Weaknesses: Not as light as claimed, screws can come loose, expensive for such a simple fork, not 70mm.
Bottom Line:
I've had this fork since 99. I would have to say this is the best light weight, cross country fork made in years. I had it so long because I simply could not find a better fork! It was raced, ridden recreationally, crashed, ridden in the rain, ridden in the snow, and it always performend perfectly. This fork is stiff! A SID is a wet noodle compared to this fork. Even as old as it is, it's still stiffer than any current fork I've tested (maybe not Fox, haven't tried them yet). But don't let stiffness confuse you. It's still a smooth fork. Total air really works great. The fork has some flaws. It's not as light as White would have you believe. Still 3lbs. is pretty darn light. Also, it surely does not have 70mm of travel. More like 65mm. However, all commapies tout their stuff a little better than they really are. And I must give props to White Brothers, they did put out one heck of a fork. So why review this if they don't make it anymore. Well, if you find one on ebay then you know it's still good. Maybe better than that SID you've been looking at. And cheaper to boot.
Submitted by
Tom
a Weekend Warrior
from Jackson, Wyoming
Date Reviewed: October 31, 2000
Strengths: Zero leaks, super smooth, low maint., sleak look...
Weaknesses: Haven't found any...
Bottom Line:
Been ridding mine for 3 seasons now, still no air leaks (anyone who complains about loosing air through the valve needs to pay attention to what the heck they are doing - ie - make sure the valve is threaded all the way in before you attach the pump?). Ride it much harder than an "XC" fork is ever designed to be ridden - laterally stiff, even under extreme braking, hard corrnering, etc., yet nice controlled compression and rebound. No boots + muddy conditions, and still no crap on the internals the 2 times I have taken her apart (end of the 98 and 99 season - just to look/lube - not because I needed to). I don't know, wouldn't normally wast my time typing this yet have tried a SID and a Mars over the last 2 years on my other bike, and they don't compare (don't hold air, don't "feel" as good - this feels more like an spring/oil fork, and are way to flexy). Looking for a sub 3 lb. fork that has the ride quality of a 4 lb one...this is it - still don't think there is a better XC fork out there - even in the 2001 stuff...Awesome job White Bros!
Weaknesses: Stiction No boots? Leaky air catridges White Brother's Service
Bottom Line:
This is a decent race fork! It may be the stiffest race fork on the market, and it is well built. However, I sent the fork to White Brothers to have the fork steerer replaced due to a recall. I hand delivered fork in mid July and did not get it back until late August. I entered the White Bros. store in Yorba Linda, Ca. and heard two goofballs fighting over something. The guy who helped me proceeded to tell me how some guy had just tried to screw him by bringing a broken fork to him. He referred to him as a goofball. These guys suck. They also charted me for shipping and handling along with almost $70 to replace the bushings and put in that goofy oil bath system. It was unbelievable! Decent fork, but White Bros. is such a goofy company I will never buy another one of their forks.
Similar Products Used: All of 'em: SID, Superfly, and Carbon Manitou.
Bike Setup: Steel HT
Overall Rating:
Submitted by
Mike the bike guy...
a Cross-Country Rider
from Leesburg VA
Date Reviewed: November 2, 1999
Strengths: Do looks count? I'll give them that one...
Weaknesses: poor tech customer service dept, crappy seals, no boots, bolts come undone, over priced
Bottom Line:
We most have the bad luck. Our whole team has had problems with this fork... (four of them). They all developed stiction within a few months. Two of them have had the air cartridge blow. Three of them have had misc bolts come undone durng a ride (inside and out). On one fork, the fork leg's coating came off during one race which was sorta muddy. We find the weight to be heavier than listed in the WB ads. The service and tech people are rude. Frankly, if you think about it, there's not much material in a mountain bike fork. To fork out (pardon the pun) five bills... we think the fork should be somewhat bomb proof. They're not.
