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I fall... a lot
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey everyone, I am going to ask a few questions and I apologize in advance if they have been discussed and I have just missed them.
1. reba XX 120 or Fox 120?
2. What kind of weight are most people getting their bikes to be at?

About to order the Hot tamale Rip 9 and build up. Probably X9 or XT/SLX group, cheap wheels until I can save up and get some Industry 9's.

Thanks
 

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I went with the Reba Team. Very happy with it. From all the research I did, it's much easier to maintain than the Fox, and rides just as well.

My '10 Tang Large RIP 9 it 31.5 lbs, but I have a Gravity dropper post that adds a full pound, and I'm nowhere near a weight weenie. I've heard of people getting them down to 27-28lbs, but I figure I carry more than 3lbs of extra gear, so why sweat it?
 

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Nothing negative towards the Reba for sure, but I am going with the 2011 Fox Talas FIT RLC. We have some serious climbs at times and I wanted to try it out...
 

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I love the Rebas' . I had a Reba RLT and it worked great.I bought a Reba RLT Ti with the tapered steer tube and 20mm thru-axle.It is OUTSTANDING ! Fox 15mm QR is a half-assed solution to the issue of front end stiffness. My Rip9 size XL without a lot of "light-weight" parts weighs 29lbs.
 

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DG5- i have an older non-tapered reba, and when i brake hard in the front i can see the fork bend back a noticeable amount... Did you notice this on your RLT, and if so how much did the tapered RLT Ti help with that?
 

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DG5 said:
I love the Rebas' . I had a Reba RLT and it worked great.I bought a Reba RLT Ti with the tapered steer tube and 20mm thru-axle.It is OUTSTANDING ! Fox 15mm QR is a half-assed solution to the issue of front end stiffness. My Rip9 size XL without a lot of "light-weight" parts weighs 29lbs.
Half-assed solution? Seems to be a really decent fork and this being about the 4th one I have used and I have used one compared to a Reba and I just like the Fox better...

Are the folks with QR front forks riding on something 1/4-assed?

I think the Reba and the Fox are great choices. I am just used to the Fox and feel they do a decent job of making a fork. I also think the Reba is good also. But to say the Fox is half-assed over a 15 vs 20mm TA is kind of silly, no?
 

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Dirt Dude said:
Nothing negative towards the Reba for sure, but I am going with the 2011 Fox Talas FIT RLC. We have some serious climbs at times and I wanted to try it out...
I like the looks of those new Talas forks and the ability to snug it down to 95mm for the climbs. Have you thought about the Terralogic version of the Talas? Some pretty good reviews of it - especially this one which tested the Terralogic Talas on a RIP 9:

http://www.feedthehabit.com/mountain-biking/2011-fox-32-talas-29-terralogic-120-fork-review/
 

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Dirt Dude said:
Half-assed solution? Seems to be a really decent fork and this being about the 4th one I have used and I have used one compared to a Reba and I just like the Fox better...

Are the folks with QR front forks riding on something 1/4-assed?

I think the Reba and the Fox are great choices. I am just used to the Fox and feel they do a decent job of making a fork. I also think the Reba is good also. But to say the Fox is half-assed over a 15 vs 20mm TA is kind of silly, no?
Please don't take it personally.Is your last name "Fox" ? The fork itself is fine,it's the 15mm QR that I take issue with. Why 15mm ? The 20mm came out long before the 15 and solved the problem.Why create a new standard for no reason at all, except marketing ? It is just simply not as good.That is not my opinion that is physics. And yes the 9mm QR is "1/4-assed" or maybe even 1/16-assed. JK.
 

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Nickbm3 said:
DG5- i have an older non-tapered reba, and when i brake hard in the front i can see the fork bend back a noticeable amount... Did you notice this on your RLT, and if so how much did the tapered RLT Ti help with that?
The newer(2010-2011) Rebas' are all much stiffer fore and aft than the older ones.I notice more difference torsionally.Steering input is immediate and sure.There is just no more deflection off of rocks,ruts,etc. It just goes EXACTLY where it is pointed.I am very happy I made the switch as it has made my Rip "complete". I stated in another forum that I did not get the whole "Thru-axle" deal.Well I have spent a lot more time on one now and I was WRONG !
 

