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www.derbyrims.com
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I’ve got an ’05 Nixon Elite with TPC. I like the fork, but I can imagine that TPC+ would give it the final butter over smaller rubble and better match the liquid feel of the early type Vanilla-R in back.

I called Manitou and they said I needed a full cartridge assembly, plus knob kit, and gave me a part number list for the 06 Nixon TPC+. About $100 or more for all parts.

But can’t I just swap out the upper TPC compression piston with the TPC+ piston group and fit them to the stock knob?

Are there older 32mm forks with TPC+ perhaps shorter travel I could buy used to get the parts to fit the Nixon?
 

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%$#$*!
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The 03 Firefly 130mm has TPC+. I used to switch it back and forth between my 150mm flick+ . I'm not sure if it will fit in a nixon, but they're both 32mm stanchions so I don't see why they wouldn't.

I just got a new fork and the firefly is just sitting around. PM me if you're interested.
 

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www.derbyrims.com
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
beefmagic said:
The 03 Firefly 130mm has TPC+. I used to switch it back and forth between my 150mm flick+ . I'm not sure if it will fit in a nixon, but they're both 32mm stanchions so I don't see why they wouldn't.

I just got a new fork and the firefly is just sitting around. PM me if you're interested.
I may be interested in your fork. I'll call Manitou to verify the right side knobs fit across the forks.

The stock over damped rebound works fine now that I've lowered the damper oil weight from the stock weight down to 7.5 wt. $100 for the full cartridge kit isn't a lot of money, but then again it is.
 

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noMAD man
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Derby, oddly you might find the opposite between those two dampers. Many riders find the TPC+ to be harsher than the TPC in the Nixon/Sherman platforms. The TPC has softer mid-stroke, the TPC+ a much firmer support. For really aggressive riders who "ride heavy" on their front forks or do drops and such, they usually appreciate the TPC+ cart more. Riders who are smoother and are mainly trail riders...even decently aggressive...often find the TPC to work better. The (+) in this case doesn't necessarily mean better in all cases in this instance IMO. I've had both carts in the Flick and Firefly. I preferred the Flick's TPC damping over the '03 Firefly TPC+ damping. Another guy at the shop eventually bought both of these forks from me and came to the same conclusion. He's a more aggressive rider than I am, so I was concerned he might short change himself with the TPC. However, apparently his smoothness and ability to pick lines causes him to prefer the TPC's smoother and softer damping. This is a very preferential area, so you're gonna get different opinions, but your comment here about "butter" and small bump compliance caused me to recall the difference between these two damping platforms. Both are excellent...just a bit different.
 

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My experience is not far from what TNC is saying. When putting the TPC+ into the flick150mm there was a qualitative difference in feel. The travel felt more controlled and able to take bigger hits and it seemed more stable in the fast chop.

When the TPC was in the firefly130mm the change in carts felt more noticeable to me. It seemed more easily overwhelmed by drops and fast, tech chop.

The amount of travel may have something to do with this. The change in carts seemed to make more of a difference to me in the 5" mode more than the 6". The change is subtle but noticeable to me. As far as TPC vs. TPC+, I'm not sure if this is psychological on my part because (as TNC pointed to), sometimes the + can lead one's opinions.

In any case, the difference in feel was more present at high speeds and drops. At slow speeds it felt very close. Ultimately, for my style of riding I preferred the TPC+. FWIW, I ride AM/light FR with 5' drops. I'm not supersmooth but I'm not a basher either. I like to pick my lines.:)
 

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anybody got a pic of the two systems side by side...i've got TPC and have always been curious what i may be missing
 

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I've got the same 05 Nixon and recently upgraded to the new cartridge TPC+. This is a complete screw in assembly which drops in from the top. No longer is the stanchion wall used to contain the damper fluid.

The compression stroke is excellent. Smooth and controlled. Smoother over the little stuff when compared to the TPC valved for the same bottomout resistance.

But the rebound stroke in mine needs revalved before I"ll be happy with it. I've been saying this for months and still haven't got around to it.
I used to run the 05 TPC rebound full open, I'm running this one full closed and it's still faster.

Just check the length of any TPC+ assembly you screw in. Dropping a ruler down into the oil and measuring from the top will tell you if there'll be any contact.
 

