dunno, the damping in my 2003 WC (rebuilt by RS) feels light-years ahead of my 2002 SuperT. More supple and yet more resistant to bottoming, but hey, that's just my opinion... I mean, what's real-world experience and personal preference compared to being able to spew terms like hydracoil2 and HSCV and shims, cartridges, etc. I must be in WAY over my head in this post...Jm. said:
the super T is no longer their frontline DH fork as you know, and bottoming is a function of oil level, and very easy to set so that it never bottoms. Boxxers don't "bottom" because they use stiffer springs than marzocchis for the most part. Marzocchis can run more sag and have softer initial travel because the oil-level will keep them from bottoming. I've owned 2 boxxers, and my 1998 Super T just made them seem like a joke, even with less travel.dante said:
WERD!!!Slack said:
well, I've read on the internet that the HSCV carts in an 888 are 98% unchanged from 2002, though...Jm. said:
(not really, I just see dual HSCV carts listed and wildly speculate) Nope, the cartridges in an 888 are vastly different than the years before.dante said:well, I've read on the internet that the HSCV carts in an 888 are 98% unchanged from 2002, though...
How can you claim an 888 HSCV is vastly different from a Super T HSCV cartridge and yet an HC2 is 98% like the 1998 boxxer damping?? Have you seen the internal diagrams and have a degree in Mechanical and Fluid Dynamics in order to whether a change is "vastly different" in the case of Marz but "98% the same" in the case of RS?Jm. said:
I wasn't impressed with the stock 888 that came on a buddy's Stab Primo, but haven't really been able to spend a lot of time on one (also stock vs custom rebuild on the boxxer). Hmmmm. Maybe I should go around bashing Marzocchi whenever anyone mentions them b/c I didn't like their older products and haven't spent time on one of their new forks in the last 2 years. (again, I liked the 2002 Super, just like the newer boxxer better)Because internally they are extremely different, the "HSCV" is just a name, not a super-accurate description of how it works. The 888 has low and high speed compression damping, it is not an 8" "super-t" style cartridge. The older "HSCV" cartridges are most definitely different. Despite the internal differences, there's also other differences that are an elementry change from how marzocchis are put together, the jam-nuts, the simplified preload, etc...dante said:
A wise person in the industry, who is that, Bob Roll??Jm. said:
So because you had a 1999 and a mod'ed 2003 low end fork, *and* you've seen the internals of others, you're an expert on 2004 and the yet-to-be-released 2005 high-end forks? Disc brakes vs drum brakes?? C'mon, that's reaching, or at least would be true if 90% of F1 cars used drum brakes. I know you'll never change your mind about boxxers but the continual harping on anything that starts with the letters b.o.x... is pretty funny.
Ok, I hate responding on these boards, especially to JM (I think the analogy was "arguing on the internet is like winning the special olympics...") but I can't let plain wrong information be out there like this.Jm. said:
Maybe that is technically true, although when running the "stock" springs for boxxer, the amount of sag that you get never seems (at least in my practice on two completely different years and when setting up my friends) to come close to the recommended sag range, and when it does, then you get the bottoming.Flow 559 said:Boxxers and Marzocchis run extremely similar spring weights for like riders (because all forks are leveraged in the same manner by the rider). Since a Boxxer and a Super T both recommend 20-30% sag, a correctly sprung fork for rider "a" will use the same spring rates in each fork.
Feel free to continue about dated this, hype that, always this, never that. I know this, I know that, been there, done that. YAWN
Ummm, so JM's knowledge of forks somehow made you test ride them for yourself instead of slapping down a credit card for a fork that you've only read about online???Whafe said:
