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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello,

I'm new to the forum, and like most new members, I'm coming to you with questions about bikes and set ups.

I've been riding the same bike since I was 16 years old (25 now), and I'm way over due for a new bike. I've just recently started riding again and I've been bitten by the Mtn Bike Bug all over again. I'm looking for an all mountain type bike. I've been looking at the Santa Cruz Blur LT, Rocky Mountain Slayer series, and the Specialized all mountain bikes. I'm trying to keep my budget under $3k.

What would you guys recommend? Any thoughts on components would be appreciated too. Thank you in advance for your replies.

Hapa
 

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Have you test rode any of them yet, if you have your eye on a certain one make sure it fits you and feels right. Then compare the spec's and their rep.
 

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Santa Cruz have a very good reputation. I personally don't like rocky mountain because of the complexity of their pivot designs. But you can get them at a really good price right now. Specialized is good, but they run their cables in front of the downtube which I don't like. I went with a trek fuel ex. 140mm up front and rear, and the frame is guaranteed for life. The gary fisher hifi is also guaranteed (they are the same company), and that frame won some award last year for best frame of the year.
 

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Chopsuey said:
Have you test rode any of them yet, if you have your eye on a certain one make sure it fits you and feels right. Then compare the spec's and their rep.
Ditto.
Next question...
 

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Hapa™ said:
Hello,

I'm new to the forum, and like most new members, I'm coming to you with questions about bikes and set ups.

I've been riding the same bike since I was 16 years old (25 now), and I'm way over due for a new bike. I've just recently started riding again and I've been bitten by the Mtn Bike Bug all over again. I'm looking for an all mountain type bike. I've been looking at the Santa Cruz Blur LT, Rocky Mountain Slayer series, and the Specialized all mountain bikes. I'm trying to keep my budget under $3k.

What would you guys recommend? Any thoughts on components would be appreciated too. Thank you in advance for your replies.

Hapa
There aren't any bad bikes at a ceiling price of $3000. At all. There are, however, a million options that are completely dependent on personal preference and riding style.

The Santa Cruz Blur LT is a fantastic bike, but not great value for money (I own an 04 Blur) and they have a tiny bit of pedal kickback in some situations. Specialized Stumpjumpers are really forgiving and versatile, but there are trade offs - not terribly efficient pedalers, a bit of bobbing. DW link bikes like Pivot or Turner pedal amazingly well through bumps, but may not feel as "plush" as other bikes. I could do this all day, for every brand...

Every bike is a bit of a compromise. You have to know your riding style pretty well to know what compromises are acceptable to you. As for components, all bikes in this range will be SRAM X.7 or X.9, or Shimano SLX or XT -- all pretty flawless component groups. Brakes will be mid-high end hydraulic (they are all good too, and all have compromises). Weight will vary greatly depending on what the bike is set up to do - jump off high stuff or win XC races or both.

The only things some manufacturers cheap out on, that I believe one should NEVER cheap out on, are wheels. When you find a bike you like post up the wheelset in the Wheels and Tires forum and ask opinions on them before you buy.
 

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complexity?

mlepito said:
Santa Cruz have a very good reputation. I personally don't like rocky mountain because of the complexity of their pivot designs. But you can get them at a really good price right now. Specialized is good, but they run their cables in front of the downtube which I don't like. I went with a trek fuel ex. 140mm up front and rear, and the frame is guaranteed for life. The gary fisher hifi is also guaranteed (they are the same company), and that frame won some award last year for best frame of the year.
The Rocky Slayer esentially a single pivot, with a variation on a floating shock... not complex at all. IMO.

Jim

 

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simian23 said:
I could do this all day, for every brand...
Please elaborate on the GT marathon elite if you can. I read the reviews on the juicy 3 breaks and I tend to lean towards the positive reviews as I am not a heavy boy and won't be doing hard core down hill or even all mountain.

I basicaly baught a Costco Schwinn full susp with dual hydro disk's for 300 bucks back in April to get my ass off the couch and back into an active lifestyle. But it was not that much fun to ride on hilly streets so I never took it to a trail.

