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preach on! I thought about chinese carbon but decided on 907. A bike that is a few lbs heavier will make my 22lb hardtail feel that much lighter in spring!
 

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Of all the people in the world, you US guys should understand and support free markets.

There are expensive 29ers, custom 29ers and cheap copy 29ers. All being produced and all being bought at the price point each customer can afford.

Fat bikes will be just the same, best of all more and more riders will enjoy their Fat Bikes, and have to confidence to spend greater amounts on custom and specialist frames and components.

Get real.

Brian
 

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Of all the people in the world, you US guys should understand and support free markets.

There are expensive 29ers, custom 29ers and cheap copy 29ers. All being produced and all being bought at the price point each customer can afford.

Fat bikes will be just the same, best of all more and more riders will enjoy their Fat Bikes, and have to confidence to spend greater amounts on custom and specialist frames and components.

Get real.

Brian
You can justify it any way you like. Don't make it right.
 

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Discussion Starter · #64 ·
I suppose there is justification in what I wrote, but I can guarantee I won't be buying a $2,300 frame this year.

These frames, like the Bikesdirect bikes, are a disruptive force in the marketplace, just look at that 250 page thread over in the 29er forum.

Sorry to have brought it up and p!ssed people off, but I thought it was an interesting option. If the group doesn't like this thread, I have no problem deleting it.
 

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I'm pretty happy with my sub-30 lb Fatback alloy bike. A carbon frame only sheds about 1.5 lbs, so maybe Mr 2 kids in college should cut calories for like 3 days and there's the weight savings. :D

I'm kidding jisch, so don't hate me.
 

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Walmart was apparently selling knockoffs of Banksy art, with Banksy's name on it.

I guess it's OK because Banksy originals are really expensive and besides, it doesn't hurt anyone and it gets more people to appreciate art and stuff and really, who's getting harmed.

Banksy's "Destroy Capitalism" print for sale at Walmart.

And it's totally OK that GoldieBlox ripped off the beastie boys despite their ban on using their songs for any commercial product, ever because the song was really cute and it's for the kids and the original song was mean and really, who gets hurt, right?

Never Mind the Lawyers, GoldieBlox Won Big in Beastie Boys Fight

When you work on a project because you really love it (and want to get paid), pour serious money into it with the hope of getting your money back AND seeing a profit AND seeing the thing you love succeed, and then you get ripped off, let me know how you feel about it.
 

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Of all the people in the world, you US guys should understand and support free markets.

There are expensive 29ers, custom 29ers and cheap copy 29ers. All being produced and all being bought at the price point each customer can afford.

Fat bikes will be just the same, best of all more and more riders will enjoy their Fat Bikes, and have to confidence to spend greater amounts on custom and specialist frames and components.

Get real.

Brian
Bingo!
 

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na, just keep the thread rolling. i have this suspicion that some people purchased fat bike recently and now begin to regret it. :)
 

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na, just keep the thread rolling. i have this suspicion that some people purchased fat bike recently and now begin to regret it. :)
Nope, I *just* bought the alloy Fatback and I LOVE it. Gonna ride it in the snow immediately after work today.

Zero regrets.
 

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na, just keep the thread rolling. i have this suspicion that some people purchased fat bike recently and now begin to regret it. :)
No buyers regret here. I don't mind people selling cheap carbon frames what I do have a problem with is companies that rip other companies designs off. I support local as much as I can and its up to each individual to make their own choices, I won't judge.
 

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Discussion Starter · #73 ·
If I had a nice fat bike in the shed, this thread would not be threatening nor would I be suffering buyer's remorse. I think that's important to realize with one of these bikes (much like the FB4), you're not buying a high end product, and you'll get what you pay for in some regards.

There are definitely advantages to owning something high end, it can be as intangible as what the marketing guys tell you or as concrete as high resale value or knowing you can call someone to get help if you have issues. I totally get that and I wish I was in a position to participate in it.
 

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Ask yourself the questions

Who paid for and trained in the use of the computer design software tools to draw and analyse the frames structure.
Who paid for and trained to use the stress analysis software and hardware machines to test the prototypes.
Who paid for the factory.
Who produced the mould tools, who had the skill, who trained the staff.

Who provided all these facilities and took risks to produce small volumes for the custom US fatbike house that marks the frames up three, four, five times.

Why do the US small volume custom houses allow these guys to make another frame mould and sell direct. The factory could not supply just the low volume high price quantities and survive. It's called dual price marketing and is used all over the world.

Ford Cars sell at high price to the retail sector and miles lower prices to the lease companies. It's standard marketing textbook stuff.

As I say! just choose your price point and enjoy your Fat bike.

Brian
 

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Ask yourself the questions

Who paid for and trained in the use of the computer design software tools to draw and analyse the frames structure.
Who paid for and trained to use the stress analysis software and hardware machines to test the prototypes.
Who paid for the factory.
Who produced the mould tools, who had the skill, who trained the staff.

Who provided all these facilities and took risks to produce small volumes for the custom US fatbike house that marks the frames up three, four, five times.

Why do the US small volume custom houses allow these guys to make another frame mould and sell direct. The factory could not supply just the low volume high price quantities and survive. It's called dual price marketing and is used all over the world.

Ford Cars sell at high price to the retail sector and miles lower prices to the lease companies. It's standard marketing textbook stuff.

As I say! just choose your price point and enjoy your Fat bike.

Brian
So, by this logic I assume you own every song, movie and TV show in your inventory? Because the people who get hurt most by pirating are, by your logic, the industry that fronts bands the money for studio time, pays the promotion and distributes the music, and the artists themselves don't really matter.

So I'm going to guess that you'd never pirate a song, movie or TV show because you'd be ripping off the system. And whether that song is performed by Nirvana or kidz bop doesn't matter at all because it's all about the pricepoint and the process of manufacture, not the creativity behind it.


You can justify it however you like. It still doesn't make it right.
 

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Discussion Starter · #77 ·
I, for one, am enjoying reading through the responses, as long as the ideas keep flowing and there's no personal attacks, I think its a good healthy discussion.

I am sure the bike industry will adjust in the same way the music industry has adjusted (and for the record, I am a musician (hobbyist at best) and any music/media I have in my house I paid for).
 

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I think you may have misunderstood my point, not sure but think so.

It's actually the Chinese factory that makes all the investment, has all the technical skills to design, test and manufacture the high tec carbon frame. They make both the expensive frame for the boutique fat bike house and the medium price frame and the low cost direct frame. They make frames for all the markets so they can achieve the volume they need and the average price they need to survive.

Piracy has nothing to do with this business model. Nothing what so ever.

Some years back I was a windsurfer. There was only one factory in the whole world that made windsurfing sails. Every brand went there, had them design and make what they wanted and sold the sail at the price they could achieve. That one factory had all the skills to achieve what was needed.

Brian
 

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Lets see what people think when a US company start selling a frame designed by a US company already selling that frame, fork hubs, completes etc and market it under another name when it clearly is EXACTLY the same as said company except for finish. This happens when said companies do not pay for moulds and then it is open slather. It happens worldwide and although it may not be right, it will continue to happen.
I can buy the above mentioned frame here in Oz from a distributor if I want as well.
I say, buy whatever suits you or meets your needs, makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside and then ride it and appreciate that you are a rider, out riding :)
 
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