[scandy1]

I've been hearing that the XTR derailleur and shifters work on eagle cassettes, and im assuming the other way around as well. I was thinking of running an eagle cassette, with XTR shifters and derailleur, or maybe sram cassette and shifters with an XTR derailleur?
I dont mind the eagle stuff, its worked pretty well for me so far, but for my new build since i have the option, if i can get a little improvement in shifting, especially shifting under power, i dont mind trying a mix of components.

 

[mevnet]

Eagle GX cassette with XTR shifter and derailleur. Actually tried a few more options, you can see them on the channel. Working just fine -

Don't know if I would call the mixed drivetrain as an improvement over the all SRAM or all Shimano drivetrain though. Working perfectly fine for my needs, that I can say. YMMV

 

[Harold]

I've been hearing that the XTR derailleur and shifters work on eagle cassettes, and im assuming the other way around as well. I was thinking of running an eagle cassette, with XTR shifters and derailleur, or maybe sram cassette and shifters with an XTR derailleur?
I dont mind the eagle stuff, its worked pretty well for me so far, but for my new build since i have the option, if i can get a little improvement in shifting, especially shifting under power, i dont mind trying a mix of components.

Not sure how you went from "mixed drivetrains work" to "a mixed drivetrain might be better!"

I'm not sure that's ever been the case.

 

[LyNx]

You're not going to get the benefits of the new Shimano "better shifting under load" unless you run their complete drivetrain, cassette, chain, RD and shifter are all part of the equation. Could probably get away with not running the shifter, but if you're going 75%+ of the way, might as well go full hog.

 

[wytemike21]

Not sure how you went from "mixed drivetrains work" to "a mixed drivetrain might be better!"

I'm not sure that's ever been the case.

I run a mixed 11speed drivertrain sram xx1 cassette and chain...weighs less than Shimano shifts great, Shimano xtr derailleur and shifter...lighter than sram, stronger adjustable clutch and a preferred shifter action for me...full out the lightest 11sp drivetrain, with a shifter I prefer

=Better

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[MagicShite]

Not a good combo.

My friend did the same thing and while it shifts fine when it's clean, but when it's muddy the entire thing just jams up.

 

[ColinL]

Serious question: with the availability of microspline, why would anyone want to do this? XD drivers are everywhere, better engineering, cheaper, and lighter.

 

[sturge]

The GX Eagle 12 has it's positives but the whole 12spd cassette/derailleur design has a downside for me. I have wiped out 2 derailleurs, 2 hangers, and a few spokes in the last year because this setup is a debris magnet. I'm considering ditching it to get away from low hanging cage assy. In 30 years of riding I never had this many debris issues and to compound it, the 12spd stuff is expensive to replace. Not interested in spending $200-300 for upgraded X0 or XX1 derailleurs so I'm looking at alternatives.

Considering 'mixed' combo of 11 speed GX cassette (so I don't need to change to a non-XD hub), a Shimano XT M8000 med cage derailleur along with 11spd Shimano XT shifter. I can change 34T chainring to 32T or 30T get me at similar ratio for climbing gear. I've heard many have done this with good results and it can be done for about $300.

I'm in tight NE singletrack so 11 speeds will be fine and I solve the recurring debris issues.

 

[uzurpator]

Serious question: with the availability of microspline, why would anyone want to do this?

Because SRAM routinely undercooks its stuff unless you go for the top-end ... and from a prosaic reason of red-team shifters being push-push only.

XD drivers are everywhere, better engineering, cheaper, and lighter.

Only one of those traits is true. XD drivers are everywhere.
Wether they are cheaper - no, SLX rear hubs are going to be cheapest still.
Lighter - why would they?
Better engineering ->

 

[ColinL]

Because SRAM routinely undercooks its stuff unless you go for the top-end ... and from a prosaic reason of red-team shifters being push-push only.

Only one of those traits is true. XD drivers are everywhere.
Wether they are cheaper - no, SLX rear hubs are going to be cheapest still.
Lighter - why would they?
Better engineering ->

I didn't watch the video and have no intention of doing so. I've read all the deep-dive articles going back to 2012 when SRAM launched XX1 and the XD hub, through today, including Microspline.

The spline is inferior to SRAM's design. That's why SRAM got rid of it in 2012, except low-end cassettes (which still have a 11T small cog).

AXS blows away XTR mechanical and Di2. AXS also can shift up with your index finger if you really like doing that.

 

[uzurpator]

The spline is inferior to SRAM's design.

Because... reasons? Right?

 

[brex17]

Because fanboi.

 

[Velodonata]

The spline is inferior to SRAM's design.

Good luck defending that claim. SRAM charged exactly what they were worth for those XD licenses.

 

[Jayem]

Because... reasons? Right?

Because moving the torque closer to the center of the hub, because eliminating loose gears, because able to run 10t, because lighter, because hands down better. Shimano increased/redesigned their splines, but it's disappointing they are still making "loose gear" cassettes. The XD driver really designed out the splined driver pitfalls.

 

[ColinL]

Because moving the torque closer to the center of the hub, because eliminating loose gears, because able to run 10t, because lighter, because hands down better. Shimano increased/redesigned their splines, but it's disappointing they are still making "loose gear" cassettes. The XD driver really designed out the splined driver pitfalls.

