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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
so does anyone else ever wonder how bikes and biking equipment are going to evolve in the coming years? things have evolved so rapidly in the past several years (suspension innovation, ever-increasing amounts of travel, lighter + stronger components etc) where does everyone think things are going to go next?

10" or 12" rotors?
15" of travel?
sub-30 lb dh rigs?

is there any way to predict what's on the horizon, or do we all just have wait?

bill
 

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i've thought about that before. i think that it's kinda weird thinking about the future of bikes and stuff. imagine 10 inch travel bikes that weigh 25 pounds and have a knob that locks the bike out and then transforms it to a rigid cruiser and then into an airplane and then a bird to a chicken. just kidding, but it is kind of weird. i can't wait to see the bikes that will keep coming, hopefully at cheaper prices.
 

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the 'bigger and more of' approach to current systems (ie. more travel, bigger rotors) is too obvious and not likely, since certain requirements have already plateau'd anyways. For example, we already have had bigger travel bikes but its been found that not only its not needed, but can also be detremental and present too much comprimise as far as design (like high BB's, large variations in geometry...). Also stuff like massive or dual rotors may add unecessary weight and fragility, where superior friction compounds or better cooling through material and part design (like the Hope Ti6s) can produce more than adequate braking power that people can use (hey, some people will never go any faster then they are capable of anyways).

Going from the trends in DH/freeride tech, i think it can be summed up as a complete divergence from road bike technology, where everything came from. So far we have larger headsets, suspension, hydraulic disk brakes, 2 piece cranksets (which may see larger BB shells one day), larger front and rear axles, derailller and gear arrangment variations.

One big evolutionnary step i expect is to lose the derailler for some kind of internal gearbox. The rest i see is mostly refinements in current technology, from suspension (air springs, better tuning, lighter weights), better tire compounds and more UST support, more component and frame refinements. I wouldnt expect huge drops in weight since that is a materials limitation, but manufacturers gain more experience all the time to use it slightly better the next time around. I think most improvements at this point will be incremental and not obvious, mainly an increase in quality and value.
 

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Intuitive, electronic DH brakes. They would pick up on your brain wave frequencies and automatically adjust.... no brake levers!

Scared >>> they gradually or quickly slow you down.

Excited >>> they let up and go full throttle
 

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zedro said:
the 'bigger and more of' approach to current systems (ie. more travel, bigger rotors) is too obvious and not likely, since certain requirements have already plateau'd anyways. For example, we already have had bigger travel bikes but its been found that not only its not needed, but can also be detremental and present too much comprimise as far as design (like high BB's, large variations in geometry...). Also stuff like massive or dual rotors may add unecessary weight and fragility, where superior friction compounds or better cooling through material and part design (like the Hope Ti6s) can produce more than adequate braking power that people can use (hey, some people will never go any faster then they are capable of anyways).

Going from the trends in DH/freeride tech, i think it can be summed up as a complete divergence from road bike technology, where everything came from. So far we have larger headsets, suspension, hydraulic disk brakes, 2 piece cranksets (which may see larger BB shells one day), larger front and rear axles, derailller and gear arrangment variations.

One big evolutionnary step i expect is to lose the derailler for some kind of internal gearbox. The rest i see is mostly refinements in current technology, from suspension (air springs, better tuning, lighter weights), better tire compounds and more UST support, more component and frame refinements. I wouldnt expect huge drops in weight since that is a materials limitation, but manufacturers gain more experience all the time to use it slightly better the next time around. I think most improvements at this point will be incremental and not obvious, mainly an increase in quality and value.
ddduuuudddddeeeee....

who cares? Dual rotors would be pimpin! lol
 

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downhillzeypher said:
ddduuuudddddeeeee....

who cares? Dual rotors would be pimpin! lol
sorry, i have an arbitrary policy that one out of every 50 posts must be relevant and non-sarcastic. The other 49 my be used for other non-constructive means, say like saying your a big stupidhead.

48 to go....
 

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I think is gonna start to have less and less sense all the evolution thing...
Is like home PC's...
Remember when you wore "WOW" when the 200mhz came out...???
Check now , 2.+ Ghz and going... who need that for home use...!!!?
Is gonna be the same with bikes... we will have stupid stuff that we are no gonna need ...
If you can make a 20+foot drop with 7" travel... what you gonna drop in the future with 15+" travel...!!??
no point for me where we're going...
For that reason : I LOVE THE 80's... and the 90's... but fvck the 00's.

My 2 c. so take it easy...
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
efficiency

I'd assume that suspension numbers will plateau and manufacturers will concentrate on making the travel work for the rider. a la SPV, ETA, ECC, TALAS, 5th Element technology(spv).............basically, acronyms are the way of the future.
 

