Weaknesses: When you adjust travel to 80, the compression gets tighter. In other words the compressionis not consistant between the 80 and 100 settings. I use the 100 setting on my hartail at all times, it the fork has been great to me.
Bottom Line:
Never had any issues with the fork- ever. Great fork for the price. Would take it anyday.
Submitted by
Anthony
a Cross Country Rider
from exeter
Date Reviewed: November 4, 2004
Strengths: the travel adjustment and the rebound
Weaknesses: looks... it looks like mine is at 50 mm of travel but it is at 100mm i took it to the shop and said it is at 100mm I wish i bought the sherman
Bottom Line:
very nice fork but not as responsive as i would like it to be. the manual said that it will loosen up in about 8 hours of good riding.
Submitted by
Alastair White
a Weekend Warrior
from New York, NY, USA
Date Reviewed: September 25, 2003
Strengths: Great Damping, Looks, Reasonably stuff - not plush, but smooth.
Weaknesses: 2 Consecutive forks failed - Tortional twisting in both cases reulting in a mildy skewed wheel - Manitou gladly fixes with no charge (except 1 way shipping) - but I am no longer confident in a fork that failed in an identical way (Skewed in exactly the same way, degree, and to the same side) Manitou wanted to charge me 250 (US) to 'upgrade' to a Sherman - Maybe I am unreasonable - but the upgrade isnt by choice (is due to a failed fork) and the difference in retail price is 100-150. I consider this unacceptable and not standing behind a product! I see Shermans on EBay for sub 3 new, so......... You make your own decision!
Bottom Line:
Had a good experience with the fork minus the skewing (twice ina year - yes I am 225 - no I didn't crash it broke - yes I have mad skills - no Nose dives...)
I am VERY unhappy with my warranty experience, and would NOT recommend black forks to heavy riders - and would even go so far as to recommend dealing carefully with a company like this!
Bike Setup: 03 SC Chameleon, XT/Mammoth, RF Prodigy DH-Bash, Azonic WF Bars, RF Diabolus, Lock Ons, XTR Brakes and shifters/derailleurs. Thomson post
Overall Rating:
Value Rating:
Submitted by
ryan
a Cross Country Rider
from raleigh, NC, USA
Date Reviewed: September 9, 2003
Strengths: Has held up well
Weaknesses: Had to purchase upgrade springs for my fat ass.
Bottom Line:
After reading all the whining about the fork I have to agree with those that love it. It was one of the reasons I bought the 02 Fuel over the 2003. I weigh 235lbs and don't do big drops. I do ride the hell out of my bike and this fork hasn't failed. No noise, No roughness, No breakage, No faults of any kind. Sure the stickers fall off. Manitou will send you more. Who cares- just more battle scars. I did have to purchase the super-sized springs and yeah you lose the preload adjustment- but think about it- if you weigh enough to warrant the big spring than the preload is going to be ineffective anyway. Feel free to ax me any questions- I'll be out riding.
Strengths: Steering precision, easily adjustable travel, easy to service, reliability, good damping
Weaknesses: Spring kits are too soft (you have to go for the next one up),
Bottom Line:
I bought these 3 months ago from chain reaction for £230/$360, down from £349/$545 because they're last years model. For the money they're great, very stiff 30mm stantions, good damping and very reliable. The spring kits are too soft if you follow the recommended weights and the firm/extra firm kits are expensive @ £30/$50, when with fox they come with the fork. Best in 100mm as they're more sensitive and can take bigger hits. Any weaknesses aren't an issue at the price i paid for them.
Similar Products Used: Manitou Axel Elite, Marzocch Z2
Bike Setup: Voodoo Hoodoo, XT, Easton, HS33
Overall Rating:
Value Rating:
Submitted by
Jensen
a Weekend Warrior
from Vancouver, Canada
Date Reviewed: June 13, 2003
Strengths: Really smooth rebound on bigger hits Adjustability allows tuning for rider and conditions
Weaknesses: Unresponsive to smaller bumps and chatter Not enough range for the damping controls
Bottom Line:
Do yourself a favour and upgrade to the spring kit for the weight class one heavier than your actual weight as this will give the fork enough strength for you and all your extra gear.
