Mountain Bike Reviews Forum banner
1 - 20 of 36 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,661 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm curious to know if anyone has tried a non platform shock on a VPP suspension yet (6.6, 5.5, VPX, Nomad or Blur)? If so how does it pedal, does it bob a lot? On small bumps going downhill, does it perform better than the platform shock?

By non platform shock I'm thinking about the Marzo Rocco, CaneCreek Double Barrel, Avalanche or even the CaneCreek Cloud9.

Thanks.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,850 Posts
I used a standard non-propedal Fox AVA on my Spider for over a year and found the bike performed much better that way. The VPP was perfectly capable of pedaling efficiently without any help. Switched to a 5th element for about 6 months and really didn't dig the feel. Really made the bike excesively harsh. Now I have an RP3 which I run in the lowest setting all the time and it performs as smoothly as the AVA did. IMO I would recommend to anyone looking into buying one of these frames to get it with one of the new Fox shocks so you can tune down the platform almost all the way. The Swingers/5th are just unecessarily harsh when you compare the feel side by side.
 

·
I dig trails!
Joined
·
5,604 Posts
BanzaiRider said:
I'm curious to know if anyone has tried a non platform shock on a VPP suspension yet (6.6, 5.5, VPX, Nomad or Blur)? If so how does it pedal, does it bob a lot? On small bumps going downhill, does it perform better than the platform shock?

By non platform shock I'm thinking about the Marzo Rocco, CaneCreek Double Barrel, Avalanche or even the CaneCreek Cloud9.

Thanks.
For me, better than a platform shock. I am running a Cane Creek AD-5 on a IronHorse DW linked bike. I switched from a swinger 3 way. The rear is much more active and plush, the linkage design does not necessitate a platform to be efficient.

Do a search in the Iron Horse forums as there a some of us who moved this direction by choice. Lots of posts with reviews. We are using AD-5, AD-12 and Cloud 9s.

One day peeps with VPPesque linkage will start to realize the full potential of their linkage and and ask the question, what is best for this design, not what is the blingy must have shock of the moment. Like you are.

Mr. P
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
663 Posts
A friend used to own a blur with a non platform shock. Wobble Wobble - Helllllllo bob. The more leg power you lay on the pedals the less it bobs. That said, with a non platform shock it smoothed out the terrain like Alladin's magic carpet.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
307 Posts
I'm curious to know if anyone has tried a non platform shock on a VPP suspension yet (6.6, 5.5, VPX, Nomad or Blur)? If so how does it pedal, does it bob a lot? On small bumps going downhill, does it perform better than the platform shock?

Yes by all means do to the torque sensitivity of the VPP drive train it lends itself much better than MOST other designs on the market today to non platform dampers. The original VPP's were amazing with simple shocks that had no platform jimi jami stuff. BTW most peeps setup their VPPs with minimum SPV or minimum propedal, its simply not needed.

IMHO IF you took the simplest damper, with no fancy platform circuitry and mounted it to all the various multi link, FSR, faux bar, whatever, the VPP would show as a clear winner in functionality it would pedal better and descend better. Pedaling is enhanced by VPP torque sensitivity and descending is enhanced by the rearward wheel path. This would be a great test for a magazine to do! A back to back to back test, one simple damper and all the popular frame designs.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,661 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
n10'sGuy said:
Pedaling is enhanced by VPP torque sensitivity and descending is enhanced by the rearward wheel path. This would be a great test for a magazine to do! A back to back to back test, one simple damper and all the popular frame designs.
Don't worry, aappling72 will be doing that test for us soon! haha

I saw on the Intense site they say for the 6.6

Optional shock: TBD

Wonder what that will be, would be real nice if it was the CaneCreek DB or Marzo Rocco!
 

·
Now with flavor!!
Joined
·
5,613 Posts
I've been switching back and forth between a non-propedal fox vanilla rc and a 4 way swinger on my vpx. There is a tiny amount of movement with the fox when climbing but barely. I've had 4" travel bikes that compress or extend more than the uzzi.

I think I like the swinger better but not because of the platform. The damping is just more controlled with the manitou.......most likely due to a larger oil volume......that's all.

The bike is a little more lively with the fox with boosting between obstacles and jumping.

Regardless of the sticker on the chainstay, all vpp bikes are not equal. I've ridden vp-frees, older v-10s and a lot of blurs with regular non-platform shocks (all fox btw) and in my opinion they suck without a very adjustable damper with lots of bells and whistles. There's a noticible difference in suspension progression that from what I can tell is a result of where the shocks get mounted on the front triangles. SCs all seem to have falling rates whereas the intense bikes are more linear to progressive. This to me is more important than resistence to pedal bob but again......intense's versions seem to do this better as well.
 

