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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
First post for me. Lots of good advise on this forum. I am in the process of buying a new set of wheels for my 29er. I weigh 180lbs and do cross country races. I have narrowed my wheelset down to 2. 1)American Classic Disc 29" MTB 350 wheels and 2)Zonos Disc Carbon wheels.
The AmClassic set is listed at 1590grams and the Cane Creek set is listed at 1804 grams.
I am looking for advise on people that have ridden the AmClassics as to durabilty, hub problems, are they good for day to day riding or only racing, etc... and if anyone has ridden the cane creeks? I don't know if they are available yet for anyone to have ridden them.
Are the AmClassics the lightest production wheelset? Thanks in advance.
 

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threesixeight said:
First post for me. Lots of good advise on this forum. I am in the process of buying a new set of wheels for my 29er. I weigh 180lbs and do cross country races. I have narrowed my wheelset down to 2. 1)American Classic Disc 29" MTB 350 wheels and 2)Zonos Disc Carbon wheels.
The AmClassic set is listed at 1590grams and the Cane Creek set is listed at 1804 grams.
I am looking for advise on people that have ridden the AmClassics as to durabilty, hub problems, are they good for day to day riding or only racing, etc... and if anyone has ridden the cane creeks? I don't know if they are available yet for anyone to have ridden them.
Are the AmClassics the lightest production wheelset? Thanks in advance.
Are those weights with or without skewers? Any ideas? The big weight differences makes me wonder if the AC weight is w/o and Cane Creek is with. Then again, Crossmax SL discs weigh in around 1700 I believe so both those wheelsets are light for a 29er.

I have a set of the Cane Creeks on order with my LBS, they should be here any day. I'll post my impressions once I get some ride time. I have not ridden the AC wheels.
 

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Paging Donkey

Get Donkey to chime in on the AC's--he rode a set for awhile this summer.

No experience with the CC's.

MC
 

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mikesee said:
Get Donkey to chime in on the AC's--he rode a set for awhile this summer.

No experience with the CC's.

MC
Madre's AM Classics performed well for this last race season. We did the recommended change the AM Classic suggested with the new pawl or whatever it was.

They are very light.

I plan on selling them soon and building up a DT set. I wonder if a DT set can be made just as light?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Not sure about weights with skewers

Not sure if American Classic claims the weights on their web site with skewers or without. I would like to know though. Let us know when you get the Cane Creeks and how you like them. Estimated delivery on them for you?

Chic said:
Are those weights with or without skewers? Any ideas? The big weight differences makes me wonder if the AC weight is w/o and Cane Creek is with. Then again, Crossmax SL discs weigh in around 1700 I believe so both those wheelsets are light for a 29er.

I have a set of the Cane Creeks on order with my LBS, they should be here any day. I'll post my impressions once I get some ride time. I have not ridden the AC wheels.
 

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Industry 9

is worth checking out too.

MC - you still pedaling around on the Zipps?
 

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I had a 29er SS set of Amer. Classics. Performed great. I was 215 at the time. Straight and true for 4 months. Sold them, because I wanted a geared wheelset for another bike, and I didn't have a SS anymore.

I would buy them again.

Only bad thing on a friends 26er set was the nuts had to be tightened. No big deal unless you dont notice until it is too late.
 

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Soupboy said:
MC - you still pedaling around on the Zipps?
Yep. Got a set on the cx bike, a disc set with 6" rotors on the Moots race bike, and a disc set with 7" rotors on the Leviathan. The 'youngest set' is 14 months old. The oldest is just about to turn 5. As in years.

MC
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
fastest

mikesee, this might be a hard question to answer but in your experiences with 29er's and with wheel building, what has been the fastest accelerating wheels that you have used?
mikesee said:
Get Donkey to chime in on the AC's--he rode a set for awhile this summer.

No experience with the CC's.

MC
 

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threesixeight said:
mikesee, this might be a hard question to answer but in your experiences with 29er's and with wheel building, what has been the fastest accelerating wheels that you have used?
The ones with the lightest tubes and tires.

MC
 

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I had a buddy destroy a set of those very expensive american classics in a few months time. The rims are fine but the hubs turned to crap real fast. Very expensive for that level of junkification. The Cane Creeks seem really nice. And my limited experience with CC is that they make rather solid stuff.