Even though this is my first suspension fork, I know something about suspensions as I design recumbent trikes with independent suspension. Suspensions should almost allow you to ride your tires at a higher than normal pressure for any given situation. A rising rate is better than constant spring rate and it's unfortunate that this fork doesn't have coils with it.
This fork is indicative of the trend towards free-riding in that it really only activates on fast moving big hits. Do a drop-off of about 6 inches at cruising speeds and it will almost completely damp the rebound. If you do the same drop off at slow, trials-like velocities, the fork will compress almost to it limit before rebounding, a sure sign that the compression damper hasn't even activated, and this at just about any setting. It forces the tires to accomodate most of the small gravel sized rocks, which only increases the amount of un-sprung weight for the chattery stuff, like a "semi-rigid" fork. This is not a fork that should have been spec'ed for general purpose trail riding which the Sugar 3+ seems to be pointed at.
I think the way to improve this fork (and many others I've test ridden) is to increase the un-weighted ride height so that when you mount the bike, the fork actually compresses a couple of inches to the start of the travel proper. This should give it some decent spring rate for the small chatter.
I'd also like to see the compression damper be lockable so that for the road ride up to the trail, you won't get too much pogo.
The plastic pre-load adjuster should have been made strong enough to deal with the heaviest upgrade springs. Getting the stronger coils and giving up the fine-tuning is not what I'd call an ideal upgrade.
Finally, I don't think one should have to get an air shock just to get a rising spring rate. The various coil choices available should have included a rising rate option.
Similar Products Used: My first suspension fork. Tested others while bike shopping
Bike Setup: Stock 2002 Fisher Sugar 3+ GS Firm ride spring kit
Overall Rating:
Value Rating:
Submitted by
Corbin
a Cross Country Rider
from Littleton, Colorado, U.S.A.
Date Reviewed: May 29, 2003
Strengths: Extremely smooth motion. Perfect for the lighter rider like myself.
Weaknesses: None so far.
Bottom Line:
This is a quality fork made by a quality company. The travel is very smooth. I would have to say this is the smoothest fork I have ridden. The microlube ports on it are also a great thing. They keep the fork easily lubed and smooth. When the ports are filled, they dispence the grease themselves, keeping the fork lubed and smooth all the time. I would suggest not to buy this fork if you are a heavy set rider, though.
Submitted by
C P
a Cross Country Rider
from Los Angeles
Date Reviewed: May 3, 2003
Strengths: Stiffness, Resilience, reliability
Weaknesses: Plastice knobs, poor placement of travel adjuster knob on dropouts(should have been on top of fork like 2003 model to begin with)
Bottom Line:
This fork is way overpriced. Any Marzoochi at this price is superior. Also, the Fox Vanilla blows this fork away. The rebound adjuster offers a poor range of adjustability. The reality is, all suspension forks need only to be adjusted for the riders weight and riding style. If properly sprung, the 80 mm setting is really just a semi-lockout. This fork is not a real adjustable travel rig. All this being said, the fork works fine, once dialed in. It is very stiff and strong, it just doesn't live up to its price tag. Plastic parts need to be on cheap forks. If Answer lowered the price, this fork would get all the chili's. The Black series should be completely redesigned. Manitou is on the right track with the Sherman series. They should get their act together and build all their forks that way. I have a feeling that in the next couple of years they will be right up their with Marzoochi and Fox, the only true suspension fork manufacturers.
Submitted by
Matt
a Weekend Warrior
from Birmingham, Alabama
Date Reviewed: April 23, 2003
Strengths: I got this fork on a 2002 Gary Fisher Big Sur. After putting some lube on the dry seals it worked into its travel effortlessly. It is by far the smoothest fork I've ever ridden.
Weaknesses: The adjustments don't seem to do very much. the preload is the most effective, and the 80mm setting isn't the greatest considering it just compresses the fork and doesn't allow the same feel just at a lesser travel setting.
Bottom Line:
Bottom line, this is a great fork, mainly because I got it on a complete bike way below what it is supposed to cost. It is an extrememly smooth fork and I haven't had a single problem since i bought it, and i've been doing a fair amount of medium jumps around here.
Bike Setup: Stock '02 Big Sur, Profile Design bar ends, LX brakes front/rear.
