine. By all accounts I might be a tool because I like to compare times and have virtual uphill races. At this point in my life, I am ok with that.
 

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Snowjnky McDreamy
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pmarshall said:
"it smells of 'second life', virtual gaming and the growing trend of avoiding personal interaction"

So what is the MTBR norcal forum then? It is kinda like the pliny thread. I would much rather enjoy a pliny with friends at a bar or house but not always possible. I do think however that if we were to enjoy some beers talking about a days ride over Skype, that would be a bit much.
Racing is great and I know I enjoy the competition. The stopwatch analogy is a good one too. Maybe the GPS thing is not your cup of tea and that is fine. By all accounts I might be a tool because I like to compare times and have virtual uphill races. At this point in my life, I am ok with that.
I think Chum main point that it is not real racing. It seems cool and all to compare times and challenge yourself but turning it in to the new way of racing seems a bit much. It's a way of proving you did what you said but when your racing there it is more than just going fast.

Plus your not winning any KOM like this ;) :D I will still ride with you :D
Eyewear Bicycle tire Bicycle wheel rim Helmet Bicycles--Equipment and supplies


as for the stopwatch times, do you think it would make a sticky if I started posting my Casio splits?
 

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snowjnky said:
I think Chum main point that it is not real racing.
BS!!!

I'm almost done building my personal podium stand and cardboard cutouts of podium girls... and I will continue to create new segments as long as I need to, just so I can keep winning!!!

If you stop making fun of me, I'll let you stand on the second step.
 

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grrrah said:
BS!!!

I'm almost done building my personal podium stand and cardboard cutouts of podium girls... and I will continue to create new segments as long as I need to, just so I can keep winning!!!

If you stop making fun of me, I'll let you stand on the second step.
#WINNING. Duh!
 

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snowjnky said:
I think Chum main point that it is not real racing. It seems cool and all to compare times and challenge yourself but turning it in to the new way of racing seems a bit much. It's a way of proving you did what you said but when your racing there it is more than just going fast.

Plus your not winning any KOM like this ;) :D I will still ride with you :D
View attachment 601478

as for the stopwatch times, do you think it would make a sticky if I started posting my Casio splits?
Thanks man! I get his point and agree- it doesn't replace real racing. Besides, the podium girls aren't nearly as cute either!
 

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A race is a competition not only amongst other people, but also a competition to yourself. Though I've never done a KOM "race" I can understand the satisfaction of "getting closer" or improving your own time. It's not for everyone but if it's your cup of tea, then who are we to say you can't put a garmin in your pocket and time yourself?
 

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I like mtn biking, too
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I wouldn't call Strava a race or race-substitute. Like anything, it can be used however you want to use it. It's not quite, and never will be quite as accurate as a real race, as conditions change from day to day, satellites drift, etc. I do find it an excellent training/motivation tool, as you say, and that's all I have really used it for. Since so many on this forum are using it and having fun with it, (i.e. are getting carried away with it), I can see why one might get a little annoyed. :)
 

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Totally, and to the max.
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(Disclaimer: Just having fun here. And yes, if you are on Strava, you are most likely faster than me.)

In a nutshell, Strava is to racing as Guitar Hero is to playing guitar. It's much easier in a virtual world. If it's a real race, I can brake check you and run you right off the trail. To me, a race is more like a fight. You win by being aggressive and not just fast. But whatever, I totally get it. I'm just not into it. Let's face it. We live in the hub of Technogeekery. There's a lot of gadget-loving folks around here who LOVE DATA. To them, all those little statistics add value to an activity. And any tool that measures performance is a must-have. That's totally cool. I'm just not one of those people and never have been. I'm a pretentious creative type. I live for the experience. When I ride, my goal is to be tired and have fun. Then drink beer. Too many things in life are unnecessarily complicated. For me, riding a bike will never be one of those things. But that's just because....

I'M BETTER THAN YOU.

:prft:
 

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NedwannaB
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Yeah!

shredchic said:
I wouldn't call Strava a race or race-substitute. Like anything, it can be used however you want to use it. It's not quite, and never will be quite as accurate as a real race, as conditions change from day to day, satellites drift, etc. I do find it an excellent training/motivation tool, as you say, and that's all I have really used it for. Since so many on this forum are using it and having fun with it, (i.e. are getting carried away with it), I can see why one might get a little annoyed. :)
Until there's virtual elbowing or cutting another contestant off in a corner forcing an otb, there's no comparison to the real McCoy.

I call CHUMMING! :cool: (hey nick)
 

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Shocks?, Pegs?... Lucky!
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It can't be racing b/c racing involves tactics. Holeshot into the S/T for one, knowing that you're a faster descender and getting around a slower guy heading to the S/T means that anyone stuck behind that guy is going to get gapped and need to punish themselves at some point to catch back on.
Also, how do you account for changing trail and weather conditions over time? (Heat, wind, mud, moon dust etc can all slow you down) In order to race, you've all got to be on the same hanidcap.
MTB is much more a time trial style of riding for most people, so it almost works, but Strava or whatever GPS Simulator you're using doesn't take into account some of the things that make racing more than "train hard, go hard".
 

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NedwannaB
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Heeeeeee's....

fritzaholic said:
It can't be racing b/c racing involves tactics. Holeshot into the S/T for one, knowing that you're a faster descender and getting around a slower guy heading to the S/T means that anyone stuck behind that guy is going to get gapped and need to punish themselves at some point to catch back on.
Also, how do you account for changing trail and weather conditions over time? (Heat, wind, mud, moon dust etc can all slow you down) In order to race, you've all got to be on the same hanidcap.
MTB is much more a time trial style of riding for most people, so it almost works, but Strava or whatever GPS Simulator you're using doesn't take into account some of the things that make racing more than "train hard, go hard".
Baaaaaaaaaaaaaack! Whoooohooo! :thumbsup: But no more afternoon Latte's for you mister. That's several posts in several threads! You don't want to go out too hard too early and bonk like on Saturday! :nono: :D

Ok, I'll go away now......:eek:
 

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shredchic said:
I wouldn't call Strava a race or race-substitute.... It's not quite, and never will be quite as accurate as a real race, as conditions change from day to day.....
Agree, it is not a race. A race would require the competitors to be on the same course at the same time in the same conditions. Strava isn't that, but is a competition. We live in an age where technology brings us things unimagined five of ten years ago. It's a pretty cool thing now, but it will be fun to see where it goes as it grows up.
 

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I like mtn biking, too
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sparkyJay said:
Strava isn't that, but is a competition.
Yeah, I think it's actually kind of cool that you can compete on the basis of footies of elevation with the KOM competition, rather than time. That you can't do in a traditional race. :thumbsup: But I don't think it will ever replace the real race experience, like others mentioned - there is strategy involved in being on the course with other racers. On Strava, you are usually on a multi-use trail sharing with other users! Not quite the same thing, and I hope people remember that when they're out there.
 

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Glad you're back.

fritzaholic said:
It can't be racing b/c racing involves tactics. Holeshot into the S/T for one, knowing that you're a faster descender and getting around a slower guy heading to the S/T means that anyone stuck behind that guy is going to get gapped and need to punish themselves at some point to catch back on.
Also, how do you account for changing trail and weather conditions over time? (Heat, wind, mud, moon dust etc can all slow you down) In order to race, you've all got to be on the same hanidcap.
MTB is much more a time trial style of riding for most people, so it almost works, but Strava or whatever GPS Simulator you're using doesn't take into account some of the things that make racing more than "train hard, go hard".
Glad you're back. Good post.
 
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