Your concerns are dead on, the stock Charger 2.1 is overdamped in high speed compression. The PUSH HC97 compression valve upgrade is a must-do in my book. My old Pike with the original Charger didn't have the same issue and was very similar to all the "good" Fox dampers I've had in the past.
Charger 2.1RC/RC2 vs. GRIP1 or GRIP2
Forum - I've been riding pretty much exclusively Fox suspension for years and pretty much all demo/test rides and riding buddies are on Fox as well. Given the great bike parts shortage of 2020/21 - I'm looking at a new bike build with RockShox.
What I noticed with The Charger 2.1RC is it has low speed R+C while Fox with GRIP1 is high speed R+C adjust. If I could just get an Ultimate with Charger 2.1RC2 - I would, but again - low stock.
I'm 150lbs riding weight and ride moderate-aggressive trails and am moderately fast (like in the top 30-40% on Strava LoL). I'm bit concerned the the "default" high speed non-adjustable setting on the Charger 2.1RC might be overdamped?
My only recent experience on RS was on Super Deluxe Ultimate rear shock and I noticed a big jump per click on the rebound adjust vs. Fox.
Thoughts and comparisons?
What I noticed with The Charger 2.1RC is it has low speed R+C while Fox with GRIP1 is high speed R+C adjust. If I could just get an Ultimate with Charger 2.1RC2 - I would, but again - low stock.
I'm 150lbs riding weight and ride moderate-aggressive trails and am moderately fast (like in the top 30-40% on Strava LoL). I'm bit concerned the the "default" high speed non-adjustable setting on the Charger 2.1RC might be overdamped?
My only recent experience on RS was on Super Deluxe Ultimate rear shock and I noticed a big jump per click on the rebound adjust vs. Fox.
Thoughts and comparisons?
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Both the Fox and Rockshox have external low speed controls, high speed being fixed.
My understanding is the 2.1RC lacks sufficient high speed compression dampening. It can be modified by stiffening the high speed compression stack, which will also cause the low speed compression adjuster to become useful as it will allow some oil to be forced through the low speed needle before it simply opens up and bypasses.
www.mtbr.com
My understanding is the 2.1RC lacks sufficient high speed compression dampening. It can be modified by stiffening the high speed compression stack, which will also cause the low speed compression adjuster to become useful as it will allow some oil to be forced through the low speed needle before it simply opens up and bypasses.
Rockshox Charger 2.1 Select+ RC Forks...Compression...
The RC is what this fork has as an oem takeoff select+. It is supposedly a charger 2.1 and it has the LSC knob only, but it does ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to adjust LSC in a perceivable way. I am also scratching my head as to why RS STILL can't figure this out after 20 years, and 3 charger...
www.mtbr.com
The GRIP compression adjustment increases damping across the board. It's not like there's a fixed LS bleed and adjustable preload. There's no LSC bleed at all.What I noticed with The Charger 2.1RC is it has low speed R+C while Fox with GRIP1 is high speed R+C adjust. If I could just get an Ultimate with Charger 2.1RC2 - I would, but again - low stock.
Where did you get the idea that GRIP forks have externally adjustable HSR?
Ok. Sorry, I may have been mistaken on the "default" C+R adjustments for GRIP1. That said, my original question/concern still stands. Is the Charger 2.1RC overdamped by default - especially for lighter rider? And is the solution get RC2 or get the RC revalved?
FWIW - I'm typically pretty happy with Fox recommended defaults, within 2-3 PSI and within 1-2 clicks of recommended R and C settings.
FWIW - I'm typically pretty happy with Fox recommended defaults, within 2-3 PSI and within 1-2 clicks of recommended R and C settings.
Get it but get the HC97 at the same time, ride happy 😁 Love my Pike now.Ok. Sorry, I may have been mistaken on the "default" C+R adjustments for GRIP1. That said, my original question/concern still stands. Is the Charger 2.1RC overdamped by default - especially for lighter rider? And is the solution get RC2 or get the RC it revalved?
FWIW - I'm typically pretty happy with Fox recommended defaults, within 2-3 PSI and within 1-2 clicks of recommend R and C settings.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I've seen people complain about losing grip in turns with the RC, which is exactly the problem I had when running an RC2 fully open, so that tells me the RC is underdamped for higher speeds.
Most people run RS forks fully open because they like the plushness, but from what I found fully open allows the front wheel to leave the ground on trails that are especially fast. I have to run the Lyrik with 2 clicks of HSC to prevent the wheel from washing out on certain trails. Rockshox probably made the RC similar to a fully open RC2 since thats what MOST people prefer.
If you plan on riding fast then get the RC2 just incase you need to increase HSC.
(Also, I run the Charger 2.0 with 2 clicks HSC, I heard the 2.1's middle setting is the same as a fully open 2.0, so I would probably run the 2.1 with 3-4 clicks.)