I had been to a couple small bike shops before that looking but was not happy with the service or selection. however, I saw a Performance cycle center next to the 24 hour fitness i joined a week ago and stopped in to see what they have. the staff was very friendly and helpful and the selection was through the roof. I went back several times to feel things out and some kid who works front and back for the last month helped me decide on the bike above.

Knowing nothing about bikes I set out to debunk my decision and after a few hours I fell here and have been glued to this forum any time I spend online now. After a couple day I felt solid in my choice and went to pay the balance on my new wheels and bring her home.

I would really like to hear what you or anyone else has to say about my new bike. I consider myself a cross country rider with a taste for medium jumps, nothing extreme. And no hard core downhill or all mountain.

thanks all, sorry for jacking the thread like that. newbs, can't live with em right.....
 

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you need to

mlepito said:
I count five pivots on this picture.
Note that the pivot near the bottom bracket is the one and only pivot for the bike's suspension...the chain stay is fixed and solid from that pivot to the rear axle. Regardless of all the other pivots, it's still a single pivot bike by definition. It allows rear wheel travel only as the chain stay swings up and down.

It's also known as a 'faux' bar, because it looks like 4 bar, but it's not a Horst link nor ICT design, both require a license from either Specialized or Ellsworth.

All the other pivots activate the shock, not the suspension track/travel.

Recognizing you may not believe me, I cut and pasted Rocky's design text for you to read:

LC2R suspension is a single pivot design, with the main pivot located just above and behind the bottom bracket. Both chain and brake forces are concentric to this pivot through-out the suspension travel, which eliminates pedal "bob" and brake jack. A thrust/ tug link engages the top link to create a rising rate suspension and the much-sought-after "infinite travel" feel. We tune LC2R to create an optimal suspension rate for different types of riding - from super cross country to Freeride and to downhill.

single pivot bikes are not complicated. Period.



Jim
 

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mdeamicis said:
Please elaborate on the GT marathon elite if you can. I read the reviews on the juicy 3 breaks and I tend to lean towards the positive reviews as I am not a heavy boy and won't be doing hard core down hill or even all mountain.
Components are all very nice, nothing wrong with Juicy 3 (difference between lower and higher end hydros isn't stopping power as much as weight, adjustability, and reliability). Wheels are meh, but good enough for XC. They won't be up to big jumps to flat though.

I've ridden a couple i-drive bikes. System works remarkably well at taking away pedal bob, the only downside is the rear end feels a bit "dead" compared to other designs. Hard to explain - like you don't quite know what the rear end is doing. It's a small thing though, mainly psychological. The bike handles great.
 

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I don't want to get into an argument, but this may act like a single pivot, but there are in fact 3 main pivots which require rebuilding and 3 additional bushing style articulations. I have had problems in the past with pivots going bad, so I personally don't like bikes with complex suspension designs. For most it really doesn't matter too much. If the bike is sound, and you keep up with maintenance it shouldn't be a problem.

I will say this, what this frame claims to do I don't believe it. The suspension is not independent of the frame (see trek fuel ex) so I don't see how you get that no bottom-out feeling. Also they say there is no brake jack. Yet the brake mounts are mounted to the bottom arm. There is no active brake system, (also see fuel ex). I know you love rockymountain. You must be canadian.
 

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Well Hapa, if you do your research you'll get a wonderful bike that you'll love. The first question you have to ask is how much travel do you want, 5" 6" or 7" You sound like 5 or 6 would be good. The next question is what terrain you ride and how you like to ride it (namely do you want an more upright or slacker geometry). This should significantly lower your options, and make it easier to choose a bike.
+1 for going to your LBS and looking at bikes, as the best bike is the one that fits you best. Anything by a major or semi-major manufacturer at that price is going to be a seriously nice bike. Personally, I'm a Giant fan, but something else might suit you better. Let us know what you decide.
 

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brilliant

mlepito said:
I don't want to get into an argument, I know you love rockymountain. You must be canadian.
Your logic is beyond arguement. If you don't think it's a single pivot, then take it up with Rocky.:rolleyes:

Your comment on nationality is simply puerile. It's about bikes, not countries. You don't know what I love, on top of a lack of design understanding.

Sign back in when you grow up, and don't throw insults without thinking.

Jim
 

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JimC. said:
Your logic is beyond arguement. If you don't think it's a single pivot, then take it up with Rocky.:rolleyes:

Your comment on nationality is simply puerile. It's about bikes, not countries. You don't know what I love, on top of a lack of design understanding.

Sign back in when you grow up, and don't throw insults without thinking.

Jim
So...the canadian thing was a joke. If you are actually canandian and took offense, that's not where I was going. And you don't have to be an engineer to see that a single pivot design should have a single pivot. Not three. remember the old y frame. One pivot with an arm that attached to the suspension that attached to the bike It didn't work great, but it was one pivot. Don't get upset. If you ride a rocky, and like it, that's fine. It is simply an opinion, that if I had a choice I would go with a speicalized or gf, or trek over the rocky for problems I have had in the past. However, I did state that the rocky was a good deal with great prices. I don't hate them, or you. There is no reason to take it personally.

I'm not going to provoke you, but flying off the handle like that? Maybe I'm not the one who needs to grow up.
 

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i read up on the i drive a bit on their site. i was looking at these bikes in the shop and the lower portion of the rear suspension assembly looked a lot different than anything i had seen and i wanted to know more. the :don't know what the rear end is doing" is probably because they worked really hard to isolate the suspension from the drive train so you do not get he pedal bob. something like that. their site explains it better than i do. i rode the bike for half an hour the day i put the deposit down. the store was closing when i left and it was the last day of a 10%+15% off special they were running. the bike really dis feel good. i have zero skill factor and can only compare to the department store crap i am used to. but it did feel like a lighter version of a yamaha yz 250 to me. and that was enough. thanks for the input.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
laxman2001 said:
Well Hapa, if you do your research you'll get a wonderful bike that you'll love.
I'm at the very beginning stages of research. I consider myself a complete beginner, and it's absolutely mind boggling on how much stuff is out there. I'm not sure what kind of rider I'd categorize myself as. I think I enjoy XC/AM a little more than any other type of riding. I like the idea of being able to go from some technical single track to bombing down some steep fire road. I would like the bike to be relatively light, so it doesn't feel like I'm going uphill on a tank. I took my buddies Santa Cruz Heckler for a spin, and to me, it felt way too heavy. I'm gonna keep on learning while trying to avoid stepping in ******** on the way. Thanks for the replies.
 

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Hapa™ said:
I'm at the very beginning stages of research. I consider myself a complete beginner, and it's absolutely mind boggling on how much stuff is out there. I'm not sure what kind of rider I'd categorize myself as. I think I enjoy XC/AM a little more than any other type of riding. I like the idea of being able to go from some technical single track to bombing down some steep fire road. I would like the bike to be relatively light, so it doesn't feel like I'm going uphill on a tank. I took my buddies Santa Cruz Heckler for a spin, and to me, it felt way too heavy. I'm gonna keep on learning while trying to avoid stepping in ******** on the way. Thanks for the replies.
That sounds exactly like me two months ago.
I fancy myself as a hard XC/ really light AM rider. I am, however, a complete beginner. But I had a whole summer ahead of me, and figured it's be a great way to get in better shape.
Looking back on it its funny now. I had originally planned on getting a nice, $1000 hardtail... Then I thought: "well, I could go to $1200...And after I tried out the $1200 bike, I was bored and saw the $1400 Trance X4. It was like heaven. I tried out a bunch of other sub 2k bikes, but nothing felt as good as the trance. Then, I saw an '08 X2 for $1620; well, I knew I was gonna buy that bike. And it's amazing. I'm dirt poor (until friday, paycheck!) but couldn't be happier.