Submitted by
Tim Nielsen
a Racer
from Arlington, VA
Date Reviewed: October 18, 1999
Strengths: Tuneability Weight Customer Service
Weaknesses: Servicability/replacement of bushings Explanation in owners manual of necessary maintenance/ how to / when
Bottom Line:
Well ... Here goes my third post to this review site, and this time I feel my boys at White Brothers need a litlle defending. I have owned this fork for about a year and a half and have a put in 3000 tough offroad miles in all conditions. First, let me say that the fork has not been maintenance free - far from it. Like any precision racing piece of equipment on your bike, this fork needs attention! Drop the lowers every month (see my previos post on how), clean out the wipers, relube the whole mess, and don't forget to put about a couple of ccs of 10wt shock oil on the foam gaskets just under the top seals. These foam gaskets keep a thin coat of lube on the stanchions as they slide thru the seals. If these foam gaskets become really gunked up, you can safely clean them in a Safety Kleen parts washer. Just like the rest of your bike, make sure everything is tightened on a regular basis - believe it or not, bolts can rattle loose on any part of your bike.Like the previous post - I too blew out the seals in the Englund cartridges. BPP, the distributor for the carts, sent me two free replacements in two days! I was very pleased with the level of customer service from White (gave me the right # to call) and BPP (responded quickly and sent me replacements). Only one side was blown, but I sent both sides back, and they sent me two new ones.Another issue with the fork that is not addressed in the owner's manual (see weaknesses) is that the upper and lower teflon bushings not only wear out in a year, but can cause the sliders to gouge (and ruin) the anodizing on the stanchion tubes. Unfortunately, this type of wear is only visible when dropping the sliders (or lowers) off the fork for routine maintenance. The bushings are available from White, but you either need to have them do the work, or buy a $75 toolkit to do it yourself (ouch!). I opted to send the whole thing back. They quickly did the work and returned the fork in a week.Note to current owners: According to Steve (x 238) in the warranty service dept -- YOU WILL NEED TO HAVE THIS WORK DONE SOONER OR LATER. I advise if you have had this fork at least a year to get it done immediately!!! Also, the original silver steerer tubes on the 1998 SC70ULs were recalled -- they will install free of charge a nice black annodized Easton one -- so if you need that done, its probably a good time to get the whole fork serviced (seals, wipers, upper/lower bushings). This should run no more than $50.Final thoughts -- If you thought for $600 you were getting a maintenance free fork -- you're dead wrong. My 13 years in MTB racing has taught me top of the line performance products always need extra TLC (I mean, you spent the cash - take care of the damn thing!). If you want maintenance free -- get a rigid fork. I recommend that the guy who posted the previous review never buy a Porsche or Ferrari -- he'd be much happier with a Honda Accord. Taking care of quality equipment is evidently over his head.Still extremely happy after 18+ months. Five flaming rats.PS - Heres a tip thats pretty obvious to most of us -- The customer service you receive in any situation is a direct result of your attitude. Reasonable requests and calm demeanors are always met with the best results. Enough said.
Similar Products Used: Manitou 1 Manitou Mach 5 Manitou SX TI Manitou TPC RockShox Mag 21
Bike Setup: Turner Stinger
Overall Rating:
Submitted by
Mitch
a Racer
from Boiling Springs, VA
Date Reviewed: September 13, 1999
Strengths: Gold anodizing.
Weaknesses: Company support and consumer relations. Not as light as claimed. Travel not as advertised. Bolts not loctited. Seals blow. Bushings blow. Ride blows. Fork is too tall for short (64mm) travel.