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DG5 said:
The newer(2010-2011) Rebas' are all much stiffer fore and aft than the older ones.I notice more difference torsionally.Steering input is immediate and sure.There is just no more deflection off of rocks,ruts,etc. It just goes EXACTLY where it is pointed.I am very happy I made the switch as it has made my Rip "complete". I stated in another forum that I did not get the whole "Thru-axle" deal.Well I have spent a lot more time on one now and I was WRONG !
Nice, cant wait to upgrade!
 

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DG5 said:
Please don't take it personally.Is your last name "Fox" ? The fork itself is fine,it's the 15mm QR that I take issue with. Why 15mm ? The 20mm came out long before the 15 and solved the problem.Why create a new standard for no reason at all, except marketing ? It is just simply not as good.That is not my opinion that is physics. And yes the 9mm QR is "1/4-assed" or maybe even 1/16-assed. JK.
"That is not my opinion that is physics."
- No, the above is opinion. I own/have owned all 4 variations of forks.
QR non-taper Reba 80/100
20mm taper Reba 140
QR non-taper Fox F29 100
15QR taper Fox 120RLC

IMO, the QR FOX is better than the Reba. Especially a 100mm Reba.
15QR and 20mmQR I CANNOT tell the difference.

NOTHING wrong with either OS QR system IMO....

:thumbsup:
 

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DMFT said:
"That is not my opinion that is physics."
- No, the above is opinion. I own/have owned all 4 variations of forks.
QR non-taper Reba 80/100
20mm taper Reba 140
QR non-taper Fox F29 100
15QR taper Fox 120RLC

IMO, the QR FOX is better than the Reba. Especially a 100mm Reba.
15QR and 20mmQR I CANNOT tell the difference.

NOTHING wrong with either OS QR system IMO....

:thumbsup:
it IS physics. A larger thin walled tube is stronger and stiffer than a smaller thin walled tube.You may want to check some facts before you tell someone they are wrong. There is nothing "wrong" with a Fox fork,but they decided to simply create a new standard for no other reason than to be different. If what I said was not fact,then why are we riding around on giant-tubed aluminum frames? My OPINION is that I like Reba forks better than Fox forks. The FACT is 20mm is stronger and stiffer than 15mm.
 

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DG5 said:
it IS physics. A larger thin walled tube is stronger and stiffer than a smaller thin walled tube.You may want to check some facts before you tell someone they are wrong. There is nothing "wrong" with a Fox fork,but they decided to simply create a new standard for no other reason than to be different. If what I said was not fact,then why are we riding around on giant-tubed aluminum frames? My OPINION is that I like Reba forks better than Fox forks. The FACT is 20mm is stronger and stiffer than 15mm.
I remember just a few weeks ago in a thread about your new RIP (switching from a JET) you were contemplating going from your non tapered steerer fork and 9mm QR to a tapered steerer fork and a TA.

Have you ridden a tapered steerer tube fork with the 15mm TA on your RIP? All of your posts seem to indicate that your new REBA is your first and only TA fork, so I wonder why you are so negative on the 15mm TA? At least in your posts and what you've stated, you've presented yourself as not having owned one before - so it sounds like opinion rather than experience.

FOX is not the only fork company to use 15mm TA. In fact, Rock Shox itself is even coming out in 2011 with 15mm TA as well.:D Perfect solution for XC and Trail bikes.

Search and read articles on the differences between the steerer tubes of 1 1/8, 1.5 and the tapered tube. You might as well throw in stanchion diameter and carbon rims to the reading as well.:thumbsup:

Forks from Rock Shox are available in 20mm and 15mm for 2011. For a trail bike such as the RIP, the argument of 15mm vs. 20mm in the light version TA's may or may not be worth the effort (both offer excellent performance).

Great article here on the whole ball of wax of 20mm vs. 15mm and the reality of it all.

A few quotes from that article....