Overall Rating:
Value Rating:
Submitted by
J Bruck
a Cross Country Rider
from Rncho Snta Margarita
Date Reviewed: March 25, 2003
Strengths: Relatively stiff, smooth travel
Weaknesses: No preload adjustability if you use any stiffer spring than the stock spring. If you put a stiffer spring in, you have to replace the preload adjuster with a solid aluminum cap with no adjustment. Plastic 80/100m travel knob is cheap and prone to breakage. Stickers come off easily (which really doesn't matter but I thought I would throw that in there anyway)
Bottom Line:
I have been a die hard Manitou fan until I purchased this fork. When I found that the stock springs were too soft for me, (I don't care what others say ... the stock springs are way too soft..) I went out and paid $40.00 bucks for stiffer springs only to find out that when you put stiffers springs in, you have to replace the preload adjuster with a solid aluminum cap with no adjustability... A $350.00(list price) fork with no preload ? Don't $45.00 cheapo forks have this? I called Manitou and told them I was upset about this and they got pissy and stated "why don't you buy a marzocchi". Obviously they had recieved this comment from many others and were a bit sensative about the subject. The fork does hold together well (no play or slop after 8 months of use). I have been riding the fork for over 8 months (3 to 5 days a week) and the fork has held together well, but I finally got fed up with not having a preload adjuster and went out and bought a marzocchi atom 100 which is a far superior product.
Similar Products Used: Manitou SXR (1999,2000,2001) marzocchi atom 100
Bike Setup: Schwinn homegrown full suspension with full XT.
Overall Rating:
Value Rating:
Submitted by
Draco
a Cross Country Rider
from Toronto, Canada
Date Reviewed: March 13, 2003
Strengths: Good Fork. reasonable adjustability. No probs to date.
Bottom Line:
Good fork. Quit your complaining. I am 170 pounds and ride 10-15 hours a week. Some of which is free ride big drop stuff. I am riding stock springs and have had no problems bottoming the fork out to date. A fork is designed to bottom out when going over big hits so that is more supple over the small stuff. Note to all of you who are downhilling with this cat on the front it is a XC fork.
Submitted by
david camp
a Downhiller
from littleton co usa
Date Reviewed: February 27, 2003
Strengths: dampening works well i think, kinda light, looks cool pretty stiff
Weaknesses: the travel adjuster broke, the dampener adjusters don't do much(but theyre good where they are)and my crown/stanchion tubes are separating and they wont warranty it because its not that kind of fork(dirtjumper)then why in the hell is everyone who is sponsored by manitou using one for slalom? this crap pisses me off oh yeah mine makes the loudest creaking noise because of this crap.
Bottom Line:
good "aggressive XC" fork, i guess the ads lie though. it cant hold up to jumping at all.
Just a quick add on to a previous review- I added a lockout instead of a compression knob mostly because the compression knob didn't do anything but also because the climbs around here are longer roads. This is defintely the way to go although it sounds like others have added new seals which makes the compression more touchy.
Dial in the preload to make this fork work right and don't review anything if you don't own it.
Weaknesses: bottoms out off a three foot drop, reverse arch,
Bottom Line:
this is a good xc fork. when I rode his bike I bottomed out off a three foot drop(even with the compresion adj. set to hard). my forks would'nt have bottomed out. I think it's because I run a higher pressure than that of his spring.and whats up with the 2.35 tire arch, that's so weak. I run a 2.65 tire on my 4" fork. if you ride xc only there o.k. if you freeride you will need harder springs or consider a 5" fork
Ok, I have decided to replace the Skareb 80mm fork on my '03 NRS (large) with a 100mm fork. I am debating between these 2 forks. It looks like I can get the Manitou Black Elite ( Read More »
Hey all,
I've been reading through the archives of messages and have gotten the bug to upgrade my 2002 NRS 1. It's essentially stock (riser bars, egg beaters, vertical pro's) an Read More »
Intended use strictly XC to be built up on NRS frame...Will be running the fork at 100mm (optional 80mm setting on Black doesn't matter) Price limit $225. Both supposedly weigh ar Read More »
I just bought a set of Manitou Black Elite 80/100 2003 on ebay. Normally I dont buy used but the guy said they were barely ridden. So I just got them in today, from the looks of th Read More »
