[MK_]

I am wondering what causes the Nitrous to have a 165lb weight limit? What is the weakest link? I am wondering because I am about 170lbs, up to 175 due to my disregard for proper nutrition and affinity for sweetwater. I just finished my first race which I did on a titanium hardtail and although overall the bike felt good, there were some rocky sections where my rear end was bouncing so bad I couldn't get any traction, at least not enough to accelerate through. I was thinking that a short travel full suspension frame would be ideal. I got to thinking about the Nitrous and a few others, like the ML7. The problem is that I don't know what other sub 5lb frames are out there that have squishy rear?

_MK

 

[tscheezy]

AFAIK DT retracted the rider weight limit, but not the firm qualification that the bike was intended for xc-type racing only.

I will be honest we don't know if a rider weight limit. The large is Greg's personal bike, he is 215 lbs. Our thought is that if it holds up for him it will far outlast any 160 lb leg shaver. (snip) As far as being lighter than the Burner, it is not even on the same sheet of paper. We took everything we have done for the past 10 years and thought how to make it lighter. We then had an outside engineer take an even closer look to be certain we were on the right track.

(snip)

So who cares what Geoff [Kabush] weighs. The bike is simply a full time hard core XC race bike. If that does not fit your description, it is time to move on. You must remember, neither Geoff or Greg have to pay for their bikes. If they break, they get a new one. Average consumers who drop 2k on a frame and ride it like an aggressive trail bike will break it. Then you guys will complain because your bike broke. So take a really good look at how and why you ride before droping you money on a frame. It will asve you some headache in the long run!

 

[MK_]

That's great. Thanks.

_MK

 

[bikerx40]

The problem is that I don't know what other sub 5lb frames are out there that have squishy rear?

_MK

You might also take a look at the Yeti AS-R SL Carbon. They're claiming a medium with carbon rear-end comes in at 4.8 pounds, but I'm not sure how accurate that is.

Weight weenies has the medium aluminum rear model pegged at 5.2 pounds for a Medium with 5th Air, so an RP3 equipped carbon might not be too far off the sub-5 mark?

 

[MK_]

Yeti AS-R SL Carbon

Yeah, good suggestion, it should be easier on the pockets.

_MK

 

[Roostalee]

I read the review of the Nitrous in MBA, they said one of Turner's riders bent the stays while riding the bike. Not sure if he was jumping or whatnot, and I may have those details a bit incorrect, but the point made was that this is a lightweight racer's bike. The stays are CONSIDERABLY smaller than the Flux. At 175, you might be OK. But who knows....

 

[turnerbikes]

Geoff's fault

The achilles heel is that Geoff weighs 165. We do put a 1.75" down tube in place of the top tube to keep the rear following the front, but the seat tube, downtube and rear end are all standard tube walls. It is a XL with a super long seat and top tube. Since Geoff is 6'2" and 165 and is happy with the 'feel' of the bike, that is the weight limit. I think of it this way. Anyone that is a typical, serious endurance racer (road or dirt) is going to weight less than Geoff. He is over 6' tall, but is still built for propelling a bicycle. Anyone shorter should weight less, right? Ned, Tinker et al ride a medium and weigh in the range of 135 pounds, they too are built to propel a bicycle. They of course are exceptional so add 10 pounds to get a more realistic racer weight. So you can see that I have intended the Nitrous to be a race bike, it's too low, too long and is not intended to be the lightest trail bike in the world. In fact it was riding the Nitrous around the Sea Otter course last year that made me create the Flux, a racing and training bike for normal people. I rode that course every day I was there and the more time I put on it the more I thought Turner needed a bike that would be stiffer and more stable. I was coming off a Spot and found the Nitrous to be too much like a hard tail bouncing around and getting light on the braking bumps. The Flux was concieved. Greg no longer rides a Nitrous. He is a Flux kinda guy.
Casey has a super light Spot and a pretty light Flux. I have a light Spot, and a moderate RFX. No Nitrous', they are focused race bikes and none of us qualify.

