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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Question about de-coupling. I have started working on building my base for this season and i was wondering what is an acceptable amount of time before you see your heart rate increase a significant amount (15-20 bpm) to maintain the same speed. i am asking this to figure out when is a good time to start more intense training for the upcoming season. i want to see my base training peak or plateau before i do much if any high intensity training. i understand 2.5 months to do all of this is not ideal but i would like to hear some thoughts on this. thanks for the input:thumbsup:
 

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Giant Anthem
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"Heart rate increase to maintain the same speed?" Your heart rate will decrease at the same speed/power over time not increase. The body and aerobic system adapt to a certain speed/output and becomes more efficient at performing it resulting in a lower heart rate for the same output. I notice this in my base training this winter... my ave HR is lower much lower for a given ride now than 2 months ago. Maybe I'm not understanding the question, could re phrase it?
 

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In addition to what 2fst4u said, de-coupling is also a term used to describe something different from what you are addressing. You appear to be talking about heart rate increases or decreases over time periods such as weeks. As 2fst4u said, if everything else is equal your heart rate ought to decrease over time for a given speed if you are getting in better shape and more efficient.

Where I have seen "de-coupling" used is in the power meter world where your heart rate v. power is tracked within a given workout. During the workout, there is a point at which your heart rate will increase to maintain the same power. Another way to look at it is riding at a constant heart rate and tracking whether power decreases over the course of the workout. De-coupling will always occur at some point during a ride for any athlete if they are riding hard enough and long enough.

The WKO+ power meter software tracks this stuff using some type of algorithms. The guys who developed it (Coggen and Allen?) talk about looking for a de-coupling between heart rate and and power of 5% or less for certain rides. Once you get to that point, where de-coupling is 5% or less, it is of significance in their mind in regard to where you are in base training and signals you are ready for the more high intensity stuff.

I love to use all the fancy gadgets and have a power meter on my road bike, but to be honest for most of us it is probably really difficult to decide when to move on to harder workouts based upon data like that. If you've got an experienced coach, that is one thing. But otherwise you are probably just as well off by following a tried and true training plan and tracking how you feel. When that 2 hour, zone 2/3 ride starts to feel not too taxing, I'll bet you are ready to move on to the intense stuff and get ready to race.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Gatorback said:
In addition to what 2fst4u said, de-coupling is also a term used to describe something different from what you are addressing. You appear to be talking about heart rate increases or decreases over time periods such as weeks. As 2fst4u said, if everything else is equal your heart rate ought to decrease over time for a given speed if you are getting in better shape and more efficient.

Where I have seen "de-coupling" used is in the power meter world where your heart rate v. power is tracked within a given workout. During the workout, there is a point at which your heart rate will increase to maintain the same power. Another way to look at it is riding at a constant heart rate and tracking whether power decreases over the course of the workout. De-coupling will always occur at some point during a ride for any athlete if they are riding hard enough and long enough.

The WKO+ power meter software tracks this stuff using some type of algorithms. The guys who developed it (Coggen and Allen?) talk about looking for a de-coupling between heart rate and and power of 5% or less for certain rides. Once you get to that point, where de-coupling is 5% or less, it is of significance in their mind in regard to where you are in base training and signals you are ready for the more high intensity stuff.

I love to use all the fancy gadgets and have a power meter on my road bike, but to be honest for most of us it is probably really difficult to decide when to move on to harder workouts based upon data like that. If you've got an experienced coach, that is one thing. But otherwise you are probably just as well off by following a tried and true training plan and tracking how you feel. When that 2 hour, zone 2/3 ride starts to feel not too taxing, I'll bet you are ready to move on to the intense stuff and get ready to race.
I know my heartrate will decrease for the same power level as my fitness increases but in paragraph 2 thats what i am talking about Gatorback. Right now i am on roller's and i can maintain a certain power output by staying in the same gear, maintaining the same speed, and none of the other variable's that you would normally see (wind, grades) are affecting me. So i am able to monitor my heartrate as i constantly hold a certain level of effort or power, watching for changes over the period of my workout. The 5% or less number is what i was looking for and i can use that number to help monitor my progress. An example of my hour long ride last night, after a 15 min warmup i saw my heart rate go from 120 to 135 over a 45 minute period where i was maintaining the same power output. So my heatrate changed by 11.2%. i will be watching that number decrease over the coming month(s) as i am working on my cardio and once i see inprovement start to slow or plateau i will be ready for more intense workouts. this gives me something to monitor my progress rather than going by how i feel. now i can use both to determine when to start bringing up the effort level.
 

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One thing to keep in mind if you are riding indoors is that you will likely experience "cardiac drift" at a much faster rate than if you are riding outdoors. You've got very little wind (or none if you are not using a fan) to help cool you, which is much different than outdoors. If you are riding in no wind outdoors at 22 mph, that is basically a 22 mph wind helping cool you off. My heart rate always rises more rapidly indoors on a steady state ride. But it can be good training. Just keep in mind it is a little different in terms of how your heart rate will respond.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Good points. i do use a fan but my body is not getting the cooling effect as if i were riding outdoors so i will keep that in mind. i should still be able to see results as i train indoors because the conditions and variables are always the same. just like any repeatable test, the more variables controlled will give the most accurate results.
 
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