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jddist
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373 Posts
I still do have both and am getting ready to give the bird one more chance before making the decision to keep the 7 and sell the bird. As I have stated in a number of threads, I really like both. The bird, dwlink, has that really buttery smooth small bump and square edge hit compliance where the 7 has that typical single pivot feeling. The bird just rolls over things like you are riding a large volume tire with low pressure where the 7 feel like it initially gets caught up on things. This is really noticeable when you have the ability to consistently ride both on the same trails and switch back and forth. They both feel great coming down, but the bird, due to the above mentioned feeling, is a bit smother until you have a drop where I think the 7 feel a bit more bottomless and plush. As for climbing, I personally like the 7 better. I feel it climbs step tech stuff better than the bird and I think that is due to the shorter chain stay length that really allows you to torque the rear end into the ground. My only real dislike of the bird is that is really fatigues my legs. When riding the bird on my typical route, my legs are toast about half way through, compared to the 7. I also noticed when I was on the bird for a couple of months I had to start taking 2 days off between rides instead of 1 because my legs were just burnt. I tried different suspension settings and stuff but still had the same problem. Going to give it another chance and if I am still experiencing the same problem I will keep the 7 and sell the bird. I have asked many other bird, and other dwlink, riders if they experience the same thing and most all say no, so i must be unique. However, I have run into a few other that are experiencing the exact same thing which was nice because now I know that I am not crazy. Hope this helps.
 

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EDR
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10,426 Posts
When riding the bird on my typical route, my legs are toast about half way through, compared to the 7.
I wonder if it's b/c the DW provides a more "couch-like" ride over the rough when climbing. I imagine you can stay seated easier and pedal pedal pedal over the chunk. This would seem to fatigue the legs quicker...or at least in a different manner. The 7 maybe forces you to get off the saddle just a bit on those same chunky steeps, providing more leverage over-all...and less demand on your quads. I'm only guessing here. I've never ridden the DW and most people don't call it out as an issue. But for a long time Yeti/single pivot rider, it may take some adjustment and may just turn out to be an undesirable trait altogether.

Dror...I never made it to Israel. We sent another person to perform the audit. That was best for me anyhow.

Cheers
 

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jddist
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373 Posts
eatdrinkride said:
I wonder if it's b/c the DW provides a more "couch-like" ride over the rough when climbing. I imagine you can stay seated easier and pedal pedal pedal over the chunk. This would seem to fatigue the legs quicker...or at least in a different manner. The 7 maybe forces you to get off the saddle just a bit on those same chunky steeps, providing more leverage over-all...and less demand on your quads. I'm only guessing here. I've never ridden the DW and most people don't call it out as an issue. But for a long time Yeti/single pivot rider, it may take some adjustment and may just turn out to be an undesirable trait altogether.

Dror...I never made it to Israel. We sent another person to perform the audit. That was best for me anyhow.

Cheers
Good point, and had given that some thought and actually tried to be aware of that during my rides. My main thought was that is was due to the small pedal kickback there is due to the minor chain growth that happens when the suspension is activated. If you are climbing up a lot of tech stuff in granny gear the suspension is very active so while you are in mid pedal stroke and this happens there is all that extra force pushed back into your legs from the chain growth. The more active and plush the more kickback force applied back into the legs. This is just a theory but makes sense to me especially since that is what it feels like on the trail. By playing around with the shock sag and settings I can limit this effect (decreasing the sag a bunch and adding a bunch of compression damping ) but then the rear end is way to stiff and no longer that real nice active and plush feeling that DWLink bikes are all about.
 

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Registered
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eatdrinkride said:
I wonder if it's b/c the DW provides a more "couch-like" ride over the rough when climbing. I imagine you can stay seated easier and pedal pedal pedal over the chunk. This would seem to fatigue the legs quicker...or at least in a different manner. The 7 maybe forces you to get off the saddle just a bit on those same chunky steeps, providing more leverage over-all...and less demand on your quads. I'm only guessing here. I've never ridden the DW and most people don't call it out as an issue. But for a long time Yeti/single pivot rider, it may take some adjustment and may just turn out to be an undesirable trait altogether.

Dror...I never made it to Israel. We sent another person to perform the audit. That was best for me anyhow.

Cheers
Jamie, I heared the same thing about DW from istvisinet when he showed me SoMo. I think it's personal. I rode 6 hours on a DW Mojo SL in Sedona (I never ride this long) and 4 hours on a heavy demo Spot few weeks ago in Israel. Had much fun on both. In the past I demoed a flux and a Mojo and I like the DW ride. I agree it's not magic but it's good for me. Lately I thought my next bike will be DW but with all the good reviews for the new 575 and 7, I am confused and plan to demo the new Yeti's before I decide.
 

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EDR
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10,426 Posts
I rode 6 hours on a DW Mojo SL in Sedona (I never ride this long) and 4 hours on a heavy demo Spot few weeks ago in Israel. Had much fun on both.
Ya, not only is the issue we're talking about subjective on the whole, not every DW bike rides the same. Just like not every single pivot bike rides the same. It's the details in the execution, design, geometry, chain stay length, etc etc etc that make each bike it's own, despite having a common 'link' or suspension design.

Anyhow, not every bike is for every person. You may love the Mojo and hate the Firebird, who knows:)
 

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Registered
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eatdrinkride said:
Ya, not only is the issue we're talking about subjective on the whole, not every DW bike rides the same. Just like not every single pivot bike rides the same. It's the details in the execution, design, geometry, chain stay length, etc etc etc that make each bike it's own, despite having a common 'link' or suspension design.

Anyhow, not every bike is for every person. You may love the Mojo and hate the Firebird, who knows:)
Fully agree + riders like myself with XC orientation don't push bikes to the edge like istvisinet and others that ride very technical terrain and test the bike to the max. "Pedaling" up the rock steps/tables at National is an example of how extreem pedaling can get.
BTW, I don't know if I ever saw a Firebird in person.
 

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trail "cleaner"
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1,382 Posts
past 575 owner and now FB owner

istvisinet said:
I still do have both and am getting ready to give the bird one more chance before making the decision to keep the 7 and sell the bird. As I have stated in a number of threads, I really like both. The bird, dwlink, has that really buttery smooth small bump and square edge hit compliance where the 7 has that typical single pivot feeling. The bird just rolls over things like you are riding a large volume tire with low pressure where the 7 feel like it initially gets caught up on things. This is really noticeable when you have the ability to consistently ride both on the same trails and switch back and forth. They both feel great coming down, but the bird, due to the above mentioned feeling, is a bit smother until you have a drop where I think the 7 feel a bit more bottomless and plush. As for climbing, I personally like the 7 better. I feel it climbs step tech stuff better than the bird and I think that is due to the shorter chain stay length that really allows you to torque the rear end into the ground. My only real dislike of the bird is that is really fatigues my legs. When riding the bird on my typical route, my legs are toast about half way through, compared to the 7. I also noticed when I was on the bird for a couple of months I had to start taking 2 days off between rides instead of 1 because my legs were just burnt. I tried different suspension settings and stuff but still had the same problem. Going to give it another chance and if I am still experiencing the same problem I will keep the 7 and sell the bird. I have asked many other bird, and other dwlink, riders if they experience the same thing and most all say no, so i must be unique. However, I have run into a few other that are experiencing the exact same thing which was nice because now I know that I am not crazy. Hope this helps.
After riding Yeti 575s' for the past 5+ years, I recently purchased a new Firebird and can tell you the DW suspension is significantly better in the square hit/rolling dept. Pedal feedback in granny is neglible (about the same as the Yeti). Climbing on the FB kinda shocked me as I originally thought the front end would be dancing all over the place with a 170mm fork but, that has not been the case. National has a few features on the way up that the FB has had no problems climbing. Only the Waterfall remains uncleaned (climbing). I looked at the Seven but the stand-over (or lack there of) swayed me away and over to the Pivot.
 
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