Most people run RS forks fully open because they like the plushness, but from what I found fully open allows the front wheel to leave the ground on trails that are especially fast. I have to run the Lyrik with 2 clicks of HSC to prevent the wheel from washing out on certain trails. Rockshox probably made the RC similar to a fully open RC2 since thats what MOST people prefer.
If you plan on riding fast then get the RC2 just incase you need to increase HSC.
(Also, I run the Charger 2.0 with 2 clicks HSC, I heard the 2.1's middle setting is the same as a fully open 2.0, so I would probably run the 2.1 with 3-4 clicks.)
I had a Charger2.0 RC before the Charger2.1 Rc2 on my 170mm Lyrik.
The old 2.0 RC was way overdamped, brutally harsh on hitting roots and rocks fast, almost like a lockout.
The 2.1 RC2 is okay with that, HSC from closed one or two clicks, LSC maybe ten clicks, changing this quite often.
My fork is SoloAir, so running Debonair C might need a bit more damping.
I dont know about the 2.1RC but I would give it a try, if you cant get a 2.1RC2.
The only Fox I ever had was years ago a FIT4 36, in my fond memory it was much more controlled than the Lyrik now... but was it?
The old 2.0 RC was way overdamped, brutally harsh on hitting roots and rocks fast, almost like a lockout.
The 2.1 RC2 is okay with that, HSC from closed one or two clicks, LSC maybe ten clicks, changing this quite often.
My fork is SoloAir, so running Debonair C might need a bit more damping.
I dont know about the 2.1RC but I would give it a try, if you cant get a 2.1RC2.
The only Fox I ever had was years ago a FIT4 36, in my fond memory it was much more controlled than the Lyrik now... but was it?
They all have issues.
Charger 2.1 is the best tuning platform of those. GRIP2 VVC requires the most modification to be tunable. GRIP2 and Charger 2.1 are both harsh but lack support. GRIP1 and GRIP2 (pre VVC) has the most compression damping available stock.
Charger 2.0 was a cock-up. LSC circuit doesn't work and rebound tuning is limited due to the piston geometry.
Charger 2.1 is the best tuning platform of those. GRIP2 VVC requires the most modification to be tunable. GRIP2 and Charger 2.1 are both harsh but lack support. GRIP1 and GRIP2 (pre VVC) has the most compression damping available stock.
Charger 2.0 was a cock-up. LSC circuit doesn't work and rebound tuning is limited due to the piston geometry.
Hallo CXFahrer,I had a Charger2.0 RC before the Charger2.1 Rc2 on my 170mm Lyrik.
The old 2.0 RC was way overdamped, brutally harsh on hitting roots and rocks fast, almost like a lockout.
The 2.1 RC2 is okay with that, HSC from closed one or two clicks, LSC maybe ten clicks, changing this quite often.
My fork is SoloAir, so running Debonair C might need a bit more damping.
I dont know about the 2.1RC but I would give it a try, if you cant get a 2.1RC2.
The only Fox I ever had was years ago a FIT4 36, in my fond memory it was much more controlled than the Lyrik now... but was it?
I recently bought a 2020 RM Instinct w Yari fork (160mm RC) and am considering a damper upgrade. You seem to have been around that for a while: I found a cheap charger 2 RCT3 remote upgrade kit but unsure on wether to install this or go towards the 2.1 version or directly switch to the tuning solutions (MST most likely). Can you provide some expertise to make this easier for me? 🧐
For a Yari even a rct3 2.0 is a better upgrade than tuning the MoCo. But if you are looking for the best possible upgrade, look for the rc2 2.1 and start tuning from there, if you still need it.Hallo CXFahrer,
I recently bought a 2020 RM Instinct w Yari fork (160mm RC) and am considering a damper upgrade. You seem to have been around that for a while: I found a cheap charger 2 RCT3 remote upgrade kit but unsure on wether to install this or go towards the 2.1 version or directly switch to the tuning solutions (MST most likely). Can you provide some expertise to make this easier for me? 🧐
In case the remote lockout is a must for you, get the rct3 remote.
The remote kind of is the least interesting part of this but it was the one version of the 2(.0) i found. Alternatively I am considering the MST custom solution but I do lack insights on the effects and the budget to try all of the various options out there.For a Yari even a rct3 2.0 is a better upgrade than tuning the MoCo. But if you are looking for the best possible upgrade, look for the rc2 2.1 and start tuning from there, if you still need it.
In case the remote lockout is a must for you, get the rct3 remote.
tja... ask Mario.The remote kind of is the least interesting part of this but it was the one version of the 2(.0) i found. Alternatively I am considering the MST custom solution but I do lack insights on the effects and the budget to try all of the various options out there.
I got my rc2 2.1 from kleinanzeigen.ebay for about 200€ and, sold my rc 2.0 for 130€, so it was a cheap upgrade.
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