^ Yup.

Seriously, how can anyone who has used splined cassettes all these years, and then used a cassette that doesn't have splines fail to understand the improvement? SRAM didn't change the things they did the past 7+ years for the hell of it. They were actual design improvements on bicycle drivetrain that had - let's face it - been largely unchanged ever since indexed shifting arrived a really long time ago.

This is ancient history now, but Shimano initially did nothing. Not a thing. Then realized 1x was kind of a big deal, and wanted everyone to keep using their shimano splined hubs. Which is fine. But then microspline? It's just a me-too, a second best solution.

 

[Harold]

It's just a me-too, a second best solution.

*cough*capreo*cough*

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[Velodonata]

Because moving the torque closer to the center of the hub, because eliminating loose gears, because able to run 10t, because lighter, because hands down better. Shimano increased/redesigned their splines, but it's disappointing they are still making "loose gear" cassettes. The XD driver really designed out the splined driver pitfalls.

^ Yup.

Seriously, how can anyone who has used splined cassettes all these years, and then used a cassette that doesn't have splines fail to understand the improvement? SRAM didn't change the things they did the past 7+ years for the hell of it. They were actual design improvements on bicycle drivetrain that had - let's face it - been largely unchanged ever since indexed shifting arrived a really long time ago.

This is ancient history now, but Shimano initially did nothing. Not a thing. Then realized 1x was kind of a big deal, and wanted everyone to keep using their shimano splined hubs. Which is fine. But then microspline? It's just a me-too, a second best solution.

Just because you both want it to be true doesn't make it so, you have presented zero factual non-imaginary benefits to XD over Microspline as a standard. How does XD change the torque loads the hub sees? A cassette and freehub body become one big chunk to the hub and bearings once they are correctly assembled together. All XD does is make installing a cassette more finicky and remove options. You could easily make a monoblock style cassette work well on the Microspline hub, probably better than on an XD, yet if you wanted to also be able to use a cogs and carriers style cassette on an XD driver it would be very difficult. Explain how a standard that is so limiting is better? Explain how external threads way down inside the assembly are better?

 

[Jayem]

Just because you both want it to be true doesn't make it so, you have presented zero factual non-imaginary benefits to XD over Microspline as a standard. How does XD change the torque loads the hub sees? A cassette and freehub body become one big chunk to the hub and bearings once they are correctly assembled together. All XD does is make installing a cassette more finicky and remove options. You could easily make a monoblock style cassette work well on the Microspline hub, probably better than on an XD, yet if you wanted to also be able to use a cogs and carriers style cassette on an XD driver it would be very difficult. Explain how a standard that is so limiting is better? Explain how external threads way down inside the assembly are better?

Installing an X-dome cassette is more finicky? In what world? All I have to do is literally put it on and tighten it. One piece. I do this quite often because I have two wheelsets for my XC race bike. Sure beats trying to knock off shimano gears with a hammer.

 

[Velodonata]

Installing an X-dome cassette is more finicky? In what world? All I have to do is literally put it on and tighten it. One piece. I do this quite often because I have two wheelsets for my XC race bike. Sure beats trying to knock off shimano gears with a hammer.

That's all you've got? That is not even a Microspline freehub. And when Shimano designed their original cassette freehub decades ago, they never intended it to be made of aluminum. That said, I have never needed a hammer to remove a cog from an aluminum freehub but I'll keep your technique in mind if I ever do have that much trouble with one.

I currently run XD on one bike, I haven't had any particular problems with it, but it's not uncommon for it to give some less experienced mechanics grief. The fragile locking device splines, buried threads and inconsistent installation torque are potential hangups. Microspline is obviously simpler and more versatile and I am going with it on my new build. Not that I expect SRAM to abandon XD, but Microspline is objectively a better standard even if it is a PITA right now being of limited availability. SRAM's own cassettes would work better if modified to mount on it, and aftermarket XD cassettes would be less of a freakshow if they were redesigned to mount on Microspline. The 10 tooth cog is the only reason XD ever existed, and now that there is a better option XD is dead to me.

 

[ColinL]

Just because you both want it to be true doesn't make it so, you have presented zero factual non-imaginary benefits to XD over Microspline as a standard. How does XD change the torque loads the hub sees? A cassette and freehub body become one big chunk to the hub and bearings once they are correctly assembled together. All XD does is make installing a cassette more finicky and remove options. You could easily make a monoblock style cassette work well on the Microspline hub, probably better than on an XD, yet if you wanted to also be able to use a cogs and carriers style cassette on an XD driver it would be very difficult. Explain how a standard that is so limiting is better? Explain how external threads way down inside the assembly are better?

Not that you'll read it, but welcome to 2012:
https://www.bikeradar.com/features/sram-xx1-component-development-and-details/

I usually refer to that article to explain to people why 9 tooth cogs are a bad idea but people still like their e13 and similar cassettes.

As to xd cassettes being hard to install... Lol. They thread onto the hub and tighten with the same socket as older Shimano (and everyone) splined cassettes use.

As to the deficiencies in microspline, that was hashed out over and over when xtr was announced, which by the way, was a very long time before anyone could buy it, and still lacks broad support today. Both unlike xx1 axs.

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