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Living the Dream
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am trying to lighten up my 5pot for epics and 24 hour races. I have a 04 Firefly, easton monkey bar highrise, romic, 819s on hope XCs, 2.3 Stickee Kinetics with homebrew UST, and Crank Brothers mallett pedals. The parts I am keeping for sure are the wheels, my 180 louise FR brakes--they're brand new, thompson post and stem, fizik nisene ti saddle, truvativ stylo post, x9 triggers & derailer.

I already own a bullitt to use as my big bike. I am thinking of replacing the romic with the RP3, replacing my firefly with an 03 TALAS that I already own--I want to get this fork pushed is this a good performance enhancer? I will probably replace the pedals w/ candees, handlebars, tires--Nevegal 2.1 front & Mutano Race 2.24 rear. Any Other ideas?

I really would like feedback on the TALAS. I like my firefly but I would like to save weight.

Thanks
 

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Bodhisattva
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10,848 Posts
All your ideas will help save weight.
The PUSH TALAS mod is excellent. Inceased suppleness on the small stuff, better square-edge hit performance, less brake dive & the adjustable platform which will be helpful for long rides.
Consider swapping the rear rotor for a 160 which should be plenty powerful enough and will save some rotational weight.
If you're ready to spend cash, there are some other things coming down the pike that'll save weight, but it'll cost ya'. PUSH will soon release Ti rotors and Ti bolt kits. Stay posted.
 

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carpe mañana
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You may also want to consider a Maveric DUC (3.5lbs), you'll shave weight without sacrificing performance, you might even like it better than the firefly. There's also the SC32, shorter AC (matching 32mm foxes) with 1" less travel than the DUC. Tires are very important, get some Racing Ralphs, 2.25 up front and 2.1 in rear, or 2.25 all around, unless you plan on riding in wet, then RRs aren't up to par. RP3 will definatelly go a long way in reducing weight and keeping top performance.

_MK
 

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Bon Vie
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624 Posts
Alpenglow said:
I am trying to lighten up my 5pot for epics and 24 hour races.

Thanks
Romic 697g..............RP3 239g................nuff said.
I have an '04 Talas and love the ride/feel, had it Push'd back in January and it's a new fork. Darren worked his magic and made a great fork even better. Improved compression and rebound w/adjustable platform, wooohoo.
Most 24hr events have fairly benign tracks so checkout lower profile fast rolling tires (Python, Specialized Fastrack come to mind).

Hope these help.................peace.
 

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Lightness

I'd also give a big thumbs up on the RP3 in place of the Romic. Much lighter, even better performance, and more adjustability without having to switch springs.

On the Talas, I'm more reserved. I got my 03 Push'd, and while it did improve things, it wasn't that big of an improvement. Certainly not in the neighborhood of a $200 improvement.

I recently bought an 04 Firefly as a spare fork, and after 2 back-and-forth switches with the Talas, it has become my main fork, instead of the spare. After blowing the original SPV damper, Manitou replaced it with the SPV Evolve. Surprisingly, it made a huge difference (as in a much bigger dif than having my Talas Push'd).

But, the Talas is a whole pound lighter, so for racing, I would be inclined to hang it back on the Spot. Never again for fun riding, though!
 

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carpe mañana
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Plain Float is lighter than a TALAS and I prefer it anyway, due to its resistance to bottoming. 2006 will bring a 130mm TrailTune Float with inertia valve as well. And you really don' t need to lower your front end on a Spot, during a ride, under any circumstances.

_MK
 

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Something goes here...
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This may not be of interest to you but why not leave the Spot the way it is and get a HT for racing? Most 24 Hr race courses aren't very technical and a HT is super fast on them. I absolutely love my Burner but at 30 lbs., it's kinda doggish for racing. I built up a cheap Airborne Liberator (the alu frame from them) that comes in around 23 lbs. She's super fast and super light. Although, I'm not the fastest person around. I'd totally recommend the Airborne for strickly a racing bike. And it's dirt cheap too.

On the other hand, the Spot is a sweet-arse ride and would be great for racing. I tend to think 5" in the rear for racing is a bit much but that's just me. I did one 24 on an Id and it was a little much. Granted, the spot is a better bike than the Id.

Just my worthless .02.
 

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Banned
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meanwhile, after you spend $1000 trying to lighten your bike, you will come to realize that more and smarter training would have done the same for a lot less money.

I thought this thread was going to be a sensible discussion of how well the 5-Spot handles 24-hour rides, XC racing, backcountry epics.

instead it's another weight weenie discussion, full of misunderstanding about the role that bike weight plays in your fun.

people gravitate toward weight weenieness because it's measurable. "see, I removed my 5-lbs fork and now I run a 4.75 lbs fork with the same travel! Obviously I'm gonna dust your arse on that climb now!"

the problem is seeing a causation link where none exists.

if you're whittling down the sensible parts selection on your 5-Spot because of WEIGHT, obviously you should be riding a Burner, Nitrous or Flux.
 

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Bodhisattva
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10,848 Posts
No Gonz. He's already stated that he wants to race his Spot and is looking for help in dropping in weight. He's not interested in buying a new frame.
I gave up racing long ago, but I know that weight savings in racing, particularly marathon racing, conveys real advantages regardless of fitness level, etc.
 