I don’t want to second guess your choices but (…like most people who say I don’t want to( fill in blank )but…. that is exactly what I am about to do…. And like most people who say this I really do want to second guess your choices, I just don’t want to be rude about it), have you given thought to a custom wheelset.

Both sets you mentioned are expensive wheelsets, for that same money (or more or less depending on your tastes) you can get something really special that is just as light/durable/or whatever from a custom wheelbuilder. Also you actually get the gucci factor that expensive production wheels aspire to but cannot achieve.

I’ve bought wheelsets from Mike Garcia of oddsandendos and Mike C. Both sets were 29er sets and both are rock solid. The Mike G. set has a ton of miles and is still going strong. In fact, I rode them in a 200 mile race two days after I took delivery of the wheels. The Mike C. set is pretty much new and only has a few hundred miles on it. I went to Mike C. for the second set, not because I was unhappy with the Mike G. set, but because I wanted something special and wanted MC’s input and skills in the build. The experience and opinions of the wheel builder is one of the biggest things you buy when you buy a custom wheel set. Both guys had fast turn around and either will build you a great wheelset. I went with MC so I could use some of those gazillion miles he has under his butt to my advantage.

But don’t overlook your LBS either if they have a solid wheelbuilder who is familiar w/ the 29er thing then that is a good route for custom wheels.

My last two sets of wheels have been from custom wheelbuilders and built based on conversations with those builders about my needs. If you’re willing to drop the kind of coin that either the Cane Creek or American Classics demand then just go custom and get something special.

If you read this board enough just about everyone here likes something in some component that someone else hates. A custom builder (either frame or wheel) can help you sort out how your own preferences apply to the products available. The more my own needs get more specific and strange the more I swear by a "custom everything" mantra.

Good luck
Adam
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thanks

Adam, Thanks for the detailed answer. I have heard that the American Classic hubs had some "issues". I am leaning more towards the Cane Creeks but I am having trouble getting past the fact that they are more money and weigh more.
I definitely have considered custom built wheels but for this bike that I am waiting for on order (Fisher) I am swapping out the Bontrager wheels for a lighter set of prebuilt wheels ( I want to support the shop where I am buying the Fisher). So the the 2 choices that I have narrowed my decision to are the AmClassics and Cane Creeks. If there are better pre-built choices please let me know.
On the 29er that I raced this year, I used Bontrager Race Lites and didn't like the acceleration of this wheelset even with several different types of tires and tubes.

Adam said:
I had a buddy destroy a set of those very expensive american classics in a few months time. The rims are fine but the hubs turned to crap real fast. Very expensive for that level of junkification. The Cane Creeks seem really nice. And my limited experience with CC is that they make rather solid stuff.

I don't want to second guess your choices but (…like most people who say I don't want to( fill in blank )but…. that is exactly what I am about to do…. And like most people who say this I really do want to second guess your choices, I just don't want to be rude about it), have you given thought to a custom wheelset.

Both sets you mentioned are expensive wheelsets, for that same money (or more or less depending on your tastes) you can get something really special that is just as light/durable/or whatever from a custom wheelbuilder. Also you actually get the gucci factor that expensive production wheels aspire to but cannot achieve.

I've bought wheelsets from Mike Garcia of oddsandendos and Mike C. Both sets were 29er sets and both are rock solid. The Mike G. set has a ton of miles and is still going strong. In fact, I rode them in a 200 mile race two days after I took delivery of the wheels. The Mike C. set is pretty much new and only has a few hundred miles on it. I went to Mike C. for the second set, not because I was unhappy with the Mike G. set, but because I wanted something special and wanted MC's input and skills in the build. The experience and opinions of the wheel builder is one of the biggest things you buy when you buy a custom wheel set. Both guys had fast turn around and either will build you a great wheelset. I went with MC so I could use some of those gazillion miles he has under his butt to my advantage.

But don't overlook your LBS either if they have a solid wheelbuilder who is familiar w/ the 29er thing then that is a good route for custom wheels.

My last two sets of wheels have been from custom wheelbuilders and built based on conversations with those builders about my needs. If you're willing to drop the kind of coin that either the Cane Creek or American Classics demand then just go custom and get something special.

