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1st lower service of 2021 Lyrik Ultimate

2759 Views 21 Replies 8 Participants Last post by Trinimon, Nov 29, 2021

sdcoffeeroaster

Discussion Starter · Nov 28, 2021

1st time servicing a Rockshox fork. I watched the video and it seemed pretty standard. 1st issue is that the air shaft seems to be locked in the fully upward position. If I push from the top of the tube with a wood dowel it will move down but spring right back into the upward position like there is a stuck seal or o-ring creating an air spring. I had to push the lowers all way on and push the air spring with the dowel from up above to start the bottom screw for the air shaft. I think I need to take the air spring assy out and check for grease, etc. This doesn't seem correct does it?

2nd issue is that I instantly stripped out the rebound cap screw. It was very loose coming out and I didn't pay attention to the fact that it is not really a set screw like my 34 Fox forks are and even slightly tight will strip it out. And I was extremely gentle with it but probably didn't push it up enough before I tightened it. I've read that these fall out all the time and it's a "Rockshox thing" so most leave it out. Sucks but I guess I'll look around for a rubber cap to put on the lower bolt to protect it a bit if I do that. The rebound cap and screw are not available and cost over $30.! I thought about trying to build up the threads on the cap with JB weld and re-tapping. Any idea what the thread size is? I might need a bottoming tap to do this and it might make it worse or not work at all. It probably won't stay in like it is now so nothing to lose. Any advice will be appreciated, thanks.

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gocat

· #2 · Nov 28, 2021 (Edited)

So your saying, the air shaft is stuck in the upper tube?
I've been on RS for awhile. And always rebuild/ service them. Easy to service without too many specialty tools. Compared to Fox

The rebound set screw stripping... Not sure what to say about that. I never had a problem with that.

sdcoffeeroaster

Discussion Starter · #3 · Nov 28, 2021

gocat said:
So your saying, the air shaft is stuck in the upper tube?
I've been on RS for awhile. And always rebuild/ service them. Easy to service without too many specialty tools. Compared to Fox

The rebound set screw stripping... Not sure what to say about that. I never had a problem with that.

I didn't remove the clip to try to get the air shaft out but only the very end of the shaft was showing and I could not pull it down manually. Pushing from above I felt springy resistance and was able to move it but it wanted to spring back to fully retracted. That made starting the bottom bolt impossible even with the lower legs fully inserted unless I pushed the air shaft down from above with the wood dowel. I did put it back together but decided I'm going to take it apart today and see what's up with the air shaft. It's like the o-rings are stuck and can't be freed by actuating which says, in the least, the grease might be dried up. I'm hoping to get it to come out once I remove the bottom C clip. I only have about 50-75 hrs on the fork.

Yeah the stripped out screw is a bummer. You can tighten the fox version of this a lot but this Rockshox cap can be easily stripped if you do that. I was just using a t-hex wrench and didn't think I was applying too much torque but I guess I was...right? It was very loose when I took it out for the first time and I should have paid attention to that and how it was different from the fox version. Coincidentally we saw one of these, black one exactly like mine, laying on the trail a few weeks ago, lol. I didn't think much of it until yesterday. We left it for the owner in case he came looking for it.

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gocat

· #4 · Nov 28, 2021

Yeah, the air shaft is stuck. I would replace the air seals. Or theres a high chance itll do it again.
Put the air shaft bottom cap back on and wiggle it out.

sdcoffeeroaster

Discussion Starter · #5 · Nov 28, 2021

gocat said:
Yeah, the air shaft is stuck. I would replace the air seals. Or theres a high chance itll do it again.
Put the air shaft bottom cap back on and wiggle it out.

The bottom cap/fitting was never removed...i think it's got weak loctite on it from the video I saw. I did put 3cc of oil in the top as the spec says so maybe that will loosen it up by today. I'm not even sure I can get the o-rings with the scarcity in parts these days, lol, so I'll inspect the o-rings and re-use if they are smooth. It's pretty much a brand new fork and should not be having these issues. I'll post later today. Thanks.

gocat

· #6 · Nov 28, 2021

Sound like a warranty issue

11053

· #7 · Nov 28, 2021

Couple of things-
Yes, the set screw on the rebound knob is very easy to strip out. Simplest fix is a new knob depending on how much your time is worth to you. Otherwise, you can try to clean up the threads, chase, retap, use an oversize set screw, loctite etc.
It's a common thing for those caps, but once you know how easy it is to strip, you won't make the mistake again.
I've had Lyrik air springs suck down as you describe.
Did you add air to the spring before trying to install the lower legs? If the air spring seals are in good shape, pumping up the spring a bit will allow you to install the lowers and reach the shaft for the foot nut.
If you have the fork back together and it is sucking down while riding or showing reduced travel, then it is best to service the spring and lube the seals and likely replace seals.
It's really easy to remove the c-clip and pull the air shaft. Rock Shox c-clips are directional-there is a top side and a bottom side, so pay attention to that on install/removal.
Sometimes just pulling and lubing the air shaft will fix things and you may noit need to replace seals for another service interval or so.
That fork will ride best if you adhere to the 50hr intervals for lower legs and air shaft service.