I got the official word on the new fork offerings at the 2011 RockShox product launch in Colorado from Sander Rigney, RockShox Product Manager for the company's Performance Trail and XC categories. The response was a mix of realism and opportunity.

The realism part of the equation, according to Rigney, is that wheel makers aren't particularly interested in making a light XC or trail wheel based around a 20mm axle. It's overkill and overweight, as far as they're concerned.

Whether or not that's actually true is irrelevant. This, as is often the case, is a matter of perception. We ride in an age where everyone from the bike manufacturers all the way down to consumers are pushing for the lightest bike possible - even in the 5" or 6" travel range. That means building bikes with lighter parts, particularly wheel parts. If wheelmakers aren't interested in making XC or trail-weight wheels or hubs to accommodate 20mm axles, then it doesn't make sense for RockShox to turn out XC or trail forks with that axle size, regardless of how light the Maxle Lite may be. Pretty simple.

Another element of that story is market share. Bike manufacturers are spec'ing 15mm forks on their XC and trail bikes.
Both Fox and Marzocchi make 15mm forks, and there was a real danger that RockShox would lose a sizeable portion of the 100 to 150mm-travel fork market to the other two companies if it didn't start making what bike manufacturers were choosing to spec. RockShox doesn't want to dwell on this part of the story, but it's worth acknowledging.


Now, what about 15mm for certain types of riding? The article also says this:

15mm forks are not for everyone.

15mm forks are well suited for XC and trail riding because they combine light weight with a reasonable degree of stiffness, but they're not designed for particularly technical / demanding all-mountain riding. Or freeriding. Or downhilling. They never were intended for those types of riding, all of which place a premium on stiffness over light weight. That desired stiffness is only possible (at this time, anyway) with a 20mm axle.

If you ride particularly rough terrain (think the North Shore), if you like to hit big drops, if you're a larger rider, if weight isn't a concern or if you are riding a bike with more than 6" of travel, you won't want a fork with a 15mm axle. Hell, you probably shouldn't be using one. You're not the intended user. So don't buy one to replace your existing 20mm fork when it wears out. And don't buy a bike that comes spec'd with a 15mm fork. Realize and accept that 15mm forks have limitations, and spend your money accordingly.


So it depends on what kind of riding one is doing on their RIP (or any bike). Heck, I'd argue skipping the RIP and going directly to the W.F.O. for the description above of all mountain and freeriding with a 20mm.

And the article says this about 20mm...

20mm forks are here to stay.

There is a very real place in the mountain biking world for 20mm axles. Long-travel forks make up a smaller, but still significant, part of the fork market. People who ride North Shore-style trails, who ride bike parks, who shuttle, who demand the stiffest fork possible will have that option for the foreseeable future. There may come a day when advances in materials make it possible to build a 15mm fork that is as stiff as today's 20mm fork, but that day isn't here yet. So relax - your 20mm hubs aren't in danger of becoming obsolete.


Back to the RIP.....

DG5, your particular riding might fit into that category where as another rider on a RIP may not fit into those categories. So it would be pointless to pound the table as an absolute and say you've got to use a 20mm or a 15mm on your RIP because it all depends on the type of riding. 15 works great for me, but that doesn't mean it would for you or the OP. Likewise with the 20mm coming from your recommendation. Just because you like it and it is great for you doesn't mean it is the best solution for everyone else.

I would, however, point out that the benefit that both the newly designed RIPs and JETs with the tapered head tubes coupled with a tapered steerer tube fork is where we are seeing a good portion of the improvements up front.

To the OP, I happen to have a couple of sets of wheels I can run on my RIP. One of them has a front hub that can swap between 9mm and 15mm, and the other front hub can do just about whatever I want to throw at it for an axle (I9 Enduro). Depending on wheels and tires I run, my XL size RIP with the 120mm Fox 15mm fork weighs 27.5 - 28.5 pounds. Rank me in that market segment that wants a blend of durable and light. And yes, I know how to get my RIP down to the 25-26 lb. weight class. Those 1600g all mountain carbon Haven wheels really look sweet and would cut weight while still providing über-stiffness. Alas, I will continue dreaming....

