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not so super...
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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I'm not an engineer but I have been pedaling a variety of suspension designs around the woods for a long while. That is the only credential I have so don't go asking for much past what I have already written here. I have owned ATLAS and ICT bikes from E as well as the K2 version of DT's Stinger. To round out the list I spent a good number of years on a GT STS and a SC Bullit. All had some good traits but none were ideal. I only recently (early spring of 2005) came to the Turner camp looking for something better. I found it in the form of a 6 pack. It is my only bike and gets used for everything from pulling a trail-a-bike to DH racing and everything in-between. Well, there is not much I can say here that hasn't been written, photographed, filmed, graphed, measured and analyzed to the "dead horse" point in the hundreds of posts before mine but here it is.

My setup:
<O:p</O:p

2005 6 Pack front triangle with 2002 RFX 5" rockers. I ran a DHX Air and a ZAM1 in 130mm mode for the test. The TNT rear was the 5 Spot flavor. I know, not a very "pristine" set-up for proving a suspension design but it's what I had - deal with it!

<O:p</O:p
The ride:

Due to weather issues the ride was cut short to about 14 miles, but I think that was long enough to see how it performed. The trail featured a lot of climbing over very rocky; root crossed and loose washed out terrain. Once all the climbing was done there were long sections of technical single track DH and a very long, high speed fire road DH. Link to MTBR reviews of this trail.

<O:p</O:p
My Methods:

<O:p</O:p
I hung out at the back of the pack in an attempt to take the ugliest lines possible on the climbs (yeah right - good excuse though). I hit every root and rock I could see (and some I couldn't) to try to get some pedal feedback. Never happened. I tried granny and middle ring experiencing excellent traction in every situation. On the DH sections I hit the brakes at all the wrong times in an attempt to lock out the suspension or experience the dreaded "brake jack" (as a one-time 2001 SC Bullit owner I am very familiar with these symptoms) but it just wasn't noticeable. The fire road DH hit speeds of 27mph and it just railed through the unbanked corners. The TNT might be a hair stiffer laterally than the HL but I can't say for sure unless I did back-to-back testing which wasn't possible Saturday. <O:p</O:p

<O:p</O:p
My conclusion:

<O:p</O:p
IT'S STILL A TURNER!!

<O:p</O:p
It was a fantastic ride. I never had the feeling where I wished I had just left the HL unit on the bike. I can honestly say that I would have no problems (performance related) with getting a TNT rear should I ever break my HL rear assembly. My only problem with the TNT rear is the aesthetics. Next to the HL unit its look is industrial blah. Should DT add a little more CNC work and keep the stiffness I'd be totally happy.

<O:p</O:p

SS



ffice
 

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Lay off the Levers
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Kewl.

I agree with the comment about the looks but it's a non-anno proto. Take a look at SStocks I thnk the finished product looks a little bit more spiffy.
 

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not so super...
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Bikezilla said:
Kewl.

I agree with the comment about the looks but it's a non-anno proto. Take a look at SStocks I thnk the finished product looks a little bit more spiffy.
It's not so much the finish as the design that doesn't appeal to me. I like the "3 fingers" look and the longer relief of the opening to the seatstay vs. the blah rectangular hole in the TNT chainstay.

Superficial and nit-picky but I guess that is me!

Excuse the grainy and poorly lit photo - my digi is dying.
 

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Never enough time to ride
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Nice lookin ride, love the orange. Thanks for the straight forward review.

I'm kinda likin the way the rear end, reminds me of the older Race Face Turbine cranks. I always kinda liked the industrial look. But then I am a bit of a screw ball too :D

happy trails...

squish
 

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Lay off the Levers
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Folks have picked at smaller nits than that...some that do not even exist:rolleyes:

Geeze don't you clean you bike before working on it?:D
 

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not so super...
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
On a side note: Another Prototype on this ride was a set of Maxxis ADvantage 2.4 tires. They look a little smaller than a 2.4 (closer to the size of my 2.35 Nevegal) and the 60a rubber compound is a bit dissapointing for agressive riding in wet conditions. Overall the rider liked them but wanted a softer compound or dual compound configuration if they were to be used in wet situations like we encountered on our ride.
 

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Very cool to see that you can run 5" rockers on the 'pack. What is your BB height?

The 5/6" option is one of the main reasons I love my RFX so much- it's two bikes in one.

SSINGA said:
On a side note: Another Prototype on this ride was a set of Maxxis ADvantage 2.4 tires. They look a little smaller than a 2.4 (closer to the size of my 2.35 Nevegal) and the 60a rubber compound is a bit dissapointing for agressive riding in wet conditions. Overall the rider liked them but wanted a softer compound or dual compound configuration if they were to be used in wet situations like we encountered on our ride.
 

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not so super...
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
FM said:
Very cool to see that you can run 5" rockers on the 'pack. What is your BB height?

The 5/6" option is one of the main reasons I love my RFX so much- it's two bikes in one.
I'm going to get all the critical measurements with the 5 spot rear and compare them to what I get when I put the pack rear back on with the 5" rockers.