·
No, that's not phonetic
Joined
·
14,313 Posts
I demoed a Spider in Moab for a day with a non-PP Float AVA. I thought it rode brilliantly. Do a search under my handle for "spider" and you will find it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,661 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
kidwoo said:
Regardless of the sticker on the chainstay, all vpp bikes are not equal. I've ridden vp-frees, older v-10s and a lot of blurs with regular non-platform shocks (all fox btw) and in my opinion they suck without a very adjustable damper with lots of bells and whistles. There's a noticible difference in suspension progression that from what I can tell is a result of where the shocks get mounted on the front triangles. SCs all seem to have falling rates whereas the intense bikes are more linear to progressive. This to me is more important than resistence to pedal bob but again......intense's versions seem to do this better as well.
Interesting, I thought SC and Intense had more or less the same type of rate. It would definitely explain a different feel.
 

·
Amphibious Technologies
Joined
·
3,472 Posts
EyoreRox said:
Hi
How do i set minimum propedal, on my fith element i have a 5.5
You don't! It does not have Propedal (TM)...
 

·
Amphibious Technologies
Joined
·
3,472 Posts
n10'sGuy said:
Yes by all means do to the torque sensitivity of the VPP drive train it lends itself much better than MOST other designs on the market today to non platform dampers. The original VPP's were amazing with simple shocks that had no platform jimi jami stuff. BTW most peeps setup their VPPs with minimum SPV or minimum propedal, its simply not needed.
I'm confused! If SPV/PP/Platform is not needed then why is Intense supplying their bikes with shocks that have SPV/PP/Platform? :confused:
 

·
No, that's not phonetic
Joined
·
14,313 Posts
SCUBAPRO said:
I'm confused! If SPV/PP/Platform is not needed then why is Intense supplying their bikes with shocks that have SPV/PP/Platform? :confused:
Try to find a major shock manufacturer which produces a non-platform shock. There aren't many (any?). In reality you can set the DHX Air or Coil to have VERY minimal platforms.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,661 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
tscheezy said:
Try to find a major shock manufacturer which produces a non-platform shock. There aren't many (any?). In reality you can set the DHX Air or Coil to have VERY minimal platforms.
We'll have to see if a lot of 2007 bikes will come out with the Marzo Rocco or CaneCreek Double Barrel. If so then Fox, Manitou and 5th will certainly also come up with something!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,284 Posts
tscheezy said:
Try to find a major shock manufacturer which produces a non-platform shock. There aren't many (any?). In reality you can set the DHX Air or Coil to have VERY minimal platforms.
The difference between a real dead feeling 5th Element coil shock and a more lively Fox DHX 5 is like night and day. I road my VPX with the propedal on the min. setting, and it felt very lively and like a "nonplatform shock".
 

·
Now with flavor!!
Joined
·
5,613 Posts
BanzaiRider said:
Interesting, I thought SC and Intense had more or less the same type of rate. It would definitely explain a different feel.
I was REALLY curious about this when I got my uzzi. I got the thing based on geo numbers more than anything else so I prepared myself for having what I call a "bandaid" bike. The newer shocks out now can mask a lot of bikes inherent characteristics. I was pretty stoked to see my bike perform pretty much identically in that respect when I put the plain ol' vanilla on there. I'm curious about the new zoke shock. If it's any lighter than the swinger, I'll probably try one out.
 

·
I dig trails!
Joined
·
5,604 Posts
SCUBAPRO said:
I'm confused! If SPV/PP/Platform is not needed then why is Intense supplying their bikes with shocks that have SPV/PP/Platform? :confused:
Consumers look at bike jewelry when choosing a bike. All of the VPPesqe manufacturers have similar shock set-ups. A non platform shock is viewed as low-end and may not look good on a $3000 bike to a consumer.

Mr. P
 

·
Amphibious Technologies
Joined
·
3,472 Posts
Mr.P said:
Consumers look at bike jewelry when choosing a bike. All of the VPPesqe manufacturers have similar shock set-ups. A non platform shock is viewed as low-end and may not look good on a $3000 bike to a consumer.

Mr. P
I think you hit the nail on the head!

What Tscheezy said is true but as you can see from Santa Cruz and Specialized bikes, Fox will custom make OEM shocks to required specs, i'.e. high volume RP3s, etc. So Intense, if they really wanted, can outfit their bikes with custom shocks without PP.
 
1 - 20 of 36 Posts
Top