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DJBiker said:
Because as of 2002 ALL of the Enduro line, even the Entry-Level bikes come/came with AIR Forks!

How do you explain that one?

(A. Someone put a different fork on YOUR bike and that's not the way Specialized specified the bike to be sold)

(B. You don't really have an Enduro Pro, you have a Comp or just a "plain old" Enduro, which would be specified with lesser components to meet marketing/price-point goals)

(C. Specialized put a bunch of different forks on bikes in 00' and 01' because that is what they were able to get from their vendors)

Again, MOST, not all, but most Upper-Level bikes are spec with Air/Air, or Coil/Coil, you might just be the "odd man out"

and, no I don't think it makes a bike handle "Real" strange, but if you put a miss-matched set of springs on a race car or high performance sports car it might handle "strange." It will still go down the road, just not the best handling machine on the track . . .

Example: If Dick Trickle doesn't get his Spring package right, he won't win the race, his car will still go around the track, but he won't win.

Are you starting to catch on here? If you set up a bike coil/air or visa-versa it will still ride "OK" just not as good as it could or should. Any reasonably good bike "reviewer" would notice the difference.

Not all air or coil forks are automatically progressive or linear. I've got an Xvert Super fork(coil/mcu) on a HT, and it seems to be a fairly progressive fork (at least I think so) so it should match pretty well with an air rear shock. AFAIK Xverts weren't produced after '01, so pting's enduro might have come with one OEM Xvert if it's an '01.

As I'm sure you're aware, the design of the rear suspension can be rising or falling rate, so a progressive shock doesn't necessarily mean it won't match with a coil fork, if it's on a falling rate frame it might match well. Some shocks (Cane Creek, Fox AVA) are getting more linear too. My fsr frame seems to be rising rate, with a small Float shock, it's definitely a very progressive combination (impossible to get full travel using proper sag), and matches pretty well to the Noleen fork I've got on it now (plush fork but still progressive, because of the small air spring chamber). My point is, how progressive the combination of shock and suspension design is, gives the progressive or linear action you want to match the fork to, not just the fact you might have an air shock.
 

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Go Bears!
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DJBiker said:
(B. You don't really have an Enduro Pro, you have a Comp or just a "plain old" Enduro, which would be specified with lesser components to meet marketing/price-point goals)

and, no I don't think it makes a bike handle "Real" strange, but if you put a miss-matched set of springs on a race car or high performance sports car it might handle "strange." It will still go down the road, just not the best handling machine on the track . . .

Example: If Dick Trickle doesn't get his Spring package right, he won't win the race, his car will still go around the track, but he won't win.

Are you starting to catch on here? If you set up a bike coil/air or visa-versa it will still ride "OK" just not as good as it could or should. Any reasonably good bike "reviewer" would notice the difference.
It's a 2000 Enduro pro, stock.

Your car analogy sounds good on the surface, but again, it's more about the tuning than about what exact combination is on there. Why is a coilover setup so much better than stock suspensions from the car manufacturer? Because it's tunable. Because you can corner weight the car, adjust suspension height, adjust compression and rebound, etc.

Air/coil mismatches are pretty far down on my list of worries. Anyways, my point is that a high quality well tunable shock like the X-Vert (Rebound, Compression, and TPC+) feels better to me than the new Psylo I tested, but not as great as the new Fox forks. But enough so that I don't feel the need to go spend $500 on a fork.

Like they say, the most important upgrade is the nut behind the wheel. There are alot of folks who will whip my arse around a racetrack in a Corolla, no matter what I'm driving. There are alot of folks who will whup me on a walmart huffy. Unless you're getting paid to do it, who cares?
 

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keep the shiny side up!
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don't worry about having an air/coil combination. it is not the problem that some people would have you think it is. as you said, the setup is most important. i would definitely get the fox. it is a stronger fork than the black.
 

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Beyond the stars
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Rising Rate, Falling Rate Suspensions, Oh My

I agree, some of you guys have made several very good points. And judging by most of the comments, to some extent (even if you don't want to admit it) you agree with me.

Most, not all, but MOST bikes share like setups air/air or coil/coil. Hold on not, I said MOST, not all, yes there is an "odd duck" or two out there. Even some shocks/forks that try to be both.

My car analogy is GREATLY SIMPLIFIED especially if you consider that Shocks and Springs serve a different function on a CAR, so if you get into the details of coil-over setups on cars verses stock systems, you have to understand the "natural ocilations of the spring" and how the "dampener" is supposed to "dampen" those ocilations and Dampeners are just another name for shocks, oh hell, it's complicated and different all at the same time.

So, we are talking about a year 2000 bike, compared to a year 2004 or 2005 shock. Let me think . . . hum, has the technology of forks/shocks (at least in the bicycle world) changed much in the past 3, 4, or 5 years . . . . hum, let me think again . . .

Hey, do you guys smell something burrning?

I think the Vanilla is a great fork, I have one! and I love it. Do I think it's a good match for a GT I-Drive? No, not really.

Would you put a Shiver on an Epic (I know its a grossly overstated example) but you get the idea.

I think it's best to Keep Things Matched Better. Just what I think.

do what you think is best, just remember, just 'cause you got some cash and/or that part/componet is on sale/you can get a good deal on it . . .

Does it make sense?
 

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Go Bears!
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DJBiker said:
So, we are talking about a year 2000 bike, compared to a year 2004 or 2005 shock. Let me think . . . hum, has the technology of forks/shocks (at least in the bicycle world) changed much in the past 3, 4, or 5 years . . . . hum, let me think again . . .
<snip>
Would you put a Shiver on an Epic (I know its a grossly overstated example) but you get the idea.

I think it's best to Keep Things Matched Better. Just what I think.
The core technology in current shocks has not drastically changed over the past 3 years. You have (many) incremental improvements like increased and adjustable travel, lockouts, and of course SPV. The high end forks from 2000 like the X-Vert super are midrange or below now, but are still better than alot of forks. Just like how you probably wouldn't trade your Vanilla fork for a cheapie Rox Shox, even though the Vanilla is older.

We are talking about similar points here, but not exactly. My point is that air/coil mix and match doesn't matter as much as how it works together. Just because one is air and the other is coil <i>does not necessarily mean it's automatically mismatched in function or feel.</i> I agree completely that keeping things matched is better, but the definition of "matched" is not just coil or air. Match the feel and travel of the front and rear, air vs coil isn't really the point.

And the extreme case of a Shiver on Epic is going down a totally different logical path than what we've been trying to get at. Noone here has even remotely implied that this would be a good match in any way.
 

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Minute 1?

[I have a Manitou Minute 1 for sale I am asking 400 but make me a offer. Came on my VT1 switched it out awhile ago so its like new.

Patrick
 
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