Bottom Line:
It all began with a company that wouldn't allow a shop to order it's items without a lengthy US Mail dealer application process (no faxes nor emails here). Prior to ordering, I called to get the actual weight of the fork with full steerer. The advertised weight was 2.8 pounds, and the dude(the technical department is really a passle of dudes, dude)at White Brothers assured me that, yes, 2.8 pounds is the correct weight. Guess what? 3 pounds 1 ounce on state inspected scales. No big deal, I guess, but when you ante up $600 bills and you call, somehow, someway, the the truth should be out there. So no big wup, but now this fancy fork weighs the same as my Rock Shox RS 1, circa 1992! Soon, I would find out, it worked about as well as that old RS 1, too!First ride: the damn titanium bolts that hold on the brace rattled entirely loose, with one falling to the trail somewhere. I call the dudes to ask whut's up with that? Oops, he said. I'll send you a new ti bolt. But don't worry, they won't 2 day it like Rock Shox excellently does. In fact, they won't even SEND IT, that is til you call dude back and get on his ass about it.In a week, I noticed one of my air units losing too much air. Oh no! I had to call dude back again! No problem, though, dude tells me, 'cause White Brothers doesn't even handle the cartridges they put in their own forks! Dude gives me the number of BPP, so I call one of their dudes (who were helpful, actually). Imagine if you bought a new Ford Taurus, and the wiper motor went on it. Then imagine Ford sending you to the wiper motor manufacturer for a replacement! I DON'T THINK SO.So I strap a zip tie on the leg of this so-called jewel, where it remains for our lives together. I don't care who you are, how hard you hit bottom off the highest jump, but you will never, never, never get 70mm, as advertised, out of this thing. Most I got was 65mm, and I go over 200 pounds. With this White Brothers thing, we still seek the truth.After a month, White Brothers sent me a reinforcement piece to pound into the crown. This was a recall, but do you think they offered to replace or repair the fork? Hell no! Fix it yourself, buddy.And not only is the fork's travel wimpy, it's tall enough to have 80 mm of travel! Height from center of axle to crown is 17.5 which is the same as a Manitou sx-Ti 80. Many bikes, like mine, chopper out, not hurting descents that much, but making steep grunts a wrestling job with the front end. That was certainly the case here. If your fork is going to be THIS tall, put some travel in it.Not much about the fork's ride was sweet, certainly not after 8 months when the bushings and seals went south. We ride nearly mud free, so it wasn't slop and misuse that kills this product so much as poor desigh and shoddy execution.So I call dude about this bushing issue. Dude, we can FIX IT. How long? About 2 weeks, plus of course the week to them and the week back. Less than a year old, and guess what, your fork needs a month's worth of work? Plus the cost, which dude says it about $4 parts, $25 labor, plus shipping there, shipping back. How much did I pay for this thing?There are at least 2 other instances I shall spare you. Had I known the story behind White Brothers, I would have bought a rigid fork. It's a hell of a lot less maintenance, and, does what it's supposed to do far better than the sc70 (64)UL does anything. And one of my favorite things about Rock Shox, besides CREATING the suspension market for bicycles, is their quality, care, and speed of service. These are issues that White Brothers doesn't allow themselves to get too worked up over.
Weaknesses: Performance as compared to a bomber. Odd squeaking noise as well
Bottom Line:
I left my bomber behind thinking that performance was relative and weight was key in reference to racing. But when you think about it, how much time do you spend racing as compared to training or just out enjoying a trail? This fork is so high maintenance that I would just take my road bike out than to go through relubing the assembly time after time. Although this fork has plenty of travel, it can still be really harsh even with low air pressure. I have spent a year trying to convince myself that I love this fork because I paid so much for it. I am not riding offroad as much, partly because I am tired of getting the crap beat out of me. Well I just broke down and bought another atom bomb ( $259 from Colorado cyclist!) and can not wait to get back out on a little heavier, but much more comfortable and enjoyable ride.
Similar Products Used: Just about everything excluding downhill forks
Bike Setup: Lightspeed Unicoi, full xtr, syncros and crossmax.
Overall Rating:
Submitted by
John
a Weekend Warrior
from Orange County
Date Reviewed: September 3, 1999
Strengths: Stiffness Adjustibility Looks Easy to maintain
Weaknesses: Weight for race fork The company Lack of boots Leaky cartridges High maintenance Recall!
Bottom Line:
Decent fork for racing, but for trail riding it sucks. My own fault! I should have just bought a Bomber for the type of riding I do. Less hassle for a 3/4 pound weight penalty. I had warranty problems with the lying bozos are White Brothers (long boring story). Be careful! These guys are really borderline unethical, and will charge the heck of you. Good fork though. Watch out for the bushings wearings, as that will destroy the stanchions. Also, these forks are on recall due to stanchion and crown seperating. I give this fork 3 stars due to noted problems.
This fork is a good race fork; however, for trail riding I would not advice it. Why? First, it takes lots of maintenance due to exposed stanchions (no boots). Plus, stiction is a problem if you don't keep it real well lubed (as with any Englund system). However, that said, I'm impressed by the rigidity of the fork, the workmanship is nice, and the fork is easy to service. White Brothers is not the most professional outfit out there. The 70UL was recalled due to stanchion/crown problems (mine had creaking due to the stanchion loosening up in the crown). When I called WBs, they told me my fork would be back in two weeks or so (we shall see?). I actually dropped it off at their headquaters in Yorba Linda. They referred to me as bro and acted like a bunch of punks. It was not confidents inspiring. Good race fork, but there are better choices for trial riding (eg Judy XC, Manitou SX, and my favorite, Marozochi). I give it four stars due to customer service and recall.