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wschruba

· #8 · Nov 28, 2021

Sounds like air was let out of the positive chamber too fast when you purged air to service the lowers. Reinflate the spring until it extends completely, then slowly let air out. When the piston head hits the transfer port, it will purge the negative chamber, too.

There's still air in it, so when you remove the clip on the bottom of the stanchion, you'll need to wrap a rag around it and give a firm tug on the air shaft to separate it.

Likewise, when reinstalling the spring after greasing, inflate it enough to hold it extended all the way while you are installing the uppers/lowers.

Reactions: 3

sdcoffeeroaster

Discussion Starter · #9 · Nov 28, 2021

11053 said:
Couple of things-
Yes, the set screw on the rebound knob is very easy to strip out. Simplest fix is a new knob depending on how much your time is worth to you. Otherwise, you can try to clean up the threads, chase, retap, use an oversize set screw, loctite etc.
It's a common thing for those caps, but once you know how easy it is to strip, you won't make the mistake again.
I've had Lyrik air springs suck down as you describe.
Did you add air to the spring before trying to install the lower legs? If the air spring seals are in good shape, pumping up the spring a bit will allow you to install the lowers and reach the shaft for the foot nut.
If you have the fork back together and it is sucking down while riding or showing reduced travel, then it is best to service the spring and lube the seals and likely replace seals.
It's really easy to remove the c-clip and pull the air shaft. Rock Shox c-clips are directional-there is a top side and a bottom side, so pay attention to that on install/removal.
Sometimes just pulling and lubing the air shaft will fix things and you may noit need to replace seals for another service interval or so.
That fork will ride best if you adhere to the 50hr intervals for lower legs and air shaft service.

I did try chasing the cap with a 0.5x3mm tap. To do that right I would have to grind the bottom of the tap or get a bottoming tap but when I looked for threads with a loupe the tops are completely gone so nothing there to work with. It's a new cap or look around for a 4mm set screw maybe. I doubt I'll find one without doing a bunch of secondary work so that it fits the groove on the Rockshox part. You are right I will not do this again?

I didn't have any issues with reduced travel, etc so once I took the air shaft out, lightly greased with PTFE Rockshox grease and reinstalled it worked smoothly. And yes all flat C-clips have a sharp and rounded side and in this case you want the sharp side facing down. Videos often neglect to tell people that, lol.

When I put the 0-15w oil in the first time I think a lot of it went into the damper shaft on one side. I used a tubing extension on the syringe to avoid that. I seem to have a slight leak out of the damper bolt thru hole now. I'm hoping it's just excess oil there from the first time. I'm leaving the knob off for now and will get a rubber cap until I can either fix mine or find a new one. I have a bunch of 8mm crush washers from my Fox forks but they seem to be thicker than the one on the air shaft side and much different from the one on the damper side (see pic).

This has been a huge strange learning curve for me. The lowers didn't even want to go back on easily. I had a tough time getting seals to start unlike my Fox 34's. I'll probably take the springs off next time, maybe that will help.

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sdcoffeeroaster

Discussion Starter · #10 · Nov 28, 2021

wschruba said:
Sounds like air was let out of the positive chamber too fast when you purged air to service the lowers. Reinflate the spring until it extends completely, then slowly let air out. When the piston head hits the transfer port, it will purge the negative chamber, too.

There's still air in it, so when you remove the clip on the bottom of the stanchion, you'll need to wrap a rag around it and give a firm tug on the air shaft to separate it.

Likewise, when reinstalling the spring after greasing, inflate it enough to hold it extended all the way while you are installing the uppers/lowers.

I didn't know letting the air out too fast was a thing with Rockshox forks but I will pay attention to that next time. Yes I could have used air instead of my wood dowl to force the air shaft to extend...next time. Thanks

sdcoffeeroaster

Discussion Starter · #11 · Nov 28, 2021

I was going to try a 3mm helicoil but I only found ones that are 2d long...way too long. There are only about 3 threads in this knob. Maybe JB weld although a 3mm hole is going to be very difficult to work on. Don't need it to withstand much torque and I have repaired other plastic bosses this way. I can't find anyone that has a 11.4018.82.004 knob. You would think rockshox could standardize on only a couple of knob styles instead of 20+ lol.

Blkdoutindustries

· #12 · Nov 28, 2021

sdcoffeeroaster said:
I didn't know letting the air out too fast was a thing with Rockshox forks but I will pay attention to that next time. Yes I could have used air instead of my wood dowl to force the air shaft to extend...next time. Thanks

It's not just Rockshox, any fork with a self equalizing negative chamber air needs to be let out incrementally so you can equalize both chambers. What I do is let some air out until you feel fork compressing then I extend it until back to normal length and repeat until air is out.

sdcoffeeroaster

Discussion Starter · #13 · Nov 28, 2021

Blkdoutindustries said:
It's not just Rockshox, any fork with a self equalizing negative chamber air needs to be let out incrementally so you can equalize both chambers. What I do is let some air out until you feel fork compressing then I extend it until back to normal length and repeat until air is out.