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not fork swaps, Squeak. not fork swaps.

rotating weight. nothing else.

for general mass, training is a better tool.

ask any accomplished superfit roadie or XC racer, they'll tell you the same.

people get sucked into the commentary about bike frames and weight offered during the TdF and Interbike reports, etc., and wrongly conclude that in order to be faster you must shave weight.

as I said, there is a strong DISconnect at work there.

the fastest way to get faster: Use the lightest wheels, tubes and tires you can ride without flatting.

the 2d fastest way: train better, harder, smarter, more.

all the above assumes that you have no body fat to spare. if you do have excess body fat, you can lose that without spending any money on bike parts, and get the same results as those stupid Weight Weenies who think that part weight matters more than rider fitness or ability.
 

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Bodhisattva
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I understand the point you are trying to make and I agree 100% that rotational weight is most important in terms of relative contributions to that feeling of inertia.
However, by distilling your argument to rotational weight loss only v. training your argument loses credibility.

Take 2 exact frames. Each has an identical wheelset.
One has a fork that weighs a pound more, a saddle & pedals that weigh 1/2, heavier bar, post, stem, etc. The heavier bike could easily weigh 3-4 pounds more than the lighter one.


Each of these bikes is being ridden by a well conditioned rider of equal strength, stamina, etc. Do you really believe that over a long ride at full exertion, like race conditions (particularly marathon events as the OP intends) that extra weight is meaningless? C'mon now. ;)
 

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using logical analysis to obscure the problem, eh? ;)

again, I seriously doubt that the rider in question cannot afford to lose 5 lbs of body weight and remain healthy.

if you think there's a difference between body weight and non-rotating bike weight when it comes to work output required, you're sadly mistaken. the work output is required to move the whole body and bike assembly, and doesn't differentiate beyond the rotating mass issue.

our boy with the 5-Spot should stop spending money on trinkets and start spending time in the saddle AND watching how he eats. ;)
 

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Baked Alaskan
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your logic makes no sense

gonzostrike said:
if you're whittling down the sensible parts selection on your 5-Spot because of WEIGHT, obviously you should be riding a Burner, Nitrous or Flux.
I disagree. Your logic is flawed because the Spot is versatile enough to be up to the task. The Spot's weight with the RP3 is about 1/2 pound more than the Flux. Why build a whole new bike? That just makes no sense. Why buy a whole new frame when for 1/2 the price of the Flux you could easily spec a great 24hr bike on the Spot? The RP3 can go from super platform to really plush, and the rider wouldn't get beat up. But all things being equal, dragging around 4 fewer pounds will make a difference. IMOH, having a good amount of travel and an efficient pedaler would make a great epic ride.
 

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I don't do PC
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gonzostrike said:
if you're whittling down the sensible parts selection on your 5-Spot because of WEIGHT, obviously you should be riding a Burner, Nitrous or Flux.
He's only talking about doing this for the racing, what about the other 90% of the time when he's trail riding and loves the ride of his Spot? He already has a Bullit so why not have 2 setups for the Spot? trail and race, makes sense to me.
 

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Ride 'Til Your Knees Hurt
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PUSH it Baby...

The Squeaky Wheel said:
The PUSH TALAS mod is excellent. Inceased suppleness on the small stuff, better square-edge hit performance, less brake dive & the adjustable platform which will be helpful for long rides.
I have an '04 Talas RLC that is PUSH'd... What an incredible fork. What Squeaky said EXACTLY...
 

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Ride 'Til Your Knees Hurt
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It's pretty obvious that any serious racer is going to focus on proper training and diet (that's a given). The issue here is that he has a 5 Spot spec'd for trail riding not racing. He's not a "stupid weight weenie" trying to spend money on more parts. The changes that he proposed are practical for someone intending to race a 5 Spot...
 

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gonzostrike said:
meanwhile, after you spend $1000 trying to lighten your bike, you will come to realize that more and smarter training would have done the same for a lot less money.

I thought this thread was going to be a sensible discussion of how well the 5-Spot handles 24-hour rides, XC racing, backcountry epics.

instead it's another weight weenie discussion, full of misunderstanding about the role that bike weight plays in your fun.

people gravitate toward weight weenieness because it's measurable. "see, I removed my 5-lbs fork and now I run a 4.75 lbs fork with the same travel! Obviously I'm gonna dust your arse on that climb now!"

the problem is seeing a causation link where none exists.

if you're whittling down the sensible parts selection on your 5-Spot because of WEIGHT, obviously you should be riding a Burner, Nitrous or Flux.
No, the problem is creating a dichotomy where none exists. I don't remember Alp saying anything about not training as much since his bike was going to be lighter. Nor do I think anyone out there is going to roll up (or walk up, as it were) to a 24 Hr. race starting line relying on their light bike to make up for a lack of saddle time. Lower level XC racers may make this mistake, but if you're serious enough to be racing around the clock then you probably have a pretty good idea of what kind of condition you need to be in. Sorry to bag on you Gonz (though as much as you dish it out I'm sure you can take it), but this type of response to weight related questions gets old.

The focus on saving weight (like anything) can be taken overboard, but it is completely reasonable to try to drop a few pounds off a Spot built for trail riding to make it more competitive for endurance racing. I've got mine right at 30 lbs. for trailriding, but a simple rear shock and wheelset change will bring it down to 26-27 lbs. for endurance events. I could also save a bit more weight with an air fork, carbon bar, lighter pedals, etc., but do not want to sacrifice strength/durability in those areas for the 95% of the time I'll be using the bike for trail riding.
 
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