Submitted by
Stephen
a Cross-Country Rider
from Dallas, TX
Date Reviewed: July 15, 1999
Strengths: This fork handles veyy well. It is extremly adjustable, and for its weight, has great ride characteristcs.
Weaknesses: It is not as smooth as the coil spring forks WB makes. MAJOR WEAKNESS: THE WB SERVICE DEPT. STINKS!!! I had to return my fork because the inner tubes wore down on the teflon bushings (that wore away!) The service dept. is inept. They are cocky and don't help. The tell you that are going to call back/do the work/get an estimate/talk to higher powers, but they never do. The fork should never have worn in the 1st place. I would have given this product a 5 rating, but there is no excuse for the fork to break and then for the service people to do nothing. After making prevoise claims on Answer products, I regret not buying one of their forks.
Bike Setup: I use this on a Manatou HT with the air pressure at my own weight + 5psi, and the fastest valves turned almost all the way out.
Overall Rating:
Submitted by
Tim Nielsen
a Racer
from Arlington, VA
Date Reviewed: July 7, 1999
Bottom Line:
Here's another technical advice email I sent last week. Hope it helps ...The Englund Air carts should require no regular maintenance apart from wiping old grease off the shaft and reapplying some of the White Bros. lube (Englund Slick Honey) in a thin coat.One tip about disassembling and reassembling the fork is to make sure the cartridges have pressure in them. This provides resistance for when unscrewing the lower bolts (they are threaded into the cartridge shaft and will spin freely otherwise) and helps you line up the threads when reinstalling.I recently blew out one of the cartridges. It made a strange clicking sound when it was compressed (when removed from the shock). I wasn't able to hear it when it was installed, but the compression/rebound felt like $%&#. I called White Bros. and they gave me the warranty phone number for Englund (Bicycle Parts Pacific (BPP)) and they sent me two brand spanking new cartridges within two days of receiving the old ones! Excellent customer service from both companies, I'd say.Since I wrote the article for MTBR, I've switched back to the #2 rebound adjuster and I run a little less pressure for a softer feel. That combined with running my tires at a higher pressure has yielded the same overall ride-feel but no flats in races for over three months!
Submitted by
Jay
a Cross-Country Rider
from Vancouver
Date Reviewed: June 11, 1999
Strengths: Light Stiff Easy to maintain Easy adjustment Nice looking
Weaknesses: Short on trave Less plush than air/coil Expensive
Bottom Line:
This is the best Air Englund fork on the market today, in my opinion. I also belive it is better than the SID, however, the new SID looks pretty good and is lighter than this fork. It is so easy to tune and maintain. It is a great race fork! The build is high quatlity. I give it five stars for being a supremely good race fork.
Had good luck with the fork for the first four months and then the cartridges began to top out and blow through their damping in both compression and rebound. I called White Bros. but they had no clue (two different occasions). He said that, air forks are bound to leak and you should do whatever is necessary to stop it. Try some teflon tape of loctite. I wasn't happy with the answer so I called BPP who make the total air kit and he said that he could fix my old ones, but he said I was using too much pressure, blah, blah, blah. I only use 175lbs. of pressure and the #2 damper. It was fine for the first four months so I know they are full of it. Anyway, I just sent back the cartridges to be rebuilt, but it seems like a lot of hassle compared to the cust. service that Rock Shox gives me. They would have sent me a new fork by now- not offer to rebuild my old cartridges! I spent $700 on my fork and I expect a heck of a lot better customer service by both companies!
Bike Setup: Litespeed Full susp. w/ Risse rear air/oil shock
Overall Rating:
Submitted by
Pentti
a Weekend Warrior
from perähikiä
Date Reviewed: May 19, 1999
Bottom Line:
This is first suspension fork I've had and I have been VERY pleased with it. It works like a dream. I'ts conciderebly stiffers than the SID and with its adjustability it completely smokes it. Don't make an expensive mistake, buy the SC70UL (or SC72UL).