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noMAD man
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Dougal, just for clarification, I notice you said, "smoother over the little stuff when compared to the TPC valved for the same bottomout resistance". That sounds to me like you're speaking of a TPC cart that you modified for bottomout resistance...which of course I wouldn't be surprised to hear...LOL. If it's a modified TPC cart you're referring to for comparison to a standard TPC+ cart, then I think you need to make that clear, because most people are not going to tear into their cartridges for shim mods. But maybe I'm reading more into it than what you intended.

I still contend that TPC carts, at least in the Nixon/Sherman platforms, may actually provide better overall trail damping than TPC+ for many riders...remembering that preference comes into play here.
 

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I dig trails!
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I just went from a Nixon TPC to TPC+.

So far the TPC+ does as advertised (postition sensitive, undamped initial stroke) and eliminates the trail chatter, but TPC did a pretty good job of that too. Both are nice a plush for decents with the edge to the TPC+, IMHO.

The downside to that is there is now a bit more pedal bob with TPC+. While my previous TPC fork I could set to near SPV levels for the climbs then open the compression up for the downs. This statement is only for standing climbing.

There is also a bit more brake dive with the TPC+. Not deep dive, just the initial stroke.

Derby, you are on a DW-link (which my TPC unit was on) and you might consider staying with TPC as it is probably a better match to the DW-link's pedaling characteristics.

Mr. P
 

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www.derbyrims.com
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I called Manitou this morning. It turns out that the ’03 and ’04 Flick TPC+ fits the ’05 Nixon without the internal sleeve that the ’06 Nixon uses.

So I found an ’04 Flick TPC+ assembly on line for $26, that I can return if needed.

Thanks everyone. I’ll follow up on this thread after installing and riding it.
 

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Stray Bullet
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derby said:
I called Manitou this morning. It turns out that the '03 and '04 Flick TPC+ fits the '05 Nixon without the internal sleeve that the '06 Nixon uses.

So I found an '04 Flick TPC+ assembly on line for $26, that I can return if needed.

Thanks everyone. I'll follow up on this thread after installing and riding it.
Where did you fint the TPC+ assembly? Will it work with the wind down models?
 

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Singletrack Addict!!!
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Please share, TPC+ where? I ordered a 05 Super with IT 20mm ($229) :cornut: , could not pass it up, should be receiving it later this week. If you could post pics of the operation, it would be great! :thumbsup:
 

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www.derbyrims.com
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Here's an '04 Sherman Flick schematic link from the Manitou Tech Support service manuals lookup (http://www.answerproducts.com/serviceguides.asp). It's a pdf file. It shows the TPC+ assembly, part "A", and the part number to order from your favorite Manitou dealer.

'04 Sherman Flick schematic:
http://www.answerproducts.com/guides/Forks/2004/SHERMANFLICK.pdf?cvar1=1/22/2007+6:41:42+PM

I'm pretty sure it will fit any '05 Nixon and I can use the knob off my stock TPC compression assembly or I'll buy a knob later if it's different.

I paid $26.10 plus shipping from a major on-line Manitou dealer. It was in stock inventory from a canceled order, so maybe that's cost price rather than retail. But you can order from you LBS Manitou dealer and save shipping cost.

I'll post up later on this thread if it works out OK in a week or so.
 

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TNC said:
Dougal, just for clarification, I notice you said, "smoother over the little stuff when compared to the TPC valved for the same bottomout resistance". That sounds to me like you're speaking of a TPC cart that you modified for bottomout resistance...which of course I wouldn't be surprised to hear...LOL. If it's a modified TPC cart you're referring to for comparison to a standard TPC+ cart, then I think you need to make that clear, because most people are not going to tear into their cartridges for shim mods. But maybe I'm reading more into it than what you intended.

I still contend that TPC carts, at least in the Nixon/Sherman platforms, may actually provide better overall trail damping than TPC+ for many riders...remembering that preference comes into play here.
You're right, I should have clarified that.
When I got my nixon the fork had great bottomout resistance but was a little choppy on the small stuff.
In comparison the TPC+ handles the big stuff the same, but is more compliant over the small stuff.

I had softened up the compression on my TPC damper, so in comparison with that, the TPC+ wasn't much different over the little stuff, but has better bottomout resistance.

I say when you get up in tyre size, the extra squishiness of the tyre masks the better small bump absorbtion of the TPC+ over normal TPC. Making it less of an issue than having smaller and harder tyre on the front.

I think very few riders in a blind test could tell the difference between TPC and TPC+.
 