Your choice between the 20mm or 15mm might come down to how much you weigh and what type of riding you plan on doing with your Hot Tamale. Are you Clydesdale Class or slim?

BB
 

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For starters,I would like to thank BruceBrown for his insight. He is and has always been one of the most helpful people on this site.Secondly,I don't have anything against Fox forks,I just find it silly that they decided to create a new thru-axle size when we already had one that worked very well.My only "experience" with the QR15 has been a couple short test-rides,so I am definately not an expert. My recommendation for Reba forks is based on my greater experience and maybe a bit of bias since I have owned several? The 20mm/tapered Reba is an excellent fork IMO.Sorry if I offended any Fox lovers.
 

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DG5 said:
For starters,I would like to thank BruceBrown for his insight. He is and has always been one of the most helpful people on this site.Secondly,I don't have anything against Fox forks,I just find it silly that they decided to create a new thru-axle size when we already had one that worked very well.My only "experience" with the QR15 has been a couple short test-rides,so I am definately not an expert. My recommendation for Reba forks is based on my greater experience and maybe a bit of bias since I have owned several? The 20mm/tapered Reba is an excellent fork IMO.Sorry if I offended any Fox lovers.
In terms of owning a FOX - you didn't offend me. I'm fork agnostic as I ride and enjoy both the FOX fork that I own and the 4 Reba forks I own. I love the REBA XX on my JET as it's a huge improvement over my much older REBA's. I went with the XC race version and pondered what to do - 15mm TA or 9mm QR. I had choices which involved what front hub and fork.

I totally went with the "avoid overkill" theme for my own riding and passed on both the 15mm and 20mm for the REBA XX on the JET. The new tapered steerer, tapered head tube and the stiffer REBA XX itself over my prior models was a huge boost in performance. Huge. I've been fine with the 9mm QR up front, and do have the option to upgrade to the DT RWS, but don't feel any need to do so. The taper took care of all and has allowed me to go from 80mm to 100mm in travel without any poor handling trade offs whatsoever for XC racing and riding.

Again, it all comes down to rider needs and how the bike is being ridden. And both Rock Shox and FOX still offer the 9mm version in their 2011 model forks. So 9mm, 15mm and 20mm are available to meet a variety of needs out there. Some might be overkill for certain riders, and some might be not enough - so at least we have choice.

However, on the RIP - I would not go less than the 15mm for such a great trail bike.

BB
 

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certain riders said:
I have spent alot of time on both 15mm & 20mm forks on my Rip9 & although I would never go back to Std QR when it comes down to fork choice as long as it was 15mm or 20mm T/A I would choose the fork on it's other merites.

FWIW I really like the XX forks lockout & that is the deal maker for me at the moment,But it's also nice its 20mm
 

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DG5 said:
I don't have anything against Fox forks,I just find it silly that they decided to create a new thru-axle size when we already had one that worked very well.My only "experience" with the QR15 has been a couple short test-rides,so I am definately not an expert.
Then do us all a favor and save the bluster and drama for something you're informed on. You have nothing behind your 'half-assed' statement except for theory and idealism. If you want to state something that strongly, for crying out loud, have at least SOMEthing behind it. Please.

I come here for good information. Sifting through half-baked opinions just makes it harder.
 

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I fall... a lot
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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
thanks for all the information guys. I am probably going to go with the XX just because I can get it for a lot better of a price. I am so psyched to start buliding this bike up. I am going with reba xx, stans flow wheels, and XT dyna system group. Thanks again for all your help. If anyone knows someone looking to make a deal on a 26er, with chris king components, or just buy some chris king wheels, headset, bottom bracket, let me know. I am going to be making a great deal on it all to help fund this project. Thanks again everyone!
 

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schnee said:
Then do us all a favor and save the bluster and drama for something you're informed on. You have nothing behind your 'half-assed' statement except for theory and idealism. If you want to state something that strongly, for crying out loud, have at least SOMEthing behind it. Please.

I come here for good information. Sifting through half-baked opinions just makes it harder.
Did you see the part where I apologized ? How about you learn to read. You can start with the pack of Oreos that are probably in your lap right now.
 
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