This 2021 version is not supposed to have to be equalized. And I've never had to do it on pressurizing. It's one of the "improvements" of the 2021. But I will try it on deflating next time anyway, thanks.

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sdcoffeeroaster

Discussion Starter · #14 · Nov 28, 2021

Wife says I've been watching too many bush fixes on Gold Rush (if you know what that show is). OK I've come up with a fix. Helicoils are too long and using epoxy to build up threads iffy. So I just drilled and taped a new hole using all the wrong tools for the right reason, lol. Wood bit for a counter bore. The dremel to clean up the counterbore...has to be deep enough for the screw to reach the groove and retain the knob. Had to add another half thread to the screw to reach. I could have build up the screw boss on the inside with jb weld to get another thread or two like they did in the std hole but I have 3 threads and I'm surprised how tight it is without feeling like it's going to strip out. The old one just disappeared right away with very little torque applied lol. I hope this stays on for now.

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socalrider77

· #15 · Nov 28, 2021

I’ve had the suck down issue, just reinflate the air spring until the threads get close enough to put the bolt in

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Blkdoutindustries

· #16 · Nov 28, 2021

sdcoffeeroaster said:
This 2021 version is not supposed to have to be equalized. And I've never had to do it on pressurizing. It's one of the "improvements" of the 2021. But I will try it on deflating next time anyway, thanks.

The stanchion has a dimple so air can go from positive chamber to negative chamber, that's why when you put air you are supposed to cycle the fork a couple time, it's the same for releasing air

gocat

· #17 · Nov 29, 2021

11053 said:
Couple of things-
Yes, the set screw on the rebound knob is very easy to strip out. Simplest fix is a new knob depending on how much your time is worth to you. Otherwise, you can try to clean up the threads, chase, retap, use an oversize set screw, loctite etc.
It's a common thing for those caps, but once you know how easy it is to strip, you won't make the mistake again.
I've had Lyrik air springs suck down as you describe.
Did you add air to the spring before trying to install the lower legs? If the air spring seals are in good shape, pumping up the spring a bit will allow you to install the lowers and reach the shaft for the foot nut.
If you have the fork back together and it is sucking down while riding or showing reduced travel, then it is best to service the spring and lube the seals and likely replace seals.
It's really easy to remove the c-clip and pull the air shaft. Rock Shox c-clips are directional-there is a top side and a bottom side, so pay attention to that on install/removal.
Sometimes just pulling and lubing the air shaft will fix things and you may noit need to replace seals for another service interval or so.
That fork will ride best if you adhere to the 50hr intervals for lower legs and air shaft service.

I dont add air. If you have the air shaft full extended when installing. After installing the air spring, wiggle it and push it down to see if air will get trapped in the neg side. If it pop up again, then It should be all good to install lower leg. My buddy had an air spring get sucked up on a ride. We reseat the air spring and lubed it. It got sucked in again on the next ride.

gocat

· #18 · Nov 29, 2021

sdcoffeeroaster said:
Wife says I've been watching too many bush fixes on Gold Rush (if you know what that show is). OK I've come up with a fix. Helicoils are too long and using epoxy to build up threads iffy. So I just drilled and taped a new hole using all the wrong tools for the right reason, lol. Wood bit for a counter bore. The dremel to clean up the counterbore...has to be deep enough for the screw to reach the groove and retain the knob. Had to add another half thread to the screw to reach. I could have build up the screw boss on the inside with jb weld to get another thread or two like they did in the std hole but I have 3 threads and I'm surprised how tight it is without feeling like it's going to strip out. The old one just disappeared right away with very little torque applied lol. I hope this stays on for now.
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I guess, If need be you can purchase those parts separately

dysfunction

· #19 · Nov 29, 2021

gocat said:
I guess, If need be you can purchase those parts separately

If you can find one. On the plus side, you don't need them to ride

sdcoffeeroaster

Discussion Starter · #20 · Nov 29, 2021 (Edited)

dysfunction said:
If you can find one. On the plus side, you don't need them to ride

Yes that's what I figured out. I was going to just put a small rubber cap on the end instead but it now seems to work just fine and isn't coming off. Can't find this knob anywhere now anyway. I have to figure out the the crush washer situation and if the air side is the same as fox. They are both 8mm but the fox (uncrushed) seems a lot thick even considering the crush. All I saw on the damper side was what looked like a very large black flat washer like the previous pic I posted. This illustration shows two washers on the damper side but in my assembly they were reversed so I could not see the smaller crush washer under the larger black washer/spacer. Do the Fox 8mm crush washer work OK (have a bunch of them)?

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