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i can imagine electric damping being used in shocks like in cadillac's magnaride cars. electircity in the shock fluid changes the viscosity of the fluid which then changes the damping of the shock. Some rotational energy from the wheels can be easily converted to electrical energy.
 

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i can imagine electric damping being used in shocks like in cadillac's magnaride equipped cars. electircity in the shock fluid changes the viscosity of the fluid which then changes the damping of the shock. Some rotational energy from the wheels can be easily converted to electrical energy.
 

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In all seriousness, I think Zedro hit the nail on the head...

zedro said:
the 'bigger and more of' approach to current systems (ie. more travel, bigger rotors) is too obvious and not likely, since certain requirements have already plateau'd anyways. For example, we already have had bigger travel bikes but its been found that not only its not needed, but can also be detremental and present too much comprimise as far as design (like high BB's, large variations in geometry...). Also stuff like massive or dual rotors may add unecessary weight and fragility, where superior friction compounds or better cooling through material and part design (like the Hope Ti6s) can produce more than adequate braking power that people can use (hey, some people will never go any faster then they are capable of anyways).

Going from the trends in DH/freeride tech, i think it can be summed up as a complete divergence from road bike technology, where everything came from. So far we have larger headsets, suspension, hydraulic disk brakes, 2 piece cranksets (which may see larger BB shells one day), larger front and rear axles, derailller and gear arrangment variations.

One big evolutionnary step i expect is to lose the derailler for some kind of internal gearbox. The rest i see is mostly refinements in current technology, from suspension (air springs, better tuning, lighter weights), better tire compounds and more UST support, more component and frame refinements. I wouldnt expect huge drops in weight since that is a materials limitation, but manufacturers gain more experience all the time to use it slightly better the next time around. I think most improvements at this point will be incremental and not obvious, mainly an increase in quality and value.
I agree with what he said. I think you'll see a continual refinement of a lot of the small things along with a few big break throughs.

I think that stuff like tire compounds, brake pad compounds, greater acceptance of 1.5 and such will be the big drivers over the next few years.

Also, I think that fork and shock damping technology has a long future of improvements ahead of it. Curnutt/progressive started the revolution, but now every manufacturer is on board. We'll see some pretty cool platform control / lock out systems coming on to the market over the next year or so from some of the manufacturers, as some start taking leads, while others play catch up.

Ya, big rotors and dual rotors have come and gone. Huge frame travel has come and gone (9" while great for high speed DH, is too much travel for most north shore style technical riding). Even with 8" rotors, people trash them way more than 6" rotors; with brakes like the Gustav M and the Hope 6-pots, there really isn't a need for more power (250 pound riders can pretty much cause the front wheel to lock up in almost any situation).

Lighter weight will happen to some degree, but again as Zedro mentioned it's as much an issue of good engineering (probably more so) than that of better materials.

There's lots of room to inovate in terms of applications though - long travel trail bikes due to more advanced suspension shocks and forks, improving the standardization of things like the ISCG tabs on frames (the current standard has problems), working out the probablems with BBs (hopefully external cups will help some of that, because no suspension bike designer want's to have to deal with a larger diameter BB shell).

I think that geared hubs will first take off in Freeride actaully. They are probably a little too heavy for the DH market right now, and until they start developing close range gearing, serious DH racers will probably still value tight ratio road cassettes for racing. I predict that they'll take a long time to enter the XC world (if at all) due to the inherent lower efficiency of geared hubs when compared to a chain / derailleur system. However, with a wide gearing range and the lack of a derailleur, they make a lot of sense for free riding.

Just my personal opinions.
 

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Man I love thinking about this stuff.

I agree that suspension travel is kind of maxxed out somewhere in the 8 - 10 inch range. People are already beginning to realize that bigger is not necessarily better. I also agree that adjustability will become more important - that is, adjusting the amount of travel as well as damping and platform characteristics. People are going to continue to want more versatility from their bikes, especially as the weight for big travel rigs comes down.

I don't think bigger or dual rotors are needed. Personally I think 8" rotors and any one of the better brakes out there right now have plenty of power, and I wouldn't want to add any more weight (or the complexity of dual rotors).

And yeah the next weak link is the drivetrain. We need to figure out a way to build a better system. G-boxx and rohloff -style systems are on the right track.

Eventually I figure everything will be based on electromagnetic fields. We'll have zero-friction wheels that pass though an electric field instead of rotating around a hub. Pulling the brakes will increase the magnetic pull with the same if not better modulation and stopping power than conventional discs. No brake pads to replace, no rotors to get contaminated or bent, and no more bleeding lines!