The pic attached is the stock Pack rocker and the 5" RFX rocker

 

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thanks ssinga - nice looking orange btw

the more and more i see of these reviews the more relaxed i become about the changes, and the less 'retentive' i am about 4-bar. as people have been saying on this board, it seems to be the geometry that has most influence on the ride.

i'm keen on getting a 6pack, but am scared of leaving my xc roots! could one of you knowledgable types confirm that you can still get 5 inch plates for the pack/rfx, as that could help me justify the transition to a longer travel bike. i.e. i could still air-shock and 5inch it as a trail bike if needed...

this pack-lust has sprung from my having been along to spectate a local DH race, and thinking "oooh, maybe i could do that" (-slowly and with both wheels on the ground as much as possible ;) ). that's why i'm thinking pack more than spot...
 

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not so super...
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
rexated said:
i'm keen on getting a 6pack, but am scared of leaving my xc roots! could one of you knowledgable types confirm that you can still get 5 inch plates for the pack/rfx, as that could help me justify the transition to a longer travel bike. i.e. i could still air-shock and 5inch it as a trail bike if needed...

QUOTE]

Turner does not sell 5" rockers anymore. You will have to find an old set from a RFX owner that went to 6" or find someone with a broken 5 spot and talk them out of the set.
 

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5 Pack

We have sold a few of what we call 5 Pack now. It is the heavy front end and Spot rocker and rear. Seems that the bigger guys like em a lot. Greg rides his with the 36 screwed down to get the steering where he wants it and has to ability to go a little steeper or slacker whenever.

DT
 

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cheers

thanks ssinga / DT. a pity the 5" aren't available, but after posting i realised that it would probably mess up the geometry i had just been so positive about!

oh well, i'll just have to find another reason to justify selling my 05 rocky slayer to fund a rfx!

though that ano green is fast becoming justification enough on its own...
 

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turnerbikes said:
We have sold a few of what we call 5 Pack now. It is the heavy front end and Spot rocker and rear. Seems that the bigger guys like em a lot. Greg rides his with the 36 screwed down to get the steering where he wants it and has to ability to go a little steeper or slacker whenever.

DT
What is your feeling about the RFX rear end with the Spot rocker?
 

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good stuff, how did you like the overall handling of the 5 setup?
You going to keep it like that for awhile?

Looking forward to your comments after you go back and ride the same stuff at 6.

With my van36 and low bb rockers on my old rfx I haven't had any desire to go back to the 5 inch setup. There is a chance that we will have a spot, old rfx with 5 and 6 rockers, and a new rfx all in the garage at the same time and it would be fun to compare and analyze all the different parts. But I figure the crew in temecula has done that already so I might as well just spend all that time riding (and building rfx worthy trail) instead.
:p:p
 

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not so super...
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
airwreck said:
good stuff, how did you like the overall handling of the 5 setup?
You going to keep it like that for awhile?

Looking forward to your comments after you go back and ride the same stuff at 6.

With my van36 and low bb rockers on my old rfx I haven't had any desire to go back to the 5 inch setup. There is a chance that we will have a spot, old rfx with 5 and 6 rockers, and a new rfx all in the garage at the same time and it would be fun to compare and analyze all the different parts. But I figure the crew in temecula has done that already so I might as well just spend all that time riding (and building rfx worthy trail) instead.
:p:p
I wish I could keep it like this for a while but Crash the Dog is waiting for me to finish with the TNT spot rear. Maybe DT will sell me a new Spot rear for my pack since he is now doing 5 packs as the "big boy" Spots.

I thought the bike handled well. I set the ZAM1 at 130mm to match the rear and never touched the TST or ETA on it. The group I was riding with included a RFX, Uzzi VPX, SC Bullit, SC Heckler and a pair of specialized's. I did't have any problems keeping up with any of them.

I will get all the measure ments out of the way this week before shipping the TNT on...so stay tuned.

Here is a pic of my 6" Pack Rockers next to 6" RFX rockers. Not sure which RFX (low or high) these are.

 

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I think those are the "high" (v.B) rockers. The low (v.A) rockers more closely resemble the new Pack rockers iirc.
 

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Living the Dream
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Dave, do you know what his geometry is with the 36 fully extended?

I here the 5 Pack may be a little slacker than the 5 Spot & I wanted hear from the horses mouth so to speak. Is a 5 Pack able to handle a liitle more aggressive riding than the SPot? Thanks

turnerbikes said:
We have sold a few of what we call 5 Pack now. It is the heavy front end and Spot rocker and rear. Seems that the bigger guys like em a lot. Greg rides his with the 36 screwed down to get the steering where he wants it and has to ability to go a little steeper or slacker whenever.

DT
 

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Natl. Champ DH Poser/Hack
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can ya school the rest of us on ""high" (v.B) rockers. The low (v.A) rockers"? ive got no idea what any of that means but as a owner of some of these bits im interested to understand. man its tough to be at the bottom of a whole new knowladge pool watchin the rest of you guys back stroke effortlessly above me. blubbbbb.... blubbbbbb
 

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turnerbikes said:
We have sold a few of what we call 5 Pack now. It is the heavy front end and Spot rocker and rear. Seems that the bigger guys like em a lot. Greg rides his with the 36 screwed down to get the steering where he wants it and has to ability to go a little steeper or slacker whenever.

DT
What about a 4 pack?

6 pack front triangle with 5 spot rear and flux rockers without the excess machining.

Nice heavy duty short travel bike for jumping and heavy trail riding.
 
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