If you read this board enough just about everyone here likes something in some component that someone else hates. A custom builder (either frame or wheel) can help you sort out how your own preferences apply to the products available. The more my own needs get more specific and strange the more I swear by a "custom everything" mantra.

Good luck
Adam
 

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Yeah I got rambling there. When I read your first post I thought ... hmmm that was me a few months ago. I almost bought the American Classics and looked at a couple of other pre built wheelsets. But I just wasn’t happy with the quality per dollar ratio of some of those high priced wheels. So I went custom. I hate stuff that breaks whether I pay a lot for it or not. I saw your post and could relate.

Also I really like the idea of buying wheels from a person instead of a company and as I type this I have the hand painted “art work” from the box that Mike Garcia’s wheels came in hanging on my wall. The insert in the box was decorated by his daughter. A very nice touch nice touch.

Doesn’t Cane Creek make a wheelset that uses the Velocity fusion rim? That’s a nice solid rim. I’d say it was a great rim if it wasn’t for the fact that mine, like all three of my velocity wheelsets, are undersized giving a very loose bead fit. My Fusion wheelset is 1637 grams and nice and solid. But for what Its worth I now ride an approximately 1800g wheelset. I don’t subscribe to the whole bicycle rotating weight theory thing. That kind of thinking comes from cars and motorcycles, the acceleration forces on a bicycle wheel are so tiny (even if you are Lance) that I just don’t think it matters. I think that the quick acceleration snap of a wheelset comes more from its stiffness and the rolling resistance of the tires. Just my $.02. I agree on the bontrager thing (I have a set of the race wheels) by the way, those wheels just feel clunky to me, but my heavier 36 holed brass nippled straight gauge spoked wheelset has more snap and zip.

Adam
 

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threesixeight said:
Not sure if American Classic claims the weights on their web site with skewers or without. I would like to know though. Let us know when you get the Cane Creeks and how you like them. Estimated delivery on them for you?
Well, about a foot of snow here and temps showing -2 F so of course, the Cane Creek wheels rolled in today! They look good and I will try and get some photos posted when I can get the camera working again (weekend project). Weight was just a hair over 1800 grams for the set. So, not super light like the ACs, but very respectable I think.

Interesting observations--High flanges, non-disc side of front wheel is radial lace, nice bladed spokes--extras and a spoke wrench included with the set. May have to pull the stickers off the rims, my first reaction was they are a bit "over" stickered, but I am sort of a minimalist on that stuff. (Still need to pull some of the Moots stickers off my frames!)

These will go on a 19" Mooto-X w/EBB setup as a singlespeed. Soon to have one of the new WB Majic forks as well. More photos/info to follow when the deep freeze subsides.
 

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threesixeight said:
Adam, Thanks for the detailed answer. I have heard that the American Classic hubs had some "issues". I am leaning more towards the Cane Creeks but I am having trouble getting past the fact that they are more money and weigh more.
I definitely have considered custom built wheels but for this bike that I am waiting for on order (Fisher) I am swapping out the Bontrager wheels for a lighter set of prebuilt wheels ( I want to support the shop where I am buying the Fisher). So the the 2 choices that I have narrowed my decision to are the AmClassics and Cane Creeks. If there are better pre-built choices please let me know.
On the 29er that I raced this year, I used Bontrager Race Lites and didn't like the acceleration of this wheelset even with several different types of tires and tubes.
Thanks for giving us more info to work with.

If you insist on a prebuilt set, purchased from your LBS, then AC, CC, Bontrager, and the Mavic SpeedCity are your choices. Narrowing it to the AC and CC seems sensible. Given only those two choices, I guess I'd take the CC, but really I'm not into the compromises that either of those wheelsets offer.

If you'll entertain a custom, handbuilt set, you can save weight, money, and get a set of race wheels that are both quick and durable.

Follow the link (in my signature) to my wheel ad. Check out the Ricky Racer set. That set, 32h, disc hubs, comes in at 1674g.

At your weight, if you ride aggressively, this set may not be a great "everyday" set for you, but that depends on a lot of other factors.

Any other questions about that specific wheelset, please contact me off-list. My email is in the ad.

Also, Padre--does that answer your question about the DT's versus AC's?