You seem to be in a similar situation, except with a helluva lot more money to spend. I'm sure there's a Trance X around that price range (yep, http://www.giant-bicycles.com/en-US/bikes/mountain/2272/32146/) that should be sub 30lbs. A lot of people like the specialized Stuntjumper FSR (http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bc/SBCBkModel.jsp?spid=39191&eid=95) and the Trek Fuel EX series (http://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes/mountain_full_suspension/fuel_ex/fuelex8/).
A lighter, more XC bike would be the Cannondale Scapel (http://www.cannondale.com/bikes/09/cusa/model-9VP4.html)
You might also check out the Gary Fisher HiFi. I don't know much about it though. Definitely use MTBR, and get to know your LBS's. Good Luck!

Oh, and I have heard good things about Turner, might want to check them out.
 

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laxman2001 said:
I had originally planned on getting a nice, $1000.Then, I saw an '08 X2 for $1620; well, I knew I was gonna buy that bike. And it's amazing. I'm dirt poor (until friday, paycheck!) but couldn't be happier.
:madman: Yea, the first time I walked into the LBS, i was not spending more than 5 or 600 on a bike. :nono: . Like you, all summer to get in shape right. Well, socal has a never ending summer. there are trail heads of varying difficulty and length walking distance from my house and I have ridden mx for 20 years. After 4 trips to the LBS I walked out with a bike retailing at 2200. My cast was almost a gand less thanks to aggressive pricing, a 10% off on all 09 model bikes, 15% off anniversary sale and 10% in store credit back.

Last night I went for my first real ride on the GT Marathon Elite. I was gone a total of 35 minutes. i think i rode about 4 miles. It is a mild downhill from my house for about a half mile and then maybe a mile to get to the other side of the freeway so i can head north towards downtown Corona CA. all this is mild downhill. like you don't know you are going downhill. I took the industrial/commercial back streets and practiced my bunny hops with he new info from the bunny hop sticky, gotta good foot of air in minutes. was never able to bunny hop before, yea. I think I headed north about a mile and turned back home. All uphill and a moderate half mile climb to my house. So you, about 4-5 miles with the return all uphill. I was tired. But the bike felt really good. It was easy to find gears and corect my mistakes in choosing gears. I have zero gear selection skills. The breaks were amazing by my standards and the bike felt light underneath me. I can't wait to get some time to take it on some local single tracks and the wide open foothills by my house.

No matter what bike you get, just ride man. get out and have fun.
 

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mlepito said:
So...the canadian thing was a joke. If you are actually canandian and took offense, that's not where I was going. And you don't have to be an engineer to see that a single pivot design should have a single pivot. Not three. remember the old y frame. One pivot with an arm that attached to the suspension that attached to the bike It didn't work great, but it was one pivot. Don't get upset. If you ride a rocky, and like it, that's fine. It is simply an opinion, that if I had a choice I would go with a speicalized or gf, or trek over the rocky for problems I have had in the past. However, I did state that the rocky was a good deal with great prices. I don't hate them, or you. There is no reason to take it personally.

I'm not going to provoke you, but flying off the handle like that? Maybe I'm not the one who needs to grow up.
You know, you would communicate more effectively if you did not insist on redefining industry accepted nomenclature. You seem to be "fairly" intelligent, why do you insist on making things more difficult then they have to be?
 

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chas_martel said:
You know, you would communicate more effectively if you did not insist on redefining industry accepted nomenclature. You seem to be "fairly" intelligent, why do you insist on making things more difficult then they have to be?
I'm sorry for the way this post turned out. All this RM stuff has nothing to do with which bike Hapa should look at.

I didn't mean to mess up the nomenclature, but the definition of a single pivot is this

"The Single Pivot is the simplest type of rear suspension. It simply consists of a pivot near the bottom bracket and a single swingarm to the rear axle."

This frame does not have a single swing arm. That is besides the point. It has 3 points that have either bushing are berrings, and three other articulations that have bushings. That is why I personally don't like Rockymountain. Too many moving parts that need service, hence the "complex" part of my original post.
 
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