[papajohn]

It seems like I recently saw a thread on this topic but can't find it, so I apologize if this is redundant.

I was riding my new 5-Spot for the fourth time this morning, took a fall, and looked down to find that my derailleur hangar was in two pieces.

I know they are supposed to be the weakest part of that portion of the drivetrain, but holy cow! I have only ever broken one derailleur hanger in thousands of miles of riding other bikes.

I had intended to order several extras from Turner, but I am wondering if any of you have found a better source for replaceable hangers for the 5-Spot, and if so, what is it?

John W.

 

[CrashTheDOG]

I had intended to order several extras from Turner, but I am wondering if any of you have found a better source for replaceable hangers for the 5-Spot, and if so, what is it?

Hey papa, check out this thread, it'll give you all the details.

 

[papajohn]

Hey papa, check out this thread, it'll give you all the details.

Thanks, that was what I had remembered seeing. For some reason I can't figure out how to access older threads. I will follow up with Monty.

John W.

 

[turnerbikes]

Alloy

The hangers that we spec on each bike we ship are spec'd out of 7075 Aluminum. A couple years ago they were 6061 and that is probably when Monty lined up the source for stronger hangers. I was adament about having a fuse that cost far less than the typical XT or XTR deraileur. There is very little stronger aluminum out there that I am aware of, and usually the 7075 WILL fail before the deraileur twists. I will check with Monty's machinist and find out what they are using. The only material stronger would be alloy steel and then treat it with black nitride, like a rifle barrel or some steel legged forks.Now that would be STRONG! Black ano does nothing but color that part, it is merely a dye that is electro chemically applied. Hard gray anodizing like a Fox shock body or Turner pivot shaft will put a hard surface on the part that at max will be .003 thick. That also does nothing for structure, just making the surface very resistant to abrasion.

If you guys want almost indestructable hangers we can make them outa Cro Mo and either nickle coat them or black nitride so they don't rust and you can bet they will be tough. I don't have my #'s handy but someone out there should be able to look up the difference between 7075 AL and 4130 or similar CroMo for yield and tensile strength. Huge difference. Where do you want to draw the line for the fuse when the bike hits something?
Let us know.

Turner

 

[papajohn]

Wow, thanks for a response from Turner!

The hangers that we spec on each bike we ship are spec'd out of 7075 Aluminum. A couple years ago they were 6061 and that is probably when Monty lined up the source for stronger hangers. I was adament about having a fuse that cost far less than the typical XT or XTR deraileur. There is very little stronger aluminum out there that I am aware of, and usually the 7075 WILL fail before the deraileur twists.
Turner

Let me ask then with all due respect, do you have any idea why this seems to be an issue with the Turner hangers more so than others?

When I got my Maverick ML-7 the original hangars were crap, and Maverick reworked them and liberally sent out new ones. I eventually broke one, but after several thousand miles of hard riding.

The stock Ellsworth hangar for Truth and Id is so poorly designed that it doesn't position the stop for the b-tension screw correctly, so I got aftermarket CNC'd Ellsworth hangars from Speedgoat.com, and they have been fine. I have kept meaning to get spare hangars for my Titus Switchblade, but to date the original one has lasted a very long time without failure.

Was this experience with the Turner hangar just the wrong hit in the first 46 miles, or is there something about the material or design that is different than others?

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

John W.

 

[Roy]

Was this experience with the Turner hangar just the wrong hit in the first 46 miles, or is there something about the material or design that is different than others?

I can't speak for other's experiences however I've never had a problem with the hangar's being too weak. I've only broken 1 on my XCE in 4+ years of riding and that was during a major "stick in the spokes at high speed" incident (broke about 20 spokes, broke the rim, broke the derailleur hangar - derailleur was fine). I don't crash alot but I've had a few good biffs and haven't had to touch the hangar at all.

 

[papajohn]

Thanks again, DT and crew. Even though it's a hanger, it's still a major part of our bikes and it's great to see your dedication to this matter.

Papa, I don't think Turner derailleur hangers are necessarily more troublesome than other manufacturers.
As a suggestion, Titus does make a stainless hanger for their bikes that I have asked about on their board. Some people have bent theirs in freak accidents, but have been able to successfully bend them back and ride them like that indefinitely.

Thanks for the link about the Titus hanger. I am going to pursue that tomorrow.

Regarding the Turner hanger, I will be the first to acknowlege that the brand new SRAM X.O rear derailleur, which no doubt took the full blow, seems to be unharmed, as was the rear dropout. I probably wouldn't have been so irked if I had an extra hanger in my Camel, where I carry an Ellsworth and Maverick hanger everyday. It is not a difficult field repair if you are adequately equipped. Having not owned my Turner for a week yet, I just hadn't got around to getting extra hangers, and I had made a significant drive up to Phoenix to do some downhills on South Mountain, so it was a big disappointment to be broken down.

But it's all good. As I remember almost everyday, compared to being in action in Iraq, that is a pretty small problem! End of complaining.

John W.

 

[Pete]

Pick better lines, ride smoother, or just have a few hangers in your trail kit.

They are supposed to fail like that.

 

[Bikezilla]

... It is not a difficult field repair if you are adequately equipped. .

Careful though, As with every quick job it can easily turn into a project...at least under my hamfisted wrenching.

I was getting ready to bolt up a new drivetrain and just for kicks I decided to change the hanger JIC... rounded one bolt and had to drill the beeeyoch out. Good time not to be on the trail eh?

 

[Bikezilla]

My vote..

...If you guys want almost indestructable hangers we can make them outa Cro Mo and either nickle coat them or black nitride so they don't rust and you can bet they will be tough. I don't have my #'s handy but someone out there should be able to look up the difference between 7075 AL and 4130 or similar CroMo for yield and tensile strength. Huge difference. Where do you want to draw the line for the fuse when the bike hits something?
Let us know.