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Dougal said:
I say when you get up in tyre size, the extra squishiness of the tyre masks the better small bump absorbtion of the TPC+ over normal TPC. Making it less of an issue than having smaller and harder tyre on the front.
this is so true...i've always aired up to 40ish pounds..within the last year played around with air pressure...running lower pressure in the front can really make a difference over small chop, making a great deal of it disappear at the handlebar...and having little to do with the fork
 

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I am just wondering I have a 05 nixion plat. With IT and Want to replace the SPV with TPC or TPC+ What online dealer did you use. I need the top and rod parts.
 

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www.derbyrims.com
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
SLX said:
I am just wondering I have a 05 nixion plat. With IT and Want to replace the SPV with TPC or TPC+ What online dealer did you use. I need the top and rod parts.
JensonUSA.com

It was a canceled special order, so they only had one in stock. I didn't want to say earlier until it was shipped for fear of my order getting hijacked! ;)

It's scheduled for delivery today (hopefully before my afterwork ride!)
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
derby said:
Here's an '04 Sherman Flick schematic link from the Manitou Tech Support service manuals lookup (http://www.answerproducts.com/serviceguides.asp). It's a pdf file. It shows the TPC+ assembly, part "A", and the part number to order from your favorite Manitou dealer.

'04 Sherman Flick schematic:
QUOTE]
Update: The part arived today, and it was the wrong part - TPC not TPC+.

Both the '04 Sherman and '05 Nixon on line manuals shows 85-5897 for TPC+. Also the '04 Sheman Flick scematic which clearly shows a TPC+ assembly in the picture with this part number is wrong.

I'll have to call Manitou next week and get the right part number. At least I can return this one.

Thanks Answer/Manitou NOT!
 

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derby said:
derby said:
Here's an '04 Sherman Flick schematic link from the Manitou Tech Support service manuals lookup (http://www.answerproducts.com/serviceguides.asp). It's a pdf file. It shows the TPC+ assembly, part "A", and the part number to order from your favorite Manitou dealer.

'04 Sherman Flick schematic:
QUOTE]
Update: The part arived today, and it was the wrong part - TPC not TPC+.

Both the '04 Sherman and '05 Nixon on line manuals shows 85-5897 for TPC+. Also the '04 Sheman Flick scematic which clearly shows a TPC+ assembly in the picture with this part number is wrong.

I'll have to call Manitou next week and get the right part number. At least I can return this one.

Thanks Answer/Manitou NOT!
So much for your special order. Let us know how everything turns out.
 

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www.derbyrims.com
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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Major props to Manitou Customer Service

derby said:
I've got an '05 Nixon Elite with TPC. I like the fork, but I can imagine that TPC+ would give it the final butter over smaller rubble and better match the liquid feel of the early type Vanilla-R in back.

I called Manitou and they said I needed a full cartridge assembly, plus knob kit, and gave me a part number list for the 06 Nixon TPC+. About $100 or more for all parts.

But can't I just swap out the upper TPC compression piston with the TPC+ piston group and fit them to the stock knob?

Are there older 32mm forks with TPC+ perhaps shorter travel I could buy used to get the parts to fit the Nixon?
The manager of Manitou customer service (he probably doesn't want his name splashed here) authorized a swap out of the '06 damper cartridge assembly plus knob kit. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Background: Based on the on-line service manual I purchased a "TPC+" by part number for the '04 Sherman. But the part number was specified incorrectly in the manual and I received the same TPC compression assembly I already have in my '05 Nixon.

The '04 - '05 FireFly and Sherman do use a TPC+ assembly which I thought I was buying, which fit's the '05 Nixon, but Manitou doesn't have them in stock anymore. So they sent me the much more expensive '06 cartrige assembly.

I'll be installing the cartridge soon. It will probably have to break in for a few weeks before I can really tell if there is the hoped for improvement in small bump performance and bottom resistance.

It appears that the cartridge will open up the lower chambers on both sides now to effectively make the splash bath able to adjust bottom out resistance with splash bath oil volume. But it may require so much more oil and difficulty changing it that it may not be easy to find an optimum oil volume for the '06 Nixon.

I see that the '07 Nixon Elite (130 - 160 wind-down) is open bath. I'm curious what has changed inside. The '07 Elite may be my next fork since I'd like a little taller fork sometimes than my '05/'06 (115 - 145 wind-down) on my low BB, 5.5 inch travel Mojo Carbon, for better pedal clearance in bigger rock obstacles, and slower handling for granite sandy conditions, and better confidence launching unknown downhill air drops.
 
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