Similarly, the drivetrain will be based on an electromagnetic field that will have a broad gear range. You'll have infinite adjustment within that range - we'll have come full circle - with no more indexing, we'll be back to friction shifters!

What I really want is Robosquish, the bike Santa Cruz submitted to mountain bike when they did that article on the bikes of the future earlier this summer. Fully adjustable travel and frame dimensions, so with one rig you get eveything from a 3" xc bike to 10" monster and everything in between.

:D
 

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OGRipper said:
Man I love thinking about this stuff.
Eventually I figure everything will be based on electromagnetic fields. We'll have zero-friction wheels that pass though an electric field instead of rotating around a hub. Pulling the brakes will increase the magnetic pull with the same if not better modulation and stopping power than conventional discs. No brake pads to replace, no rotors to get contaminated or bent, and no more bleeding lines!

Similarly, the drivetrain will be based on an electromagnetic field that will have a broad gear range. You'll have infinite adjustment within that range - we'll have come full circle - with no more indexing, we'll be back to friction shifters!
:D
This will be great until that first big rain storm up here in Vancouver that grinds every seal on the bike into a wet, mulchy mess. The all that uncontrolled EMF will be zapping us between the legs all the way home...

Actually, the coolest thing like this has to be that Mavic shifting system that was released aobut 5 years ago. However, I don't see battery power (or even on board generation) as being the end all be all. The efficiency losses are much greater than with derailleurs and chains. Perhaps once "room temperature" super conductivity happens... Still, you need to have some mechanical to electrical conversion happen, then have an electrical to mechanical conversion happen.

Eddy current braking - that would be cool :)

THat's what I get for working in the hydrogen fuel cell industry - a quick dose of reality in terms of electric power... :-(
 

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Damn Noel, all that negativity is bringin' me down man...

Screw batteries, just turn the whole bike into a solar panel. And do you need to convert the electrical energy to mechanical if we're talking about electrical fields?

Just joshing. Obviously I don't know what the hell I'm talking about. I'm the idea guy, not the engineer.

PS, ran into one of your bros on a knolly up at Whistler this June. Forgot his name but he was with his son (or someone else's grom) and a very cool guy, said he has done some fabrication work for you I think. He was a great spokesperson/knolly ambassador. Let me take the bike for a quick spin. Was only a parking lot test so I can't comment on the ride but I was impressed with the quality of the build. Nice work there, I was itching to take it up the mountain but the lifts had already closed so I didn't even ask.
 

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Ha ha!!!

OGRipper said:
Damn Noel, all that negativity is bringin' me down man...

Screw batteries, just turn the whole bike into a solar panel. And do you need to convert the electrical energy to mechanical if we're talking about electrical fields?

Just joshing. Obviously I don't know what the hell I'm talking about. I'm the idea guy, not the engineer.

PS, ran into one of your bros on a knolly up at Whistler this June. Forgot his name but he was with his son (or someone else's grom) and a very cool guy, said he has done some fabrication work for you I think. He was a great spokesperson/knolly ambassador. Let me take the bike for a quick spin. Was only a parking lot test so I can't comment on the ride but I was impressed with the quality of the build. Nice work there, I was itching to take it up the mountain but the lifts had already closed so I didn't even ask.
Ya, negativity is the corporate focus of this company: "It's not good enough for you, nor any of your so-called friends, so don't bother buying our product!"

Ha ha, just kidding. Oddly enough, I've been involved in a few meetings today (day job) involving electrical compatibility (or more exactly - the lack there of), so perhaps that's where my EMF bashing came from. Sorry about that - I was just trying to have some fun being a bit of a pessimist!

Actually, I totally agree - it would be interesting to see what what really wild technologies come out in a hundred or so years...

Thank you for the compliments! I think that you probably met Len - a guy in his early 40s and built like a brick sh!thouse? His son is Dixon, who until he snapped his collarbone 11 days ago, can tranny all of the table tops on A-line, while pulling no footers and no handers. Just just turned 10 a couple of months ago. He will be UNBELIEVABLE once he hits his teenage years, not to mention his 20s.

Len's a totally cool guy, who's helped out a lot with Knolly (so has Dave K who posts on Passion regularly). I'm really lucky to have a great group of friends who've been volunteering their time. Now that we're getting pretty close to finishing the first production run (and holy crap the bikes are going to make the interbike prototype look like it was made in a garage - oh wait - it was assembled in a garage!) things are starting to come together. The excitement is there, but so is the stress!

Ciao!
 
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