DT

 

[cutthroat]

Dave - out of curiosity I ran the Linkage program on the Flux and the Nitrous. The Flux seems to have the most linear linkage rate of the all the Turner bikes (linear to slightly rising rates) but the Nitrous has a pronounced falling rate. Was this an intentional objective of the design or a by-product of all the other design factors? If it was intentional, I'd love to hear why. Just curious.

 

[CrashTheDOG]

Casey has a super light Spot.

Do you care to say exactly how light "super light" is?

 

[turnerbikes]

Kinda light

Well I should have been more carefull with my descriptions of other peoples bikes. Casey's weighted in at 26 even. I know that with canti' s and some sillylight parts on it it could be less, but one has to draw the line somewhere. I just threw mine on the scale and it weights 26.5 all ready for Fruita this weekend. My RFX pack weights right at 33 with my super smooth new Hadley hubs and Stans free ride rims. My plan is a Moab stop with Porc on the menu for the RFX pack. I did not have the patience to go for the latex, so tubes it is.

The rates are exactly the way I wanted them for different models with different amounts of travel. Does that help?

DT

 

[Debaser]

The rates are exactly the way I wanted them for different models with different amounts of travel. Does that help?

DT

Yep. Do what you want, and if I like it I'll buy it!

 

[tscheezy]

David, you should post your and the crew's bikes in the "databases." That would be pretty cool to have plopped in there someplace. You must have a few pics of the rigs, I assume.

 

[cutthroat]

The rates are exactly the way I wanted them for different models with different amounts of travel. Does that help?

DT

Yes - in a kind of "I'm not about to spill my design secrets all over a public forum" way....

 

[SSINGA]

My RFX pack weights right at 33
DT

What is a "RFX pack"? Is there a name or design change for the 6 pack forth coming??

Can you tell us?

 

[Steve from JH]

Dave - out of curiosity I ran the Linkage program on the Flux and the Nitrous. The Flux seems to have the most linear linkage rate of the all the Turner bikes (linear to slightly rising rates) but the Nitrous has a pronounced falling rate. Was this an intentional objective of the design or a by-product of all the other design factors? If it was intentional, I'd love to hear why. Just curious.

Here's what I think. Since the Nitrous is a dedicated racing bike, minimizing pedal bob while sprinting is more of a goal than bottom out protection. The falling rate does that. The suspension is in a stiffer mode up at sag than farther into travel. But the suspension remains quite active.

The rocker arm angle giving a nearly parallel linkage (similar to Ellsworth Truth) and an instant center quite far forward also reduces pedal bob without using chain tension to tie up the suspension.

 

[cutthroat]

Here's what I think. Since the Nitrous is a dedicated racing bike, minimizing pedal bob while sprinting is more of a goal than bottom out protection. The falling rate does that. The suspension is in a stiffer mode up at sag than farther into travel. But the suspension remains quite active.

The rocker arm angle giving a nearly parallel linkage (similar to Ellsworth Truth) and an instant center quite far forward also reduces pedal bob without using chain tension to tie up the suspension.

That's what I think too, but when I asked the Master about the mystery of suspension dynamics, he shoved a burning bowl of incense in my eyes and kicked my a$$ out of the temple. Later that night Dave's Granny rang my doorbell and when I opened the door - she kicked me in the nuts!

 

[turnerbikes]

Return of the RFX

We will be changing the name of the Six Pack to RFX for 2006. Seems the change has caused massive confusion amongst buyers around the world. Also, The Tea Tottlers Society of America has frowned upon our blatant use of alchohol in it's easy to carry form to promote our product to the young and impressionable. Shame on me, rolll back the clock, drum roll please. New for 2005 is the return of the RFX with beautifully shaped and butted tubing and geometry adjusted for todays forks and riding style. FYI there are no other structural or geometric changes planned.
DT

 

[Mr Pink]

Come on DT lets have some pictures of your own bikes!

 

[CrashTheDOG]

I'd consider "26 even" super light for a Spot.

David, you should post your and the crew's bikes in the "databases."

I second that motion! I wanna know how to build up a 26 lb Spot.

 

[MWWH]

lovely stuff

This board rocks. sorrry, I know this is irrelevant to this thread, but I just needed to say it. Cheers.