MC
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
first question

After I asked the first question of quick acceleration I knew I didn't give enough information. My bad. I do think that pre-built wheel-wise the CC and AC were my two best choices. With the AC hub problems and the higher weight of the CC's I was just looking for opinions. I may keep the stock set of wheels that come on the Fisher for training purposes and get a custom set for my racing and fast group rides. Mike C. will be the first that I contact.

mikesee said:
Thanks for giving us more info to work with.

If you insist on a prebuilt set, purchased from your LBS, then AC, CC, Bontrager, and the Mavic SpeedCity are your choices. Narrowing it to the AC and CC seems sensible. Given only those two choices, I guess I'd take the CC, but really I'm not into the compromises that either of those wheelsets offer.

If you'll entertain a custom, handbuilt set, you can save weight, money, and get a set of race wheels that are both quick and durable.

Follow the link (in my signature) to my wheel ad. Check out the Ricky Racer set. That set, 32h, disc hubs, comes in at 1674g.

At your weight, if you ride aggressively, this set may not be a great "everyday" set for you, but that depends on a lot of other factors.

Any other questions about that specific wheelset, please contact me off-list. My email is in the ad.

Also, Padre--does that answer your question about the DT's versus AC's?

MC
 

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368
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
photos

looking forward to seeing the photos of both the frame and wheels. thanks.
Chic said:
Well, about a foot of snow here and temps showing -2 F so of course, the Cane Creek wheels rolled in today! They look good and I will try and get some photos posted when I can get the camera working again (weekend project). Weight was just a hair over 1800 grams for the set. So, not super light like the ACs, but very respectable I think.

Interesting observations--High flanges, non-disc side of front wheel is radial lace, nice bladed spokes--extras and a spoke wrench included with the set. May have to pull the stickers off the rims, my first reaction was they are a bit "over" stickered, but I am sort of a minimalist on that stuff. (Still need to pull some of the Moots stickers off my frames!)

These will go on a 19" Mooto-X w/EBB setup as a singlespeed. Soon to have one of the new WB Majic forks as well. More photos/info to follow when the deep freeze subsides.
 

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If your money supply is FINE,
you must buy Industry NINE

Your LBS might be able to order, or there's an authorized dealer on this forum somehwere.

 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
expensive

Wow. that is a wild wheelset. I seem to remember reading somewhere that these are very expensive wheels (at least to me). close to 1K for the set? or am i wrong

29inch said:
If your money supply is FINE,
you must buy Industry NINE

Your LBS might be able to order, or there's an authorized dealer on this forum somehwere.

 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
stiffness

It makes good sense to me that the quickness of a wheelset is due to stiffness and rolling resistance of tires. I have always liked my Mavic Ksyriums on my road bike. I have always felt that those wheels were plenty stiff for me. I don't know if Cane Creek uses Velocity rims on all of their wheels.
Adam said:
Yeah I got rambling there. When I read your first post I thought ... hmmm that was me a few months ago. I almost bought the American Classics and looked at a couple of other pre built wheelsets. But I just wasn't happy with the quality per dollar ratio of some of those high priced wheels. So I went custom. I hate stuff that breaks whether I pay a lot for it or not. I saw your post and could relate.

Also I really like the idea of buying wheels from a person instead of a company and as I type this I have the hand painted "art work" from the box that Mike Garcia's wheels came in hanging on my wall. The insert in the box was decorated by his daughter. A very nice touch nice touch.

Doesn't Cane Creek make a wheelset that uses the Velocity fusion rim? That's a nice solid rim. I'd say it was a great rim if it wasn't for the fact that mine, like all three of my velocity wheelsets, are undersized giving a very loose bead fit. My Fusion wheelset is 1637 grams and nice and solid. But for what Its worth I now ride an approximately 1800g wheelset. I don't subscribe to the whole bicycle rotating weight theory thing. That kind of thinking comes from cars and motorcycles, the acceleration forces on a bicycle wheel are so tiny (even if you are Lance) that I just don't think it matters. I think that the quick acceleration snap of a wheelset comes more from its stiffness and the rolling resistance of the tires. Just my $.02. I agree on the bontrager thing (I have a set of the race wheels) by the way, those wheels just feel clunky to me, but my heavier 36 holed brass nippled straight gauge spoked wheelset has more snap and zip.

Adam
 
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