Turner

Maybe I'm unqualified b/c personally I've never bent a hanger but I'd rather have a $10-$15 hanger go than risk the dropout, and if it could save my $125 R-der, all the better.

It shouldn't be soft but the idea of designing it as a "fuse" is appealing to me.

 

[papajohn]

Maybe I'm unqualified b/c personally I've never bent a hanger

Do you mean you have never BROKEN a hanger, or BENT it? I personally think the Park DAG-1 (Derailleur Alignment Guage) Tool is one of the most valuable, worthwhile and often used tools I own. About once a week with each of my bikes, I pull the rear derailleur and check the hangar alignment with that tool. 90% of the time I need to tweak the hangar significantly to get it into perfect alignment.

I never begin to try to adjust the shifting of a rear derailleur unless I first use that tool to check the hanger alignment. It is impossible to get the shifting right, no matter how you tweak the RD, unless the hanger is straight.

As much as I understand Pete's suggestion about avoiding the hits, I am not that good a rider yet.

John W.

 

[Jaybo]

I think they are fine....

The hangers that we spec on each bike we ship are spec'd out of 7075 Aluminum. A couple years ago they were 6061 and that is probably when Monty lined up the source for stronger hangers. I was adament about having a fuse that cost far less than the typical XT or XTR deraileur. There is very little stronger aluminum out there that I am aware of, and usually the 7075 WILL fail before the deraileur twists. I will check with Monty's machinist and find out what they are using. The only material stronger would be alloy steel and then treat it with black nitride, like a rifle barrel or some steel legged forks.Now that would be STRONG! Black ano does nothing but color that part, it is merely a dye that is electro chemically applied. Hard gray anodizing like a Fox shock body or Turner pivot shaft will put a hard surface on the part that at max will be .003 thick. That also does nothing for structure, just making the surface very resistant to abrasion.

If you guys want almost indestructable hangers we can make them outa Cro Mo and either nickle coat them or black nitride so they don't rust and you can bet they will be tough. I don't have my #'s handy but someone out there should be able to look up the difference between 7075 AL and 4130 or similar CroMo for yield and tensile strength. Huge difference. Where do you want to draw the line for the fuse when the bike hits something?
Let us know.

Turner

I would rather bend my derailleur hanger then either my frame, ugh, or rear derailleur. I have ridden my for a long time with no bent derailleur hangers. I figure I will bend a rear derailleur once a year and a couple hangers. It is the cost of riding. No biggy. I think making the hanger stronger defeats the purpose of having a replacable hanger.

Just my thoughts,

Jaybo

PS The Spot rocks. I just floated over rocks today that would have stopped me cold on most bikes.

 

[Bikezilla]

Do you mean you have never BROKEN a hanger, or BENT it? I ...I never begin to try to adjust the shifting of a rear derailleur unless I first use that tool to check the hanger alignment. It is impossible to get the shifting right, no matter how you tweak the RD, unless the hanger is straight...As much as I understand Pete's suggestion about avoiding the hits, I am not that good a rider yet.

Nope, never. Matter o'fact the one I pulled off seemed as straight as the replacement. Clearly, I haven't been riding hard enough, or long enough.

 

[papajohn]

Clearly, I haven't been riding hard enough, or long enough.

Nope, clearly you have mastered Pete's formula for smooth riding and well picked lines.

I called Turner this morning and Casey is sending out replacement hangers today. I ordered several, and he was kind enough to throw in one more on the house since the original lasted such a short time.

Nice Customer Service!

John W.

 

[Pete]

Nope, clearly you have mastered Pete's formula for smooth riding and well picked lines.

Perhaps it's the medium but you're sounding a bit defensive.

I offered three solutions.

If you can't deliver the first two (and what riders that ride technical trails can always pick the best lines?) then carry the stock hanger. It's malleable for a reason. To save your frame/derailleur.

I'm on my second hanger and have one in my pack and one in the tool chest. It's the price you pay for riding cool terrain as opposed to lameass fireroads.

 

[Bikezilla]

Nope, clearly you have mastered Pete's formula for smooth riding and well picked lines.

Apparently you've overlooked my signature "steering by impact". I have this tendency to plant a shoulder into any tree too close to the line I want or the line I missed. Like you said body armor is a wonderful thing. Hey, it keeps me on the trail!

Finesse like a 60' lizard baby!

 

[Blue Shorts]

Apparently you've overlooked my signature "steering by impact". I have this tendency to plant a shoulder into any tree too close to the line I want or the line I missed. Like you said body armor is a wonderful thing. Hey, it keeps me on the trail!

Finesse like a 60' lizard baby!

I was wondering if you've had the same issues that I had with my derailler hanger. It seems that both the hanger and the Spot frame are threaded. That makes it very difficult to get the hanger flush with the mount.

I figure that maybe the holes in the frame were a little too small for the screws so the screws tapped some small threads in the frame when they were inserted. Does your frame appear to be threaded?

Maybe I should just ream the holes in the frame a tiny bit. Waddaya think?

 

[Bikezilla]

I was wondering if you've had the same issues that I had with my derailler hanger. It seems that both the hanger and the Spot frame are threaded. That makes it very difficult to get the hanger flush with the mount.
...Maybe I should just ream the holes in the frame a tiny bit. Waddaya think?

I don't recall my frame being threaded at all. Check w/Turner but it would seem sensible to me that the frame should not be threaded if you want the hanger to be snugged tightly. Be careful not to widen the hole more than absolutely necessary. And make sure you don't f'-up the countersink seats.